Question:

Rupa for Presidential Tax Advisor! J. "A trapeze artist nevers holds his own safety net." Anonymous <snip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -By investing in riskier assets, you can raise returns. If you diversify that risk, your overall risk can be lowered, and you can still have higher returns. The larger your portfolio size, the more effectively you can do this. If this is the strategy that the Bush government is after, they should ask the SS administration to change its investment pattern from low-risk low-return instruments to higher-risk and higher returns. Add some overseas assets into the mix to hedge against the large amount of consumer goods that now come from abroad. And so on. What the plan really is is to reduce benefits in a way that can’t be blamed on the gov. About half of the people who take their money will lose rather than gain. The other half will likely gain. So the half that lose will face reduced benefits, but blame themselves rather than the government. What this *will* do is force the stock market higher by transferring a huge lump of money from "safe" assets into wall street. Not a bad outcome for folks with money there already. Yep, we’re about to hear all about how fucked up Social Security is in the slash and burn way of the Bush administration: destroy something so it can be re-built in a conservative image. But remember this: you are not a rich person. Rich people have advisors, accountants, and others who help manage their money. You will have bureaucrats and Wall Street whores. You do not have the time or the knowledge to take care of this shit. The vast majority of rich people have diversified holdings, like real estate, bonds, offshore bank accounts, and more, so that if one part of their portfolio should fail, they have plenty to fall back on. This is all true. If you’re not rich, buy an index rather than individual stocks. You will never win the lottery. You will never get rich in the stock market, with your Social Security money or with your regular salary. Once you accept these ideas, the path becomes oh-so-shiningly, almost Zen-like simple and clear. The question is, could you *lose* your SS money if you invest it privately? And the answer is, yep. If you enter the market just before it tanks, it could be 3-4 years before it comes back. If you buy individual stocks, they could *never* come back (remember Enron, which was once as tall and handsome as…) Rupa

"The Bible is the most shoplifted book in the United States." That Book of Perfectly Useless Information.  Harper Collins (2004)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Actually, the point I was making was that such individuals cannot easily do that, but the SS Administrations as a whole can. To some extent, because the size of the portfolio is so large that they will move the market each time they buy or sell. Rupa, you have more patience than I do, that’s for sure.  :-) If you want to see what the SSA would do if it had control of private investment of SS funds, just look at CALPERS, the California state pension plan. There are plenty of accusations of political meddling and chicanery. He does seem to want more of a market economy than he’s got. There’s this belief that a market economy is more efficient. It is, if you discount the impact on the losers but count the gains of the winners. Otherwise, it can be less efficient. Ideally, the losers should die so they don’t consume resources. Yup, that’s a market economy all right. Well, some of them would lose their ss money if they got their hands on it. And in traditional American individualistic style, they would blame themselves. I don’t know if the Bush plan is the right one or not. But if Marcy’s against it (in her usual bombastic, idiot way) then I’ll have to take another look  :-)

Actually, if you want whole hog capitalism, social security should not exist. People should save what they want to save. Invest it however they want to invest it. And survive however they’re going to survive. It would be an interesting paradigm. In Singapore, it’s mandatory for a person’s offspring to be responsible for their care, unless the offspring can prove that the person was an abusive parent. Rupa

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – By investing in riskier assets, you can raise returns. If you diversify that risk, your overall risk can be lowered, and you can still have higher returns. The larger your portfolio size, the more effectively you can do this. I am sorry Rupa, because I respect you, do you want the average American who greets people at Wal Mart, or Joe who makes my sandwich at Subway to explain to you your last sentence?

Actually, the point I was making was that such individuals cannot easily do that, but the SS Administrations as a whole can. To some extent, because the size of the portfolio is so large that they will move the market each time they buy or sell. Your average Joe Blow lives paycheck to paycheck and has maxed out credit cards at 22% interest. What Bush wants to do is set up the caste system, like India, have Seniors and those icky poor people sleep and die in the street with no medicaid, medicare, or social security.

He does seem to want more of a market economy than he’s got. There’s this belief that a market economy is more efficient. It is, if you discount the impact on the losers but count the gains of the winners. Otherwise, it can be less efficient. Ideally, the losers should die so they don’t consume resources. If this is the strategy that the Bush government is after, they should ask the SS administration to change its investment pattern from low-risk low-return instruments to higher-risk and higher returns. Add some overseas assets into the mix to hedge against the large amount of consumer goods that now come from abroad. And so on. Joe Blow, the average American, read the last sentence, and thinks you are on drugs. Mescaline?

Norororo, I wasn’t suggesting this strategy to Joe Blow. I was suggesting it to the gov. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What the plan really is is to reduce benefits in a way that can’t be blamed on the gov. About half of the people who take their money will lose rather than gain. The other half will likely gain. So the half that lose will face reduced benefits, but blame themselves rather than the government. What this *will* do is force the stock market higher by transferring a huge lump of money from "safe" assets into wall street. Not a bad outcome for folks with money there already. Bingo, we have a winner, Bush’s fat cats and Wall Street. I challenge you to go to New York, the Bronx, and stop people, ask them about Enron, then ask them about when they should enter the market. Camilla, will tell you her Mom went to the market this morning. There is your average American.

Well, some of them would lose their ss money if they got their hands on it. And in traditional American individualistic style, they would blame themselves. Rupa

Response:

Actually, the point I was making was that such individuals cannot easily do that, but the SS Administrations as a whole can. To some extent, because the size of the portfolio is so large that they will move the market each time they buy or sell.

Rupa, you have more patience than I do, that’s for sure.  :-) If you want to see what the SSA would do if it had control of private investment of SS funds, just look at CALPERS, the California state pension plan. There are plenty of accusations of political meddling and chicanery. He does seem to want more of a market economy than he’s got. There’s this belief that a market economy is more efficient. It is, if you discount the impact on the losers but count the gains of the winners. Otherwise, it can be less efficient. Ideally, the losers should die so they don’t consume resources.

Yup, that’s a market economy all right. Well, some of them would lose their ss money if they got their hands on it. And in traditional American individualistic style, they would blame themselves.

I don’t know if the Bush plan is the right one or not. But if Marcy’s against it (in her usual bombastic, idiot way) then I’ll have to take another look  :-) steve

Response:

Exactlly what I said, American’s, dumber than rocks, YEE HAW , put on the red state channel, I voted for the moral guy, Bush: BlogThis!The Rude Pundit Proudly lowering the level of political discourse 1/11/2005 Taking the Fight To Where They Live, Part 3a: There’s one thing and one thing only that’s driving any support among Americans for privatization of any portion of social security: we’re a bunch of greedy fuckers who actually believe that some day we’ll be rich. Every week, the Rude Pundit watches the pathetic sight of elderly people, day workers, and others head to the convenience store to pay five, ten, twenty dollars in scratch-off and lottery tickets. For the love of fuck, there’s goddamn vending machines with scratch-offs. Once, the Rude Pundit asked Anonymous Decrepit Crone #58 why she spent so much on scratch-offs when she was obviously on a fixed budget. "Because it’s fun," she said, because sometimes she wins ten bucks, and once, a friend of hers won a grand. It was sad, in an Ellen Burstyn in Requiem for a Dream kind of way, because you knew that, until the day she died or was so stroked out she was put in a chamber of horrors state home, ADC #58 was gonna spend those fuckin’ pennies on the lottery, one of the greatest regressive taxes in the history of the country. It’s not so different for most Americans, who are so in denial about economic class that even the poorest backwards-ass country fucks shitting into holes in the floor think they’re middle class. Cheap TVs, cheap cell phones, and cheap fast food are great equalizers, man. You jack that cheap shit into your veins, and, shee-it, you can watch Desperate Housewives while stuffin’ yer face with Wendy’s Triples and talkin’ on yer Nokia camera phone, and, jee-zus, yer doin’ just what nearly everyone else in the country’s doin’. Of course you think you’re middle class, asshole, because no one’s gonna tell themselves they’re poor. That’s fer Paco, the illegal livin’ in his apartment with twenty relatives, who picks your tomatoes for your Triples. You? You’re a goddamned American, and while you can’t afford a Lexus, you know that one day you’re gonna make it big. Except you’re not. You’re gonna live your life doing the same thing, every day, with little raises and constant cuts in your benefits, until the day you’re forced to retire, if you’re lucky, or laid off if you’re not. Then it’s the Wal-Mart for you, motherfucker, either way. Don’t worry, though. Your speculation in Powerball tickets will pay off sooner or later. Gee, if only there was some kind of guaranteed income– oh, wait . . . President Bush and conservatives talk about the "ownership society," where individuals will have more control over their money and more opportunity to, well, own shit, like homes and retirement accounts. To believe in the ownership society is either denial in the extreme or, like WMDs, it’s a convenient lie. David Brooks, who proves the rule that there’s no conservative as pathetic as one who thinks he’s doing good, tried to sell that fuckin’ lie in his column last week. Privatization of Social Security (along with the flogging of the faux "crisis" in the fund) offers the same promise of the scratch-off: do this and you might get rich. (Check out Josh Marshall and Paul Krugman for all the details of this Ponzi scheme.) The notion is that all of a sudden you’re gonna have a bunch of money to invest in the stock market where the miracle of capitalism is gonna enable you to spend your retirement on cruise ship sex tours of Thailand or in a Winnebago on Venice Beach instead of asking fat people if they need a shopping cart. It’s gonna be like the Lotto, except with rising Alpo sales (there’s a safe investment). Yep, we’re about to hear all about how fucked up Social Security is in the slash and burn way of the Bush administration: destroy something so it can be re-built in a conservative image. But remember this: you are not a rich person. Rich people have advisors, accountants, and others who help manage their money. You will have bureaucrats and Wall Street whores. You do not have the time or the knowledge to take care of this shit. The vast majority of rich people have diversified holdings, like real estate, bonds, offshore bank accounts, and more, so that if one part of their portfolio should fail, they have plenty to fall back on. You will have your other 70 percent of Social Security (and other retirement benefits, if corporate mismanagement hasn’t dicked that over already). You can pretend you’re rich or even upper middle class. But you are lying to yourself, and, you know, that’s just pathetic, like a semen-covered feather queen on the men’s room floor in a Boise gay bar. You will never win the lottery. You will never get rich in the stock market, with your Social Security money or with your regular salary. Once you accept these ideas, the path becomes oh-so-shiningly, almost Zen-like simple and clear.

Response:

Exactlly what I said, American’s, dumber than rocks, YEE HAW , put on the red state channel, I voted for the moral guy, Bush:

The move to put SS money into private accounts, on a macro level is simply going for higher risk for a higher return. This could be done with SS funds even without putting it into private accounts. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 1/11/2005 Taking the Fight To Where They Live, Part 3a: There’s one thing and one thing only that’s driving any support among Americans for privatization of any portion of social security: we’re a bunch of greedy fuckers who actually believe that some day we’ll be rich. Every week, the Rude Pundit watches the pathetic sight of elderly people, day workers, and others head to the convenience store to pay five, ten, twenty dollars in scratch-off and lottery tickets. For the love of fuck, there’s goddamn vending machines with scratch-offs. Once, the Rude Pundit asked Anonymous Decrepit Crone #58 why she spent so much on scratch-offs when she was obviously on a fixed budget. "Because it’s fun," she said, because sometimes she wins ten bucks, and once, a friend of hers won a grand.

