Question:

Every week or two there is a really good message on the ebXML mailing lists; this one was highly acclaimed by several of the other members of ebXML, so I’m posting it here on alt.accounting. see http://www.ebxml.org/ for more. TOdd – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ——Original Message—– Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2000 3:07 PM To: ‘ebXML-CCBP-Analysis (E-mail)’; Ebxml-Bp (E-mail) Warning: this is a long message and may require some study. It is my summary of a series of conversations on ebXML mailing lists, off-list emails, and ebXML metamodel and analysis work group conference calls.  I think the contents are critical for understanding business collaborations from a business (not technical) viewpoint. _Short version: _ The ebXML metamodel defined commercial transaction patterns, that is, simple exchanges of business documents such as offer-acceptance, query-response, etc.  These patterns greatly simplify the development of business process models. Business collaborations consisting of many related commercial transactions also fall into patterns: for example, contract negotiations or order-fulfillment. Many if not most business collaboration patterns have to do with trade, or exchanges of resources between trading partners: for example, I give you a product or service, and take from you cash in return. There are a set of common semantic relationships among commercial transactions that characterize trading collaborations. Those common relationships have been analyzed for 20 years by Professor William McCarthy of Michigan State University, a member of the ebXML Business Process work group.  They are embedded in the ebXML Collaboration Modeling Metamodel as the Economic Elements.  See for example Figure 7. http://www.ebxml.org/project_teams/business_process/wip/index.html#BPDoc (watch for word wrap) An understanding of Figure 7 and its surrounding text will help to develop reusable models of the common trading collaboration patterns, and also make the software to manage trading collaborations easier to use from a business perspective, because the common business semantics will be built in. In this message and further work after Tokyo, I will define some common trading collaboration patterns in terms of the ebXML metamodel economic elements.  Since there are some details of the metamodel that are still in flux, so will be some of this work. _More detail_ A story was told on a recent ebXML Analysis work group conference call about the many uses and abuses of Advanced Shipping Notice (ASN) business documents.  In one case, the ASN was used not to notify of a shipment, but to notify the customer that the goods were available for pickup.  In some other cases, some other document might be used for the same purpose.  So if the document doesn’t necessarily tell us what it means, what does? I heard another related story about the various documents or events that signify authorization for payment for components in automotive supply chains:  pay on ASN, pay on receipt, pay on issue, pay on production, pay on invoice, etc. These are examples of economic relationships among commercial transactions (or economic relationships among business documents, if you want to think of it that way). The economic relationships among commercial transactions can be be reduced to a very simple model called REA (Resources, Events and Agents). http://www.reamodel.org/ Those are the concepts behind Figure 7 in the ebXML metamodel. Some of the words in Figure 7 may seem strange – too abstract – and may make the whole thing seem more complicated than it is by means of unfamiliarity.  But the number of ideas is minimal. I will try to simplify after introducing the key terms and definitions from the current metamodel.  I apologize in advance for any deficiencies in simplicity.  Bill McCarthy does a skit with Elmo and Cookie Monster muppets that is much more effective, but difficult to convey in text. Those of you who have seen the skit can keep it in mind. _Key concepts_ An Economic Resource is a quantity of something of value that is under the control of an enterprise, which is transferred from one partner type to another in economic events. Examples are cash, inventory, labor service and machine service. An Economic Event is the transfer of control of an Economic Resource from one partner type to another partner type. Examples would include sale, cash-payment, shipment, and lease. (Not from the metamodel:) An Economic Agent is the same as a Party, Partner or Partner Type, depending on which ebXML document you are looking at. Two other concepts are required to understand the economic relationships: Economic Commitment An economic commitment is an obligation to perform an economic event (that is, transfer ownership of a specified quantity of a specified economic resource type) at some future point in time. Order line items are examples of commitments. EconomicContract A contract is subtype of agreement between partner types that some actual economic exchanges will occur in the future. Contracts can have recursive relationships with other contracts, for example