I disagree with Rude Pundit here. For ADC#58, playing the lottery was entertainment. Cheaper than the movies. What is she supposed to do? Buy healthy veggies with the money until she dies in a chamber of horrors state home? It’s not so different for most Americans, who are so in denial about economic class that even the poorest backwards-ass country fucks shitting into holes in the floor think they’re middle class.

Yo, Rude Pundit, go visit the Rest of the World. Middle-class Americans live better than about 90% of everyone else. You’re a goddamned American, and while you can’t afford a Lexus, you know that one day you’re gonna make it big.

Hope springs eternal. Except you’re not. You’re gonna live your life doing the same thing, every day, with little raises and constant cuts in your benefits, until the day you’re forced to retire, if you’re lucky, or laid off if you’re not. Then it’s the Wal-Mart for you, motherfucker, either way.

And what’s wrong with Walmart? Privatization of Social Security (along with the flogging of the faux "crisis" in the fund) offers the same promise of the

scratch-off: do this and you might get rich. (Check out Josh Marshall and Paul Krugman for all the details of this Ponzi scheme.) The notion is that all of a sudden you’re gonna have a bunch of money to invest in the stock market where the miracle of capitalism is gonna enable you to spend your retirement on cruise ship sex tours of Thailand or in a Winnebago on Venice Beach instead of asking fat people if they need a shopping cart.

By investing in riskier assets, you can raise returns. If you diversify that risk, your overall risk can be lowered, and you can still have higher returns. The larger your portfolio size, the more effectively you can do this. If this is the strategy that the Bush government is after, they should ask the SS administration to change its investment pattern from low-risk low-return instruments to higher-risk and higher returns. Add some overseas assets into the mix to hedge against the large amount of consumer goods that now come from abroad. And so on. What the plan really is is to reduce benefits in a way that can’t be blamed on the gov. About half of the people who take their money will lose rather than gain. The other half will likely gain. So the half that lose will face reduced benefits, but blame themselves rather than the government. What this *will* do is force the stock market higher by transferring a huge lump of money from "safe" assets into wall street. Not a bad outcome for folks with money there already. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yep, we’re about to hear all about how fucked up Social Security is in the slash and burn way of the Bush administration: destroy something so it can be re-built in a conservative image. But remember this: you are not a rich person. Rich people have advisors, accountants, and others who help manage their money. You will have bureaucrats and Wall Street whores. You do not have the time or the knowledge to take care of this shit. The vast majority of rich people have diversified holdings, like real estate, bonds, offshore bank accounts, and more, so that if one part of their portfolio should fail, they have plenty to fall back on.

This is all true. If you’re not rich, buy an index rather than individual stocks. You will never win the lottery. You will never get rich in the stock market, with your Social Security money or with your regular salary. Once you accept these ideas, the path becomes oh-so-shiningly, almost Zen-like simple and clear.

The question is, could you *lose* your SS money if you invest it privately? And the answer is, yep. If you enter the market just before it tanks, it could be 3-4 years before it comes back. If you buy individual stocks, they could *never* come back (remember Enron, which was once as tall and handsome as…) Rupa

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Exactlly what I said, American’s, dumber than rocks, YEE HAW , put on the red state channel, I voted for the moral guy, Bush: The move to put SS money into private accounts, on a macro level is simply going for higher risk for a higher return. This could be done with SS funds even without putting it into private accounts. 1/11/2005 Taking the Fight To Where They Live, Part 3a: There’s one thing and one thing only that’s driving any support among Americans for privatization of any portion of social security: we’re a bunch of greedy fuckers who actually believe that some day we’ll be rich. Every week, the Rude Pundit watches the pathetic sight of elderly people, day workers, and others head to the convenience store to pay five, ten, twenty dollars in scratch-off and lottery tickets. For the love of fuck, there’s goddamn vending machines with scratch-offs. Once, the Rude Pundit asked Anonymous Decrepit Crone #58 why she spent so much on scratch-offs when she was obviously on a fixed budget. "Because it’s fun," she said, because sometimes she wins ten bucks, and once, a friend of hers won a grand. I disagree with Rude Pundit here. For ADC#58, playing the lottery was entertainment. Cheaper than the movies. What is she supposed to do? Buy healthy veggies with the money until she dies in a chamber of horrors state home? It’s not so different for most Americans, who are so in denial about economic class that even the poorest backwards-ass country fucks shitting into holes in the floor think they’re middle class. Yo, Rude Pundit, go visit the Rest of the World. Middle-class Americans live better than about 90% of everyone else. You’re a goddamned American, and while you can’t afford a Lexus, you know that one day you’re gonna make it big. Hope springs eternal. Except you’re not. You’re gonna live your life doing the same thing, every day, with little raises and constant cuts in your benefits, until the day you’re forced to retire, if you’re lucky, or laid off if you’re not. Then it’s the Wal-Mart for you, motherfucker, either way. And what’s wrong with Walmart? Privatization of Social Security (along with the flogging of the faux "crisis" in the fund) offers the same promise of the scratch-off: do this and you might get rich. (Check out Josh Marshall and Paul Krugman for all the details of this Ponzi scheme.) The notion is that all of a sudden you’re gonna have a bunch of money to invest in the stock market where the miracle of capitalism is gonna enable you to spend your retirement on cruise ship sex tours of Thailand or in a Winnebago on Venice Beach instead of asking fat people if they need a shopping cart. By investing in riskier assets, you can raise returns. If you diversify that risk, your overall risk can be lowered, and you can still have higher returns. The larger your portfolio size, the more effectively you can do this.

I am sorry Rupa, because I respect you, do you want the average American who greets people at Wal Mart, or Joe who makes my sandwich at Subway to explain to you your last sentence? They make subhuman wages. The average American doesn’t have assets. You missed the point, your average American doesn’t have a portfolio, doesn’t analize risk, and is as dumb as a rock.Your average Joe Blow lives paycheck to paycheck and has maxed out credit cards at 22% interest. What Bush wants to do is set up the caste system, like India, have Seniors and those icky poor people sleep and die in the street with no medicaid, medicare, or social security. Screw them, if their poor, it’s their fault. Jesus, even Bangalor evolved over Bush. If this is the strategy that the Bush government is after, they should ask the SS administration to change its investment pattern from low-risk low-return instruments to higher-risk and higher returns. Add some overseas assets into the mix to hedge against the large amount of consumer goods that now come from abroad. And so on.

Joe Blow, the average American, read the last sentence, and thinks you are on drugs. Mescaline? What the plan really is is to reduce benefits in a way that can’t be blamed on the gov. About half of the people who take their money will lose rather than gain. The other half will likely gain. So the half that lose will face reduced benefits, but blame themselves rather than the government. What this *will* do is force the stock market higher by transferring a huge lump of money from "safe" assets into wall street. Not a bad outcome for folks with money there already.

Bingo, we have a winner, Bush’s fat cats and Wall Street. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yep, we’re about to hear all about how fucked up Social Security is in the slash and burn way of the Bush administration: destroy something so it can be re-built in a conservative image. But remember this: you are not a rich person. Rich people have advisors, accountants, and others who help manage their money. You will have bureaucrats and Wall Street whores. You do not have the time or the knowledge to take care of this shit. The vast majority of rich people have diversified holdings, like real estate, bonds, offshore bank accounts, and more, so that if one part of their portfolio should fail, they have plenty to fall back on. This is all true. If you’re not rich, buy an index rather than individual stocks.

Rupa, give me a break, your Wal Mart greeter AKA Joe Blow, knows what an index is, Are you in the Sun? You will never win the lottery. You will never get rich in the stock market, with your Social Security money or with your regular salary. Once you accept these ideas, the path becomes oh-so-shiningly, almost Zen-like simple and clear. The question is, could you *lose* your SS money if you invest it privately? And the answer is, yep. If you enter the market just before it tanks, it could be 3-4 years before it comes back. If you buy individual stocks, they could *never* come back (remember Enron, which was once as tall and handsome as…)

I challenge you to go to New York, the Bronx, and stop people, ask them about Enron, then ask them about when they should enter the market. Camilla, will tell you her Mom went to the market this morning. There is your average American. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Rupa

Response:

Question:

So far I have not received any offer yet.  I guess I am a little anxious and impatient.  But I can’t stop wondering where else should I look for jobs if I were not to be selected by the firms I interviewed with.  Can any experienced accouting professional give me any advice? Thanks in advance. PS: I am in NYC metro area. Simon

Have you checked the Classified ads in the NY Times?   I saw quite a few entry-level accounting jobs in the Washington Post yesterday. Also- many firms now advertise online (monster.com, hotjobs.com, etc.). I’d also suggest finding the accounting employment agencies in your area and getting in touch with them (like Robert Half, Accountemps, etc.).   They can forward your resume to any companies that are looking for someone with your qualifications. Finally- don’t be paranoid about having a job when you graduate.  When I graduated (back in June 1983), the job market was terrible (very few of my fellow students had jobs when they graduated).   I continued to work at my part-time job until I found my first full-time accounting job in September.  

Response:

I am a accounting student who will graduate in this coming December.  I have been searching for entry level accounting positions.  I applied through school to various accounting firms and got a few interviews.  I had most of my interviews during the last two weeks.  So far I have not received any offer yet.  I guess I am a little anxious and impatient.  But I can’t stop wondering where else should I look for jobs if I were not to be selected by the firms I interviewed with.  Can any experienced accouting professional give me any advice? Thanks in advance.

If you haven’t yet, join the NY Society of CPA’s.  Attend some of their local chapter meetings so you can mingle and network a bit.  See if the Society has a jobs database (Georgia does) where prospective employers can find qualified applicants. Ask every contact person you know to keep an eye and ear out for you.  The best jobs come your way by referral, not the paper. — Paul A. Thomas, CPA Athens, Georgia taxman at negia.net

Response:

Hello, I am a accounting student who will graduate in this coming December.  I have been searching for entry level accounting positions.  I applied through school to various accounting firms and got a few interviews.  I had most of my interviews during the last two weeks.  So far I have not received any offer yet.  I guess I am a little anxious and impatient.  But I can’t stop wondering where else should I look for jobs if I were not to be selected by the firms I interviewed with.  Can any experienced accouting professional give me any advice? Thanks in advance. PS: I am in NYC metro area. Simon

Response:

Question:

I am buying a single family home as an investment property and will be renting it out.  I also own my own home in where I am now living and will remain.  I am thinking about forming a one-person LLC and taking title to the property in the name of the LLC.  My thinking in using an LLC would be to place a limit my personal liability while keeping essentially the same tax advantages that personal ownership would afford me. I’d be interested in hearing any general thoughts or ideas about this that anyone could offer about this approach.  Seems like there are both accounting and legal issues involved.  However, I think that I understand most of the legal issues.  I am just not sure if any of this makes sense or is worthwhile from an accounting point of view. A final thought has to do with how to go about finding a local accountant to ask about these types of questions.  I expect to buy additional properties in the future and will want and need accounting advice and to do my tax returns, etc.  I do my own tax returns now because they are simple, but will want an accountant to do my taxes starting this year since I am buying an investment property.  I read in a book somewhere that it might be a plus if I could find an accountant who has similar real estate investments of his/her own, or at least has special expertise and experience in this area. But maybe that was just mumbo jumbo book talk.  Also, I don’t have any idea how I’d go about finding an accountant with special expertise and experience in real estate investing accounting and tax issues. I am in New Jersey (near Philadelphia, PA) in case that matters. Thanks for any thoughts or ideas on this topic.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am buying a single family home as an investment property and will be renting it out.  I also own my own home in where I am now living and will remain.  I am thinking about forming a one-person LLC and taking title to the property in the name of the LLC.  My thinking in using an LLC would be to place a limit my personal liability while keeping essentially the same tax advantages that personal ownership would afford me. I’d be interested in hearing any general thoughts or ideas about this that anyone could offer about this approach.  Seems like there are both accounting and legal issues involved.  However, I think that I understand most of the legal issues.  I am just not sure if any of this makes sense or is worthwhile from an accounting point of view. A final thought has to do with how to go about finding a local accountant to ask about these types of questions.  I expect to buy additional properties in the future and will want and need accounting advice and to do my tax returns, etc.  I do my own tax returns now because they are simple, but will want an accountant to do my taxes starting this year since I am buying an investment property.  I read in a book somewhere that it might be a plus if I could find an accountant who has similar real estate investments of his/her own, or at least has special expertise and experience in this area. But maybe that was just mumbo jumbo book talk.  Also, I don’t have any idea how I’d go about finding an accountant with special expertise and experience in real estate investing accounting and tax issues. I am in New Jersey (near Philadelphia, PA) in case that matters. Thanks for any thoughts or ideas on this topic.

I don’t think there are any special tax advantages in using the llc as a holding company for real estate but it’s usually done for legal reasons, especially if you have other people doing maintenance, collections etc.  You should ask friends/co-workers in the local RE rental industry for referrals for accountants & other professional services but you could also familiarize yourself with tax real estate issues by reviewing last years "J. K. Lasser" or "Ernst & Young" tax guides at bookstores and libraries.  Actually many people start out with just one property doing the work themselves (taxes and maintenance) to see what it takes and how much work it is.  If you are not in the RE business you should definitely research this "investment" !

Response:

I am buying a single family home as an investment property and will be renting it out.  I also own my own home in where I am now living and will remain.  I am thinking about forming a one-person LLC and taking title to the property in the name of the LLC.  My thinking in using an LLC would be to place a limit my personal liability while keeping essentially the same tax advantages that personal ownership would afford me.

For Federal, there’s not any tax advantage by forming a sole-LLC for rental property.  Legal issues would probably vary by state according to their laws, but in general, I doubt the lender would let you off the hook, and you’d for sure be on the hook for property that you maintained personally and/or were otherwise responsible for maintaining.  An LLC might help for liability issues on property where you were just a passive investor (where you had a management company doing everything), but again, state laws prevail and vary widely. The costs of maintaining the LLC  may out weigh the small liability benefits issue (seeing as you will have some kind of insurance in any event).  Check to see what the total costs will be for your state/location and then you can decide. LLC’s are great for multiple owners, and can be useful for multiple business activities (the rental LLC, the retail LLC, the professional services LLC, etc). — Paul A. Thomas, CPA taxman at negia.net

Response:

The single-member LLC is a disregarded entity for federal tax purposes and therefore has the advantage of not being required to file a seperate tax return – the results of operations are reported on your schedule C, just like a sole proprietorship.  There is no balance sheet required for federal tax reporting. The only disadvantage I can think of would be that the LLC would not be able to take advantage of the capital gain exclusion that applies to sale of personal residences.  In other words, if you titled the rental house in your name, and for some reason the house appreciated greatly in value, you could convert the house from rental to your personal residence (seperate tax issue here – recapture) and live in it for 24 months and then sell it at a tax-free gain.  The LLC, by definition, cannot have a personal residence, and cannot benefit from this exclusion.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am buying a single family home as an investment property and will be renting it out.  I also own my own home in where I am now living and will remain.  I am thinking about forming a one-person LLC and taking title to the property in the name of the LLC.  My thinking in using an LLC would be to place a limit my personal liability while keeping essentially the same tax advantages that personal ownership would afford me. I’d be interested in hearing any general thoughts or ideas about this that anyone could offer about this approach.  Seems like there are both accounting and legal issues involved.  However, I think that I understand most of the legal issues.  I am just not sure if any of this makes sense or is worthwhile from an accounting point of view. A final thought has to do with how to go about finding a local accountant to ask about these types of questions.  I expect to buy additional properties in the future and will want and need accounting advice and to do my tax returns, etc.  I do my own tax returns now because they are simple, but will want an accountant to do my taxes starting this year since I am buying an investment property.  I read in a book somewhere that it might be a plus if I could find an accountant who has similar real estate investments of his/her own, or at least has special expertise and experience in this area. But maybe that was just mumbo jumbo book talk.  Also, I don’t have any idea how I’d go about finding an accountant with special expertise and experience in real estate investing accounting and tax issues. I am in New Jersey (near Philadelphia, PA) in case that matters. Thanks for any thoughts or ideas on this topic.

Response:

You need to consult your attorney as well…depending on the state, rules/benefits/disadvantages will be different.  It may not provide nearly the isolation you may think if it’s a single-person-backed LLC…

Response:

Thanks for all of the feedback and thoughts so far. From an accounting point of view, it appears that if I use an LLC the tax issues will be essentially the same as they would if I owned the property as a sole proprietor (with the exception of the personal residence capital gains exemption assuming that I later moved into the property).

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am buying a single family home as an investment property and will be renting it out.  I also own my own home in where I am now living and will remain.  I am thinking about forming a one-person LLC and taking title to the property in the name of the LLC.  My thinking in using an LLC would be to place a limit my personal liability while keeping essentially the same tax advantages that personal ownership would afford me. I’d be interested in hearing any general thoughts or ideas about this that anyone could offer about this approach.  Seems like there are both accounting and legal issues involved.  However, I think that I understand most of the legal issues.  I am just not sure if any of this makes sense or is worthwhile from an accounting point of view. A final thought has to do with how to go about finding a local accountant to ask about these types of questions.  I expect to buy additional properties in the future and will want and need accounting advice and to do my tax returns, etc.  I do my own tax returns now because they are simple, but will want an accountant to do my taxes starting this year since I am buying an investment property.  I read in a book somewhere that it might be a plus if I could find an accountant who has similar real estate investments of his/her own, or at least has special expertise and experience in this area. But maybe that was just mumbo jumbo book talk.  Also, I don’t have any idea how I’d go about finding an accountant with special expertise and experience in real estate investing accounting and tax issues. I am in New Jersey (near Philadelphia, PA) in case that matters. Thanks for any thoughts or ideas on this topic.

Response:

Another thing to consider… In the event of any litigation (commonly Landlord/Tenant) you "must" have an attorney represent the LLC.  If you own the rental as a sole proprietor, you "could" represent yourself.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You need to consult your attorney as well…depending on the state, rules/benefits/disadvantages will be different.  It may not provide nearly the isolation you may think if it’s a single-person-backed LLC…

Response:

Good point.  Thanks again. After considering everything, I’ve decided that for this property I’m just going to start out by: — taking title in my own name (instead of a LLC) — getting tons of insurance — getting a high-limit umbrella liability coverage policy — making sure all repairs and safety issues are handled properly — looking for an accountant to help me with taxes, etc. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Another thing to consider… In the event of any litigation (commonly Landlord/Tenant) you "must" have an attorney represent the LLC.  If you own the rental as a sole proprietor, you "could" represent yourself. You need to consult your attorney as well…depending on the state, rules/benefits/disadvantages will be different.  It may not provide nearly the isolation you may think if it’s a single-person-backed LLC…

Response:

Another thing to consider… In the event of any litigation (commonly Landlord/Tenant) you "must" have an attorney represent the LLC.  If you own the rental as a sole proprietor, you "could" represent yourself.

Which, would almost certainly be a <very poor idea…

Response:

Question:

| The Parks Board has refused to meet with the group in an open | question-and-answer session.  Instead, as Arjun passed along, they are | planning on holding a meeting tomorrow (June 19) and making a decision | at this time. Forwarded from a private mailing list: ===== From Greg Brush, Vice President of IndyFeral:

Thursday June 19, 2003 Hi all! Forgive me if I’m not very eloquent and don’t have the energy to give you a full accounting of today’s meeting of the Richmond Parks Board meeting right now. It was a very disheartening day. Here’s the gist: It was business as usual for the Richmond Parks Board. As if it were already scripted, the parks board unanimously, and without hesitation, approved two measures today. The first being a new Parks Department policy on nuisance animals; the second being their short-term solution for dealing with the current free-roaming cat "problem". Although their proposal included language suggesting that the parks board would remove and relocate the cats according to humane protocols and try to work in partnership with interested local groups like HELP the Animals, this suggestion brought groans from the small, packed assembly room. Considering that the parks department has defiantly ignored all appeals from HELP the Animals and the 350 concerned citizens who signed petitions in the past week, there is little belief that the Parks Department will do anything but dictate terms for participation in the process and those who will not abide by them will be dismissed and ignored. The last, and most important element of the Parks Department short-term plan indicated that cats which could not be relocated will be taken to the county shelter. Who determines if cats can be relocated? As you might guess, it’s apparently based on the Parks Department’s ability to find relocation sites. There were threats of prosecution by the City Attorney for anyone who interferes in the Parks Department plan. The City Attorney made an appearance to briefly clarify a minor point in the Parks Department plan, but seemed to be there primarily for reinforcement. Most in attendance today feared, but expected this decision. Since the parks department was discovered preparing fliers some weeks ago, warning adjacent home owners of their plans, their stance has been consistent — they want the cats out. Regardless, HELP the Animals supporters were devastated. The small group outside the administration office were sad and angry. They felt that those who were in place to represent their interests had ignored and betrayed that trust. No amount of factual support presented by HELP the Animals would sway the Parks Board. The comprehensive counter-proposal put forth by HELP the Animals at the beginning of the meeting didn’t even warrant additional study time by the board. The mayor’s response to the amazing outpouring of phone calls and e-mails was irritation. She feels that it’s not her problem. According to her, it’s the Parks Board’s decision. When her office was deluged with calls and e-mails on Wednesday, the phones were apparently taken off the hook. The story hasn’t ended yet. The people in Richmond who care for and about the cats are still working hard to see that somehow the cats are relocated properly. Public support for the cats may still have an impact on the situation. As those of you practicing TNR know, trapping cats isn’t as easy as it sounds. When I get a chance to regroup and recover, I will be giving you all more information to use to bring pressure to bear on Richmond officials. If anyone knows of suitable relocation sites within central Indiana or 317-258-7469 (cell) The concerned people of Richmond, and I, thank all of you who have expressed your concern and disgust at this amazing display of ignorance and indifference. We hope that continued pressure will give the City of Richmond, Indiana reasons to reconsider this plan. Sincerely, Greg Greg Brush Vice President, IndyFeral Inc. http://www.indyferal.org A resource for caretakers & friends of stray & feral cats in central Indiana IndyFeral Inc. P.O. Box 30054 Indianapolis, IN 46230 (317) 596-2300 =====

Response:

| The Parks Board has refused to meet with the group in an open | question-and-answer session.  Instead, as Arjun passed along, they are | planning on holding a meeting tomorrow (June 19) and making a decision | at this time. | | If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is | the time to contact the city, today. | | City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 Other phone numbers:  Mayor Shelly Miller: 765-983-7208  Mr. Stan Lambert, Director of Parks & Recreation: 765-983-7275

Response:

| If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is | the time to contact the city, today. | | City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 | | Thank you. Forwarded from a private mailing list: ===== Thank you everyone for all your great work! The Richmond phone lines and email have been flooded with your letters and calls, so much in fact, that here are their fax numbers if you can’t get through or have another thought to add: to fax Mayor Shelley Miller: 765-983-7212 to fax Stan Lambert, Director of Parks &Recreation: 765-983-7279 Now they’re at least telling people they intend to relocate, not kill, the cats, so we’re making progress. They know they’re being watched, too, which is so important. The main argument they’re making for removing the cats is that the cats are hunting wildlife in the park. While this is undoubtedly true to some extent, it’s also true that the TNR program has reduced the number of cats in the park and so has reduced wildlife predation. The Richmond officials are mistaken if they believe they can completely eliminate the impact on wildlife by trying to remove all the cats. History has shown time and time again that when you create a vacuum by removing a feral colony, new unneutered cats take their place from having been newly abandoned, not trapped, or migrated from neighboring feral colonies. These new cats rapidly reproduce as long as any food source remains and the situation ends up worse, not better, for wildlife. The only effective solution is a neutered, managed feral colony with a slowly declining population. What will happen otherwise in Glen Miller Park is an endless cycle of trapping and removing cats, who are then replaced by new cats who overbreed, then trapping, then new cats, etc. The futility and expense of this approach is why so many communities are now turning to TNR. What a shame if one community that could serve as a shining example and a model to others tries to turn back the clock and go back to failed ways! Let’s keep trying to help them get it right. =====

Response:

I emailed the mayor this afternoon. Keep us posted. Gail

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is | the time to contact the city, today. | | City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 | | Thank you. Forwarded from a private mailing list: ===== Thank you everyone for all your great work! The Richmond phone lines and email have been flooded with your letters and calls, so much in fact, that here are their fax numbers if you can’t get through or have another thought to add: to fax Mayor Shelley Miller: 765-983-7212 to fax Stan Lambert, Director of Parks &Recreation: 765-983-7279 Now they’re at least telling people they intend to relocate, not kill, the cats, so we’re making progress. They know they’re being watched, too, which is so important. The main argument they’re making for removing the cats is that the cats are hunting wildlife in the park. While this is undoubtedly true to some extent, it’s also true that the TNR program has reduced the number of cats in the park and so has reduced wildlife predation. The Richmond officials are mistaken if they believe they can completely eliminate the impact on wildlife by trying to remove all the cats. History has shown time and time again that when you create a vacuum by removing a feral colony, new unneutered cats take their place from having been newly abandoned, not trapped, or migrated from neighboring feral colonies. These new cats rapidly reproduce as long as any food source remains and the situation ends up worse, not better, for wildlife. The only effective solution is a neutered, managed feral colony with a slowly declining population. What will happen otherwise in Glen Miller Park is an endless cycle of trapping and removing cats, who are then replaced by new cats who overbreed, then trapping, then new cats, etc. The futility and expense of this approach is why so many communities are now turning to TNR. What a shame if one community that could serve as a shining example and a model to others tries to turn back the clock and go back to failed ways! Let’s keep trying to help them get it right. =====

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is | the time to contact the city, today. | | City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 | | Thank you. Forwarded from a private mailing list: ===== Thank you everyone for all your great work! The Richmond phone lines and email have been flooded with your letters and calls, so much in fact, that here are their fax numbers if you can’t get through or have another thought to add:

This is good. I took the tack that the case is now *well known* on the Internet and is impacting their city image as being an inhumane place in our nation. Sometimes, that is something that city officials value more than anything else. I’m glad to hear letters, faxes and calls are having an effect. Karen

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Friends, Thanks to Arjun Ray for fowarding the letter from Greg from IndyFerals.  Here is some more information about what has been happening and what is going on. After the horrible editorial mentioned in my last update, two of the members of the group caring for these cats were allowed a guest editorial, which was excellent.  They educated the staff of newspaper about TNR (of which the writer knew absolutely nothing).  Another article has run since then, which was more balanced and fair.  In it, however, the Parks Superintendent was suggesting that he was not going to just leave the cats alone.  Relocating them was mentioned, however. The group has been working on getting local support.  They have appeared on the radio in the past few days.  They have gotten in touch with the IndyFerals group for help.  They also have been attempting to find an attorney to help them, but none so far seem willing to touch this case.  It is possible they may be able to get a preliminary injunction to stop all action until the issue is resolved. The Parks Board has refused to meet with the group in an open question-and-answer session.  Instead, as Arjun passed along, they are planning on holding a meeting tomorrow (June 19) and making a decision at this time. If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is the time to contact the city, today. City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 Thank you. On behalf of the cats, Ginger-lyn

I sent letters to the mayor and city council president some time ago, but will send an e-mail tonight.  I sincerely hope it does some good! —— Krista

Response:

I emailed the mayor, too. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I emailed the mayor this afternoon. Keep us posted. Gail | If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is | the time to contact the city, today. | | City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 | | Thank you. Forwarded from a private mailing list: ===== Thank you everyone for all your great work! The Richmond phone lines and email have been flooded with your letters and calls, so much in fact, that here are their fax numbers if you can’t get through or have another thought to add: to fax Mayor Shelley Miller: 765-983-7212 to fax Stan Lambert, Director of Parks &Recreation: 765-983-7279 Now they’re at least telling people they intend to relocate, not kill, the cats, so we’re making progress. They know they’re being watched, too, which is so important. The main argument they’re making for removing the cats is that the cats are hunting wildlife in the park. While this is undoubtedly true to some extent, it’s also true that the TNR program has reduced the number of cats in the park and so has reduced wildlife predation. The Richmond officials are mistaken if they believe they can completely eliminate the impact on wildlife by trying to remove all the cats. History has shown time and time again that when you create a vacuum by removing a feral colony, new unneutered cats take their place from having been newly abandoned, not trapped, or migrated from neighboring feral colonies. These new cats rapidly reproduce as long as any food source remains and the situation ends up worse, not better, for wildlife. The only effective solution is a neutered, managed feral colony with a slowly declining population. What will happen otherwise in Glen Miller Park is an endless cycle of trapping and removing cats, who are then replaced by new cats who overbreed, then trapping, then new cats, etc. The futility and expense of this approach is why so many communities are now turning to TNR. What a shame if one community that could serve as a shining example and a model to others tries to turn back the clock and go back to failed ways! Let’s keep trying to help them get it right. =====

Response:

Dear Friends, Thanks to Arjun Ray for fowarding the letter from Greg from IndyFerals.  Here is some more information about what has been happening and what is going on. After the horrible editorial mentioned in my last update, two of the members of the group caring for these cats were allowed a guest editorial, which was excellent.  They educated the staff of newspaper about TNR (of which the writer knew absolutely nothing).  Another article has run since then, which was more balanced and fair.  In it, however, the Parks Superintendent was suggesting that he was not going to just leave the cats alone.  Relocating them was mentioned, however. The group has been working on getting local support.  They have appeared on the radio in the past few days.  They have gotten in touch with the IndyFerals group for help.  They also have been attempting to find an attorney to help them, but none so far seem willing to touch this case.  It is possible they may be able to get a preliminary injunction to stop all action until the issue is resolved. The Parks Board has refused to meet with the group in an open question-and-answer session.  Instead, as Arjun passed along, they are planning on holding a meeting tomorrow (June 19) and making a decision at this time. If you have not yet contacted them — or even if you have — this is the time to contact the city, today. City of Richmond’s phone number is (765) 983-7200 Thank you. On behalf of the cats, Ginger-lyn

Response:

Question:

I’ll bet you were an altar boy when you were young. Did jesus save you when he came in your ass or your mouth? hehehe Oh, and those "traits" you speak of? They were written my men who wanted power over the sheep that were all too willing to follow them. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV

Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Okay, Life’s a Bitch. So fucking what? Get over it. And, get on with it. Or, get the fuck out!

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV You want me to give up fornication for longsuffering? Are you an idiot? T9W

He is the equivelent of a babbling creek. Only, a creek actually has something worth babbling about. Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Okay, Life’s a Bitch. So fucking what? Get over it. And, get on with it. Or, get the fuck out!

Response:

Because it was all made up by the other apostles for the sole purpose of enhancing the importance their own roles in the affair. Importance which otherwise would have counted for naught. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not even the writers of the gospels were eyewitnesses.  Nothing in the Bible regarding the life and teachings of Jesus is an eyewitness accounting, as it was all written at least a generation or two after the fact, and Paul’s writings came first. Paul’s epistles are by far the oldest and are possibly the derived from the originals, yet he never mentions the virgin birth, the Sermon on the Mount, the Lord’s Prayer, the Parable of the Prodigal Sopn, the Good Samaritan or any of the miracles that have become intrinsic parts of Christian beliefs. Vas.

Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Okay, Life’s a Bitch. So fucking what? Get over it. And, get on with it. Or, get the fuck out!

Response:

Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Your opinion matters! It just doesn’t matter to me.

i said that to an irc accquaintance once except i said, "i respect your right to have an opinion, but i don’t respect your opinion." i’m not sure which wording i like best.. i think it would have to be dependant on the situation.. peace, bogsnarth (currently concieving a song called "Jesus Loves Me.. too hard")

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV Well, no, acutally, I quite enjoy fornication, lewdness, sorcery, drunkenness and revelries, to be

honest.  Moreover, my house is full of idols that all get their turn at offerings at appropriate times. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And now, a little something for you xtians who post to non-xtian newsgroups hoping to "save" us: Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall. (Proverbs 16:18) And how about Don’t you look at me so smug and say I’m going bad. Who are you to judge me, and the life I live? I know that I’m not perfect And that I don’t claim to be So, before you point your finger Make sure your hands are clean. Bob Marley (Romans 14:4) You know, I suspect that most of the individuals who post such stuff are very young, have had a

recent conversion, and are enthusiastic about "spreading the word" to the rest of the world.  But think about this for a while; we’ve already heard it, and are not interested in hearing it any more. Wait ’til you’re a little older and have lived life before you start trying to tell others how they should live. Old Wolf

i agree except that i don’t think they have to be young.. that whole "being reborn" thing tends to make some people function on the verbal level of a child… like when my friends and i used to have philosophical discussions on the play ground.. "god is up and the devil is down.. hell is down there.. *points* you go there if you’re bad.. heaven is up there *points* that’s where gramma and sparky are…" but to be fair, i think the following song has a good point about "those types" as well: "Happy Guy" by NOFX (a band who has a self-descriptive album title, "white trash, two heebs, and a bean." the members of the band are 1 long haired white guy, 2 jewish guys from the suburbs, and a mexican. put that in your PC(p) pipe and smoke it..) he’s just a man getting through life the best he can he’s not a scientist, he programs a computer before that he sold cars to pay a student loan now he recieves pity from his family — his friends say how could he turn his back on reason worshipping a god finding truth through fear and mind control he’s just a man trying to explain how he found the word of god could make life seem less insane so he shares what he’s read, what he understands, it makes sense to him, it makes perfect sense to him, in fact he’s never seen so clearly turned his back on free will — has he lost his mind? he’d rather kneel down than take charge of his life and he knows what people think, but it doesn’t sway him he can read the writing on the wall cause he knows how people treat, how they treat eachother a sacrifice to benefit the all don’t try to judge him, his theologian ideals his hopes may be false but his happiness is real don’t try to judge him, he’s just a man. — foot note: NOFX is a band that’s very easy to interpret as sarcastic.. what happens when you try to interpret them as earnest and forthright? peace, bogsnarth ( m/ punk rawk #50926923)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV

You want me to give up fornication for longsuffering? Are you an idiot? T9W

Response:

Not even the writers of the gospels were eyewitnesses.  Nothing in the Bible regarding the life and teachings of Jesus is an eyewitness accounting, as it was all written at least a generation or two after the fact, and Paul’s writings came first.

Paul’s epistles are by far the oldest and are possibly the derived from the originals, yet he never mentions the virgin birth, the Sermon on the Mount, the Lord’s Prayer, the Parable of the Prodigal Sopn, the Good Samaritan or any of the miracles that have become intrinsic parts of Christian beliefs. Vas.

Response:

Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god."

"Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –                             Re: Jesus Loves You!   Organization: http://groups.google.com/   Newsgroups:          [2] alt.pagan,          [3] alt.religion.wicca,          [4] alt.discordia   Followup to: [5] newsgroup(s)   References: Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god."

***ahhh what the Bible and your interp of it tells you ..you mean? "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]?

***longsuffering seems ridiculous and hey…throw in pleasure and I’m in. *NKJV

IN my opinion Brenda

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." "Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*). These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*). Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]? *NKJV

Well, no, acutally, I quite enjoy fornication, lewdness, sorcery, drunkenness and revelries, to be honest.  Moreover, my house is full of idols that all get their turn at offerings at appropriate times. And now, a little something for you xtians who post to non-xtian newsgroups hoping to "save" us: Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall. (Proverbs 16:18) And how about Don’t you look at me so smug and say I’m going bad. Who are you to judge me, and the life I live? I know that I’m not perfect And that I don’t claim to be So, before you point your finger Make sure your hands are clean. Bob Marley (Romans 14:4) You know, I suspect that most of the individuals who post such stuff are very young, have had a recent conversion, and are enthusiastic about "spreading the word" to the rest of the world.  But think about this for a while; we’ve already heard it, and are not interested in hearing it any more.  Wait ’til you’re a little older and have lived life before you start trying to tell others how they should live. Old Wolf

Response:

"Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders,  drunkenness, revelries, and the like;" (Gal 5:19-21*).

Good one, ’cause I can name countless Christians of my acquaintance who still indulge in just about all of these. "…character traits that God saves us from" indeed. These are the traits His Holy Spirit inspires us with: "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control" (Gal 5:22,23*).

And I could list many pagans and non-Christians of many religions of my acquaintaince who embody all of these. Wouldn’t you prefer the fruit of the Spirit [His will]?

"His will", huh?  What about humans having free will?  Do we or don’t we choose our own paths through this world?  Is everything that happens all part of "God’s great plan for mankind", in which case I know quite a few people who would like to have a nice long discussion with him about the events of the morning of September 11, 2001, or do humans make their own decisions and mistakes without any supernatural interference?  I’ve been waiting for a Christian to give me a straight answer to that one; the few I’ve had this discussion with recently never answered it but danced around it quite nicely. Blessings, Songweaver

Response:

So, when you go to bed at night, do you dream of jesus fucking you in the ass, telling you since you let him cum in your ass you’re now saved? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The disciples were not instructed to ask permission unless they were caught. "Borrowing" something without asking permission first is theft. I know your not gonna like my response…but here goes: "For every beast of the forest is Mine [God's], And the cattle on a thousand hills" (Ps 50:10). God created everything, so the donkey belongs to Him. They didn’t record it. Matthew did. That’s what the "Matt" means in the reference. Matthew recorded the soldiers’ lie about Christ’s disciples stealing His body. According to you, Josephus was not alive. What were his references other than the bible? Those who witnessed the resurrection and believe in Christ incorperated the story into books that became known as the NT.  The soldiers who witnessed the resurrection created helped spread the lie so that history also claims He never rose from the dead.  Josephus, though neither an eyewitness nor a Christian, believed from his open-minded style of recording history that Jesus had indeed been raised from the dead.

Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Your opinion matters! It just doesn’t matter to me.

Response:

Thanks for sharing that with me.  I never heard that theory before. I’ll check it out.

Response:

Most people already do the will of "god." They live in fear and ignorance, and occassionally in a so-called "enlightened" state…all which is the prime objective of "god" so as to keep them in nearly unbreakable bonds of slavery and darkness. That is the will of "god." – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He also sent his disciples to steal for him. The owner of the donkey would have lent it if he were there when His disciples borrowed it. I know from personal experience to turn of the electric before replacing an outlet. What is your point. My point is that it is possible to overcome the lusts of the flesh that have a tendency to pull our desires away from doing the will of God.  People can learn to enjoy a more healthful style of living, as Christ had planned for people. Jesus doesn’t want anything, he’s fucking dead, and all your "he’s  coming back" won’t change that. Would His disciples die for the Gospel of Jesus if they believed He was still in the tomb? Believing he is not in the tomb is irrelevant. History records his death, but nobody but his friends noticed his "resurrection". The other people to record Jesus’ ressurection were the soldiers who guarded the tomb.  They might have been killed for not keeping watch over the tomb.  History records their way out of death: "Now while they were going, behold, some of the guard came into the city and reported to the chief priests all the things that had happened. 12 When they had assembled with the elders and consulted together, they gave a large sum of money to the soldiers, 13 saying, "Tell them, ‘His disciples came at night and stole Him away while we slept.’ 14 And if this comes to the governor’s ears, we will appease him and make you secure." 15 So they took the money and did as they were instructed; and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day." Matt 28:11-15  Josephus, a Jewish historian was hated by his fellow Jews for providing an accurate account of Christ’s resurrection. Prove it accurate, please. "Now there was about this time, Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was the Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again at the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him are not extinct at this day" (Antiquities of the Jews book 18 chapter 3, William Whiston translation, The Complete Works of Josephus, Kregal Publications, Grand Rapids Michigan, 1981, p. 379). http://www.creatingfutures.net/resurrection.html God’s gift is your choice to accept.  Think carefully when choosing what you wish to do with your life. Then why do you want to shove it down our throats? Make you a deal, if I want it, I’ll come to alt.christian.sheeple, okay? I’m so happy about what Jesus has done for us that I can’t contain this blessed truth to myself.

Gargoyle – _~~~~~ Your opinion matters! It just doesn’t matter to me.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Now there was about this time, Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was the Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again at the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him are not extinct at this day" (Antiquities of the Jews book 18 chapter 3, William Whiston translation, The Complete Works of Josephus, Kregal Publications, Grand Rapids Michigan, 1981, p. 379). According to you, Josephus was not alive. What were his references other than the bible?

Not even the writers of the gospels were eyewitnesses.  Nothing in the Bible regarding the life and teachings of Jesus is an eyewitness accounting, as it was all written at least a generation or two after the fact, and Paul’s writings came first. The only evidence anyone has that a person called Jesus ever lived is the Bible, and that’s not even a complete volume of all the writings of the original people who called themselves "Christian".  The Gnostic writings were completely left out when the "official" Bible was put together, and they approach it in a very different manner, to the point that other "Christians" called them heretics and killed them. Nice… Blessings, Songweaver

Response:

The disciples were not instructed to ask permission unless they were caught. "Borrowing" something without asking permission first is theft.

I know your not gonna like my response…but here goes: "For every beast of the forest is Mine [God's], And the cattle on a thousand hills" (Ps 50:10). God created everything, so the donkey belongs to Him. They didn’t record it. Matthew did. That’s what the "Matt" means in the reference.

Matthew recorded the soldiers’ lie about Christ’s disciples stealing His body. According to you, Josephus was not alive. What were his references other than the bible?

Those who witnessed the resurrection and believe in Christ incorperated the story into books that became known as the NT.  The soldiers who witnessed the resurrection created helped spread the lie so that history also claims He never rose from the dead.  Josephus, though neither an eyewitness nor a Christian, believed from his open-minded style of recording history that Jesus had indeed been raised from the dead.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The disciples were not instructed to ask permission unless they were caught. "Borrowing" something without asking permission first is theft. I know your not gonna like my response…but here goes: "For every beast of the forest is Mine [God's], And the cattle on a thousand hills" (Ps 50:10). God created everything, so the donkey belongs to Him. They didn’t record it. Matthew did. That’s what the "Matt" means in the reference. Matthew recorded the soldiers’ lie about Christ’s disciples stealing His body. According to you, Josephus was not alive. What were his references other than the bible? Those who witnessed the resurrection and believe in Christ incorperated the story into books that became known as the NT.  The soldiers who witnessed the resurrection created helped spread the lie so that history also claims He never rose from the dead.  Josephus, though neither an eyewitness nor a Christian, believed from his open-minded style of recording history that Jesus had indeed been raised from the dead.

*I hate to do this to you because i admire you for continuing to "witness" your faith in a pagan NG. But, it is widely accepted amongst NT Scholars that the references to Jesus in Jospehus were added at a much later date by Christian scribes.

Response:

He also sent his disciples to steal for him.

The owner of the donkey would have lent it if he were there when His disciples borrowed it. I know from personal experience to turn of the electric before replacing an outlet. What is your point.

My point is that it is possible to overcome the lusts of the flesh that have a tendency to pull our desires away from doing the will of God.  People can learn to enjoy a more healthful style of living, as Christ had planned for people. Jesus doesn’t want anything, he’s fucking dead, and all your "he’s  coming back" won’t change that. Would His disciples die for the Gospel of Jesus if they believed He was still in the tomb? Believing he is not in the tomb is irrelevant. History records his death, but nobody but his friends noticed his "resurrection".

The other people to record Jesus’ ressurection were the soldiers who guarded the tomb.  They might have been killed for not keeping watch over the tomb.  History records their way out of death: "Now while they were going, behold, some of the guard came into the city and reported to the chief priests all the things that had happened. 12 When they had assembled with the elders and consulted together, they gave a large sum of money to the soldiers, 13 saying, "Tell them, ‘His disciples came at night and stole Him away while we slept.’ 14 And if this comes to the governor’s ears, we will appease him and make you secure." 15 So they took the money and did as they were instructed; and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day." Matt 28:11-15  Josephus, a Jewish historian was hated by his fellow Jews for providing an accurate account of Christ’s resurrection. Prove it accurate, please.

"Now there was about this time, Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was the Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again at the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him are not extinct at this day" (Antiquities of the Jews book 18 chapter 3, William Whiston translation, The Complete Works of Josephus, Kregal Publications, Grand Rapids Michigan, 1981, p. 379). http://www.creatingfutures.net/resurrection.html God’s gift is your choice to accept.  Think carefully when choosing what you wish to do with your life. Then why do you want to shove it down our throats? Make you a deal, if I want it, I’ll come to alt.christian.sheeple, okay?

I’m so happy about what Jesus has done for us that I can’t contain this blessed truth to myself.

Response:

He also sent his disciples to steal for him. The owner of the donkey would have lent it if he were there when His disciples borrowed it.

The disciples were not instructed to ask permission unless they were caught. "Borrowing" something without asking permission first is theft. I know from personal experience to turn of the electric before replacing an outlet. What is your point. My point is that it is possible to overcome the lusts of the flesh that have a tendency to pull our desires away from doing the will of God.  People can learn to enjoy a more healthful style of living, as Christ had planned for people.

Pagans generally have a very healthful style of living. Jesus doesn’t want anything, he’s fucking dead, and all your "he’s  coming back" won’t change that. Would His disciples die for the Gospel of Jesus if they believed He was still in the tomb? Believing he is not in the tomb is irrelevant. History records his death, but nobody but his friends noticed his "resurrection". The other people to record Jesus’ ressurection were the soldiers who guarded the tomb.  They might have been killed for not keeping watch over the tomb.  History records their way out of death:

They didn’t record it. Matthew did. "Now while they were going, behold, some of the guard came into the city and reported to the chief priests all the things that had happened. 12 When they had assembled with the elders and consulted together, they gave a large sum of money to the soldiers, 13 saying, "Tell them, ‘His disciples came at night and stole Him away while we slept.’ 14 And if this comes to the governor’s ears, we will appease him and make you secure." 15 So they took the money and did as they were instructed; and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day." Matt 28:11-15

That’s what the "Matt" means in the reference. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Josephus, a Jewish historian was hated by his fellow Jews for providing an accurate account of Christ’s resurrection. Prove it accurate, please. "Now there was about this time, Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was the Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again at the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him are not extinct at this day" (Antiquities of the Jews book 18 chapter 3, William Whiston translation, The Complete Works of Josephus, Kregal Publications, Grand Rapids Michigan, 1981, p. 379).

According to you, Josephus was not alive. What were his references other than the bible? http://www.creatingfutures.net/resurrection.html God’s gift is your choice to accept.  Think carefully when choosing what you wish to do with your life. Then why do you want to shove it down our throats? Make you a deal, if I want it, I’ll come to alt.christian.sheeple, okay? I’m so happy about what Jesus has done for us that I can’t contain this blessed truth to myself.

Please control yourself. Don’t call us….etc. T9W

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes you! If only you knew how much Jesus Loved you…….he was tortured and crucified to save your miserabale souls. Actually, he was just into that kind of thing. The only reason he is remembered for it, is that he made up a pretty good excuse. KING KONG DIED FOR YOUR SINS. but, I’m all for sin, so what the fuck. He understands why you are rebelling against Him though. He knows you had a rough childhood playing Dungeons and Dragons and

actually, I wassa playing… cowboy and indians…. up ’till I was 25….always was the indian….liked to tie young pale- face female up to da stake….screw the boy scouts, I knew MO knots than most eagle scouts did by the time I was 14…. [**sighs....  in the rememberance of learning the complexities of the french bowline and that oh-so lovely cuff knot.....** ] now? NOW?  ohhhh…. I’m just a run of the mill Dominant with a prolivity for electrical play and posessing the tendency to implement pleasure/pain techniques on the spread-eagled bound (and often gagged ) female adventurist… gurdjieff 0f gormorrah

Response:

Actually, he was just into that kind of thing. The only reason he is remembered for it, is that he made up a pretty good excuse. Jesus wants His children to have a great life. "The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly" (John 10:10).

…..and when thee wives have their periods, they must sleep in the barn. (direct quote from "God" there) KING KONG DIED FOR YOUR SINS. but, I’m all for sin, so what the fuck. The Holy Spirit has the power to change your life, and you desires.  I know from personal experience.

Sure it does- he’s very jealous and petty I hear tell. Jesus doesn’t want anything, he’s fucking dead, and all your "he’s coming back" won’t change that. Would His disciples die for the Gospel of Jesus if they believed He was still in the tomb?  Josephus, a Jewish historian was hated by his fellow Jews for providing an accurate account of Christ’s resurrection.

Did ya know that according to the "Bible" you will burn in hell if you play football? I wonder if God wears a tin foil hat? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do you people have any living people that support your views, or do you just hoist your religion on those dead, and therefore unable to tell you how stupid you are. Placing a curse on your so-called God now? I will say a ‘prayer’ for you as well. May the next sheep not be as contagious as the last, and may the syphilis that has crossed your bloodbrain barier not make you any more of a babbling idiot than it already has. KING KONG DIED FOR YOUR SINS! but, I’m not sure if he was for or against them… God’s gift is your choice to accept.  Think carefully when choosing what you wish to do with your life.

Yes, cause he’s quite jealous ya know. If he catches you looking at another guy, look out!! ^..^<  kat

"Some people say that cats are sneaky, evil, and cruel. True, and they have many other fine qualities as well." – Missy Dizick

Response:

Actually, he was just into that kind of thing. The only reason he is remembered for it, is that he made up a pretty good excuse. Jesus wants His children to have a great life. "The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly" (John 10:10). He also sent his disciples to steal for him.

and they were all on drugs… eating the fallen chaff of the wheat, indeed! we all know that fermented rye grain produces ergot which can be manufactured into LSD. of course LSD wasn’t actually discovered/invented until much later, but ergot has some very potent hallucinogenic properties on its own! JESUS NEVER WALKED ON WATER, HE JUST PLAYED A JOKE ON ALL HIS TRIPPING FRIENDS! (sorry i just had to take part in the "Typing Things in Caps" game) KING KONG DIED FOR YOUR SINS. but, I’m all for sin, so what the fuck. The Holy Spirit has the power to change your life, and you desires.  I know from personal experience. I know from personal experience to turn of the electric before replacing an outlet. What is your point.

i know from personal experience not to stick paper clips into an electrical outlet. i certainly felt *Something* move through me that day, but i don’t know if i would call it Holy.. i have felt the power of the Holy Voltage! AMEN! Jesus doesn’t want anything, he’s fucking dead, and all your "he’s coming back" won’t change that. Would His disciples die for the Gospel of Jesus if they believed He was still in the tomb? Believing he is not in the tomb is irrelevant. History records his death, but nobody but his friends noticed his "resurrection".

in this case, i think Jesus pre-empted Machiavelli. what better way to get more followers AND get your enemies off your back at the same time? i don’t know about you, but i’d do just about anything to get some time alone with Mary Magdelene without any "interruptions" from my friends.. *wiggles an eyebrow suggestively*  Josephus, a Jewish historian was hated by his fellow Jews for providing an accurate account of Christ’s resurrection. Prove it accurate, please.

since we have not (to my knowledge) invented or discovered time travel yet, i see no way of testing this statement, and therefore any speculations on the subject remain merely speculations and should probably not be given the weight of Absolute Metaphysical Certitude. that being said i think he was taken back to his People on the planet Nerktwaft (yes, Nerktwaft.. got a problem with the name? take it up with the Nerktwaftian people, bub.) which appeared to the people who were preset as him "ascending to the throne of heaven." people sound funny when they don’t have accurate language to describe their experiences, hence the whole "Ressurrection and Ascension" story. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do you people have any living people that support your views, or do you just hoist your religion on those dead, and therefore unable to tell you how stupid you are. Placing a curse on your so-called God now? I will say a ‘prayer’ for you as well. May the next sheep not be as contagious as the last, and may the syphilis that has crossed your bloodbrain barier not make you any more of a babbling idiot than it already has. KING KONG DIED FOR YOUR SINS! but, I’m not sure if he was for or against them… God’s gift is your choice to accept.  Think carefully when choosing what you wish to do with your life.

is there a Returns counter? God’s gift doesn’t fit very well, and i’m hoping i can trade it in towards the purchase of a PS2… man those things are awesome. peace, bogsnarth — B

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  For a start, you should be using excel.  That should alleviate arithmetic errors, assuming the formulas are entered correctly. — sarah clark I thought about using excel, and I have for other reports, but with all the typing formatting needed, I decided word would be best.  I know calculator for the arithmetic

I agree with Sarah. Use a spreadsheet to do accounting homework. It’s time you learned how to put format spreadsheet output and how to transfer spreadsheets to text documents. easy2000

Response:

I’m an accounting student taking Managerial Accounting (Cost Accounting). I’m trying to prepare a production report using process cost accounting with the FIFO method.  During the cost reconciliation with the work in process account and units completed I’ve run into a 46K mistake.  Is anyone willing to take a look at my Word document to tell me where I’m wrong?  I don’t necessarily need to know the right answer, just where to

Response:

I’m an accounting student taking Managerial Accounting (Cost Accounting). I’m trying to prepare a production report using process cost accounting with the FIFO method.  During the cost reconciliation with the work in process account and units completed I’ve run into a 46K mistake.  Is anyone willing to take a look at my Word document to tell me where I’m wrong?  I don’t necessarily need to know the right answer, just where to

Response:

I’m an accounting student taking Managerial Accounting (Cost Accounting). I’m trying to prepare a production report using process cost accounting with the FIFO method.  During the cost reconciliation with the work in process account and units completed I’ve run into a 46K mistake.  Is anyone willing to take a look at my Word document to tell me where I’m wrong?  I don’t necessarily need to know the right answer, just where to

For a start, you should be using excel.  That should alleviate arithmetic errors, assuming the formulas are entered correctly. — sarah clark My experience as a member of the APB (Accounting Principles Board) taught me many lessons.  A major one was that most of us have a natural tendency and an incredible talent for processing new facts in such a way that our prior conclusions remain intact.   — Charles Horngren

Response:

 For a start, you should be using excel.  That should alleviate arithmetic errors, assuming the formulas are entered correctly. — sarah clark

I thought about using excel, and I have for other reports, but with all the typing formatting needed, I decided word would be best.  I know calculator for the arithmetic

Response:

Question:

Is this the extent of your needs? I would not want to recommend something that would be overkill. Give of some idea of what the business is about. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Response:

To Philfree, If you want an affordable software that will handle multiple companies and have a flexible payroll, including after the fact payroll (hand checks), go to www.a-systems.net and click on "Starter" at the top toolbar.    * A-Systems will deliver this package for $25.    * The program was written for contractors needing its powerful job cost      accounting feature, but many other non construction businesses have found it      very useful.    * Payroll Tax tables may be updated by the user, no need to purchase them from      the software company.    * The CD comes with 40 sessions of multimedia training.    * Next year, when you want the latest and greatest version, you need only pay      $25 for an update.  You don’t need to repurchase the software every time an      update is available. Arnold – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Check out  www.a-systems.net .  They have a complete accounting program for $25. Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Thanks.  This appears to be a single company software suite.  I will check it out though.  Have you tried it?  Did you like it? Phil

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Why not check out RSA at www.rsasoftwareinc.com it might be what your looking for! On the website there is a fully functional demo that you can use and abuse and see if it works for you! TRy it Bruce Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

 Thanks.  I will try it out.  Have you used it?  What do you think of it? Phil

Response:

Hi Why not check out RSA at www.rsasoftwareinc.com it might be what your looking for! On the website there is a fully functional demo that you can use and abuse and see if it works for you! TRy it Bruce

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Response:

Check out  www.a-systems.net .  They have a complete accounting program for $25. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Response:

Hi, I am looking for multi client financial reporting software.  Need to produce check register, cash receipts, after the fact payroll and payroll tax returns, g/l and financial statements.  I used to use Class2 but they sold out to CSA.  I am trying CSA, but it seems like overkill and too complicated to use and maintain.  Also expensive. I dislike Quickbooks. Additionally, I would like to find payroll software that can provide for 4 different pay rates.  Does not have to integrate with G/L. Thanks for your help. Phil

Response:

i,m looking for a free software program for a small business. piet

Response:

i,m looking for a free software program for a small business. piet

You might want to take a look at "Simple Business Accounting" for Windows 95 or Basic Bookkeeping for Windows. Both programs are very easy to use and don’t require that you be an accountant to figure out how to enter your information. http://www.owlsoftware.com OWL Software            http://www.owlsoftware.com Small Business and Investment Software Specialists

Response:

i,m looking for a free software program for a small business. piet

If you’re operating a business, you would be well advised to spend some money on software. Cutting cost corners is wise, but doing so in the areas which can protect you against an audit and/or help to fortify your tax posture is, in my professional opinion, foolish; given the variety of low-cost and effective accounting packages on the market today. Try DacEasy. It’s full-featured, powerful and cheap (less than $150).

Response:

I would like to pose a quick question. I’m trying to find-out the name of a good account software package for win95/winnt platform. I know nothing about account.

QuickBooks, which is made for non-accountants, is the world’s largest selling small business accounting package. Many CPAs are learning that a powerful, fast, easy to learn & easy to correct programs is also good for them. You can download a 25 use trial at www.intuit.com. You should be able to use it without a manual, but QuickBooks 5 for Dummies is very good. You will not lose your data if you do not buy the program as fast as you should.    Mike Block, C.P.A. Tax Fighter,  954-566-7540           QuickBooks Professional Advisor biz.comp.accounting co-moderator for spam free news       NO TAX INCREASES without voter approval   275 E Oakland Park Blvd, Ft Lauderdale FL 33334       If this answer was valuable, send money

Response:

BAUMARK Accounting Software is really easy to use.  http://www.baumark.com or 1-888-485-3900.  Thanks – Gail Hasselberg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would like to pose a quick question. I’m trying to find-out the name of a good account software package for win95/winnt platform. I know nothing about account. Thank you

Response:

It is for a small municipal utility with around 45 regular employees.  There would be about 10 or so users of the accounding software. Thank You

Response:

I would like to pose a quick question. I’m trying to find-out the name of a good account software package for win95/winnt platform. I know nothing about account. Thank you

Response:

Response:

You will need to be more specific, i.e., what does the company do, company size, type of company, and what you need the accounting software to do. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would like to pose a quick question. I’m trying to find-out the name of a good account software package for win95/winnt platform. I know nothing about account. Thank you

Response:

Question:

It’s actually the chmeicals from the photo lab… hmm nothing like a developer high Tell me Kelly, I’ve been meaning to ask you, Are your boobs real or fake? real, sweetie…and is you dick as big as your mouth?

Highly, unlikely I’d say.

Response:

real, sweetie…and is you dick as big as your mouth? Highly, unlikely I’d say.

Yea. *Nothing* could be as big as his mouth. — Carl I change my underwear as often as I change my newsreaders – CASalonen

Response:

— Carl I change my underwear as often as I change my newsreaders – CASalonen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do they have a Fabio costume that I can rent? Sure. Just ask for the "Tinkerbell Special". They’ll know what you’re talking about <g,d,r Don’t even go there.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How perceptive of you Carl! What gave me away? I just recently was testing out a stupid pill just in case Drama Queen comes around. God knows she needs it!!!! If I ever see her post another thesis of "The Economics and Politics of Background Work in Canada", I’ll shoot myself!!! There is no way anybody can bang this chick without slipping a stupid pill in her drink. Do they have a Fabio costume that I can rent? The Starmaker <LOL They do have Fabio costumes, …unfortunately I don’t think you have what it takes to even come close to filling it out.  8^) Doesn’t it come with it?

That all depends on what you mean by "it"? Not about to fall for any of your tricks today. Drama Queen

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WOW…..  You sound reasonable…Time to up my medication…try some of mine? A.G. Sorry, I don’t do drugs, …it makes me stupider!

Presumably you’ve tested this theory recently?

Response:

Do they have a Fabio costume that I can rent?

Sure. Just ask for the "Tinkerbell Special". They’ll know what you’re talking about <g,d,r

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A gentleman would never ask. And *I* will certainly never tell <g — Carl I change my underwear as often as I change my newsreaders – CASalonen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s actually the chmeicals from the photo lab… hmm nothing like a developer high Tell me Kelly, I’ve been meaning to ask you, Are your boobs real or fake?

Response:

Do they have a Fabio costume that I can rent? Sure. Just ask for the "Tinkerbell Special". They’ll know what you’re talking about <g,d,r

Don’t even go there.

Response:

How perceptive of you Carl! What gave me away? I just recently was testing out a stupid pill just in case Drama Queen comes around. God knows she needs it!!!! If I ever see her post another thesis of "The Economics and Politics of Background Work in Canada", I’ll shoot myself!!! There is no way anybody can bang this chick without slipping a stupid pill in her drink. Do they have a Fabio costume that I can rent? The Starmaker

<LOL They do have Fabio costumes, …unfortunately I don’t think you have what it takes to even come close to filling it out.  8^)

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WOW…..  You sound reasonable…Time to up my medication…try some of mine? A.G.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The exciting idea of being a "rank and file" (whatever that means) at SAG is going to work and coming home and dreaming of new and inventive ideas on how to *steal* money from the coffers of SAG. Coming up with new and creative ideas is what makes life exciting! You should go to the SAG offices and see for yourself the corrupt faces the people who work there have. They have *greed* in their eyes, …it glitters! They are toooo busy thinking of ways to rip off the place to help you with your problems. Everybody is too busy trying to beat everyone else to the money. Then they go home and count the money and laugh, then they can’t wait to go to work on Monday to get some more money! All you got to do is figure out how to write yourself a check in the most unique and creative way. Once someone gets caught then that avenue is closed and you have to invent a new one. "Figuring Out" is what the rank and file (whatever that means) are doing each day. Figuring out how to take what you bring in. Another words, SAG has more money than they know what to do with it. The question people at SAG ask themselves is who’s stealing and how can I get to be partners with them, or who’s stealing the most money? Or what new ideas can I come up with to steal on my own. Of course there is jelousy when one thief finds out someone else is stealing more than they are. Then they go home and gossip about it to their friends. All I know is if *I* was a rank and file (whatever that means) I would be stealing day and night!!!!! I love to steal! I just hate getting caught. I’ll create a hundreds different fake companies and write them all checks. I’ll have those guys at Price Waterhouse DIZZY!!!! I know people who do audits at Pricewaterhouse, I’ll make those records disapear!!! And if I get caught, I’ll just get a 30 suspension (vacation) and I’ll be back and STEAL some more!!!! The hard part is coming up with new ideas. Does anybody got a book on How To Embezzel? Who wants to go on a picnic? Does anybody need any legal advise? But the fun part is that most people *don’t* get caught. And if any actor comes to be and wants to know where his dues is going then the first thing I’ll say is, "Are you am member of SAG????" "What’s your membership number???" "Are your dues all paid up?" "I think you’re going to have problems with your membership if you keep asking questions" "I don’t see anything in the computer that you paid any dues!" "Are you sure you’re a member" "You’re in BIG trouble!" "I got a feeling you’re going to have problems receiving any risiduals" "Where did he go?" Maybe somebody should put a sign on the window at SAG’s offices that reads, "STOP STEALING MONEY" I bet it wasn’t a SAG member who put that sign up, is what they be saying to themselves. The Starmaker What does "rank and file" mean anyway?

Response:

Hello Actors~ What is even more distressing is the dollar amount mentioned in this story by David Robb: $2500, $2100, $20000, $5000, $5000, $5000, $5000. Yikes, these dollar amounts are still way over the yearly wages of a majority of SAG’s actor membership! What a cruel crime to them and all! This is obscene!!!! A.G. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SAG unit facing post-audit questions (Tues., March 27, 2001) By David Robb An audit of the books of the Screen Actors Guild’s affirmative action department has turned up numerous irregularities and questionable expenditures, according to SAG sources. On Friday, department head Patricia Metoyer was suspended for 30 days, and her top assistant, Peter Nguyen, was fired (HR 3/26). The audit found that Metoyer had authorized payments to several friends, associates and family members. SAG sources said one of the payments — for $2,500 — was made to a company owned by her husband that provided musical entertainment for a "family fun picnic" that Metoyer’s department threw in August at Loyola Marymount University in Los Angeles. The audit also found that Metoyer had authorized a $2,100 payment for a "reception" for researcher George Gerbner, when, in fact, it was spent on the picnic. Gerbner, who has conducted several studies for the guild, did not attend the picnic, and there was no reception for him. The audit also found that Metoyer had authorized a $20,000 payment to former SAG staffer Rachelle Bolding on Bolding’s last day on the job. Bolding, a former assistant to Metoyer, left the guild Sept. 18 and began working as an outside consultant on a project for the affirmative action department about performers with disabilities. That project is being funded by the SAG-Producers Industry Advancement & Cooperative Fund, which funds many of the affirmative action department’s projects. A search of corporate records shows that Metoyer and Bolding are business partners in a venture named PRC Corporate Events. State corporate records show that the company was formed Aug. 7 — less than six weeks before Metoyer authorized the $20,000 check for Bolding. The Industry Advancement & Cooperative Fund hired the accounting firm PricewaterhouseCoopers to audit the affirmative action department’s books after suspicions began to grow that the money the IACF was giving to the department wasn’t being spent properly. The audit found that Metoyer had authorized a $5,000 check for Nguyen only a few days before he came to work in the affirmative action department as her top assistant. Before joining the affirmative action department in January, Nguyen worked in the guild’s special projects department, where he was a strike coordinator during SAG’s strike last year against the advertising industry. While still working for the special projects department, Nguyen provided "legal consultation services" for the affirmative action department to help out on a project to reorganize the guild’s job skills bank. But Nguyen is not an attorney, and state law provides that "no person shall practice law in California unless the person is an active member of the state bar." Leading court rulings have held that practicing law includes providing "legal advice and counsel" for a fee. Nguyen, however, said he was not offering legal advice. "What I did was not the practice of law," he said. Sources said Nguyen was paid the $5,000 to do legal research on the legality of questions that actors would be asked as part of the skills bank project. The check was cut and sent to Nguyen by Loyola Marymount professor of theological studies Daniel Smith-Christopher. Loyola Marymount comes into the picture because it was designated as a vendor on several of the affirmative action department’s projects. Smith-Christopher was working with Metoyer to develop a resource center where SAG members could access data on employment opportunities. The IACF funded the project by setting up a trust account at SAG that would be administered by the university. So when Metoyer approved the $5,000 payment to Nguyen, Smith-Christopher believed that it was OK to write the check because "in a sense, it was their funds," he said. But Smith-Christopher was surprised to learn that Nguyen was not an attorney. "What? He’s not a lawyer?" Smith-Christopher asked during a telephone interview Monday. "This comes as a total surprise. The money was paid because he was giving legal advice in connection with development of the skills bank. My understanding was that they needed advice on the legality of the questions they were asking in order to gather the information for the skills bank. They needed to make sure that it was all being done appropriately and legally." Metoyer has declined comment on her suspension, but over the weekend, she said, "I have followed the guild’s established policies and procedures." Nguyen has charged that he was fired because of his efforts to end discrimination within the guild’s own ranks. "Make no mistake," he said. "I have not been fired — I have been fired upon for attempting to do right by the rank and file of this union."

Response:

In the interest of accuracy… 1)  Patricia Heiser-Metoyer was not fired, she was placed on 30 days administrative leave. 2)  Read the Hollywood Reporter article, which clearly (and correctly) lays out the concerns that were raised by the audit the IACF asked to be conducted.  Len and John McGuire had nothing to do with the audit, and were responding to the concerns of the IACF, which funds many of the AA’s Departments projects. 3)  When Len and John sat down with Patricia to discuss the alleged abuses, she said she could not talk with them without her lawyer present, and left the room.  Consequently, though Patricia MAY have absolutely plausible explanations for all the questions that have arisen (which I sincerely expect that she does), without having given any of them to Len and John, they had no choice but to suspend her, pending further investigation and discussion (with her lawyer present, I assume).  This is standard, and in no way discriminatory. 4)  It is vitally important not to just fold to calls of "racism" for which there is little or no evidence.  This shit hit the fan, ONLY AFTER Len informed Gary Epp that he was rethinking his agreement to step down from the Hollywood Exec position, so that the PA could shove Jerre Hookey into the job.  This is political, pure and simple. 5)  Beware of being made to feel guilty and ignorant just because you are white folks!!!  It is just as bad as any other kind of racism. 6)  I think Patricia is a fine and honorable person, and have the greatest respect for her.  As I’ve said, I firmly believe that these problems will be resolved through her explanations.  But Len had nothing to do with the allegations and he had no choice but to suspend her, given her concerns about having a conversation without benefit of counsel. ST

Response:

SAG unit facing post-audit questions (Tues., March 27, 2001) By David Robb An audit of the books of the Screen Actors Guild’s affirmative action department has turned up numerous irregularities and questionable expenditures, according to SAG sources. On Friday, department head Patricia Metoyer was suspended for 30 days, and her top assistant, Peter Nguyen, was fired (HR 3/26). The audit found that Metoyer had authorized payments to several friends, associates and family members. SAG sources said one of the payments — for $2,500 — was made to a company owned by her husband that provided musical entertainment for a "family fun picnic" that Metoyer’s department threw in August at Loyola Marymount University in Los Angeles. The audit also found that Metoyer had authorized a $2,100 payment for a "reception" for researcher George Gerbner, when, in fact, it was spent on the picnic. Gerbner, who has conducted several studies for the guild, did not attend the picnic, and there was no reception for him. The audit also found that Metoyer had authorized a $20,000 payment to former SAG staffer Rachelle Bolding on Bolding’s last day on the job. Bolding, a former assistant to Metoyer, left the guild Sept. 18 and began working as an outside consultant on a project for the affirmative action department about performers with disabilities. That project is being funded by the SAG-Producers Industry Advancement & Cooperative Fund, which funds many of the affirmative action department’s projects. A search of corporate records shows that Metoyer and Bolding are business partners in a venture named PRC Corporate Events. State corporate records show that the company was formed Aug. 7 — less than six weeks before Metoyer authorized the $20,000 check for Bolding. The Industry Advancement & Cooperative Fund hired the accounting firm PricewaterhouseCoopers to audit the affirmative action department’s books after suspicions began to grow that the money the IACF was giving to the department wasn’t being spent properly. The audit found that Metoyer had authorized a $5,000 check for Nguyen only a few days before he came to work in the affirmative action department as her top assistant. Before joining the affirmative action department in January, Nguyen worked in the guild’s special projects department, where he was a strike coordinator during SAG’s strike last year against the advertising industry. While still working for the special projects department, Nguyen provided "legal consultation services" for the affirmative action department to help out on a project to reorganize the guild’s job skills bank. But Nguyen is not an attorney, and state law provides that "no person shall practice law in California unless the person is an active member of the state bar." Leading court rulings have held that practicing law includes providing "legal advice and counsel" for a fee. Nguyen, however, said he was not offering legal advice. "What I did was not the practice of law," he said. Sources said Nguyen was paid the $5,000 to do legal research on the legality of questions that actors would be asked as part of the skills bank project. The check was cut and sent to Nguyen by Loyola Marymount professor of theological studies Daniel Smith-Christopher. Loyola Marymount comes into the picture because it was designated as a vendor on several of the affirmative action department’s projects. Smith-Christopher was working with Metoyer to develop a resource center where SAG members could access data on employment opportunities. The IACF funded the project by setting up a trust account at SAG that would be administered by the university. So when Metoyer approved the $5,000 payment to Nguyen, Smith-Christopher believed that it was OK to write the check because "in a sense, it was their funds," he said. But Smith-Christopher was surprised to learn that Nguyen was not an attorney. "What? He’s not a lawyer?" Smith-Christopher asked during a telephone interview Monday. "This comes as a total surprise. The money was paid because he was giving legal advice in connection with development of the skills bank. My understanding was that they needed advice on the legality of the questions they were asking in order to gather the information for the skills bank. They needed to make sure that it was all being done appropriately and legally." Metoyer has declined comment on her suspension, but over the weekend, she said, "I have followed the guild’s established policies and procedures." Nguyen has charged that he was fired because of his efforts to end discrimination within the guild’s own ranks. "Make no mistake," he said. "I have not been fired — I have been fired upon for attempting to do right by the rank and file of this union."

Response:

Question:

1) Does anyone know the formula for St. Emillion wines? I believe that it is a blend of Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon and/or Cabernet Franc, but am curious as to the percentages and other nuances which contribute to its wonderful flavour. 2) A local grape grower insists that excellent wine can be (and is) made from Thompson (!) grapes. Has anyone (reading this) tried it? With what results?

Response:

1) Does anyone know the formula for St. Emillion wines? I believe that = it is a blend of Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon and/or Cabernet Franc, = but am curious as to the percentages and other nuances which contribute = to its wonderful flavour.

The St Emilion region is primarily planted with Cabernet Franc and Merlot. Cabernet Sauvignon, Carmenere and Malbec are also planted occasionally/sparsely, – but Cab Sauv does not generally fair as well there due to the generally cooler climate.  That’s part of the appeal of the St. Emilion wines to alot of people, – the smaller proportion of Cab Sauv lends to softer tannins, forward fruit flavors, and the ability to be enjoyed at a younger age. Of the Grand Crus: Chateau Cheval Blanc, 65% Cab Franc 35% Merlot Chateau Ausone, 50% Cab Franc 50% Merlot Chateau Figeac, Equal parts Cab Franc, Merlot, Cab Sauv Satellite Appellations: Chateau St. Georges 50% Merlot, 50% Cabernets Chateau Corbin 65% Merlot, 35% Cabernets 2) A local grape grower insists that excellent wine can be (and is) made = from Thompson (!) grapes. Has anyone (reading this) tried it? With what = results?

Sorry.  I’ve no idea about this one. Meg

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The St Emilion region is primarily planted with Cabernet Franc and Merlot. Cabernet Sauvignon, Carmenere and Malbec are also planted occasionally/sparsely, – but Cab Sauv does not generally fair as well there due to the generally cooler climate.  That’s part of the appeal of the St. Emilion wines to alot of people, – the smaller proportion of Cab Sauv lends to softer tannins, forward fruit flavors, and the ability to be enjoyed at a younger age. Of the Grand Crus: Chateau Cheval Blanc, 65% Cab Franc 35% Merlot Chateau Ausone, 50% Cab Franc 50% Merlot Chateau Figeac, Equal parts Cab Franc, Merlot, Cab Sauv Satellite Appellations: Chateau St. Georges 50% Merlot, 50% Cabernets Chateau Corbin 65% Merlot, 35% Cabernets

Excellent information!  I would only add that there are also some very good 100% Merlot wines produced in St. Emillion (Font Villac, for instance). 2) A local grape grower insists that excellent wine can be (and is) made = from Thompson (!) grapes. Has anyone (reading this) tried it? With what = results? Sorry.  I’ve no idea about this one.

Well, you can make *drinkable* wine from Thompson Seedless, but "excellent" is a bit of a stretch…even accounting for the subjective nature of wine appreciation.  It is a large component in much of the ocean of white "jug" wine from central and southern California.  I don’t recall ever hearing the word "excellent" used to describe any of these. Dan

Response:

Well, you can make *drinkable* wine from Thompson Seedless, but "excellent" is a bit of a stretch…even accounting for the subjective nature of wine appreciation.  It is a large component in much of the ocean of white "jug" wine from central and southern California.  I don’t recall ever hearing the word "excellent" used to describe any of these.

I suspect that the grower was trying to unload his "excellent" Thompson’s on me. There was an early harvest in this part of the world, and most all the wine grapes have been picked and crushed. But, there are plenty of Thompson’s left for gullible na

Question:

A while ago someone posted a msg about this newsgroup making reference to mainly US based accounting packages.  S/he asked if anyone knew of any newsgroups that concentrate on UK packages.  Does anyone know of the outcome?

uk.business.accountancy might eventually approve of posts about software, but that would first need changes to the ng’s charter. In the meantime, the IT message board on http://www.ICAEW.CO.UK could be a useful place to try. No need to be an ICAEW  member. regards Roger Standing

Response:

A while ago someone posted a msg about this newsgroup making reference to mainly US based accounting packages.  S/he asked if anyone knew of any newsgroups that concentrate on UK packages.  Does anyone know of the outcome?

Response: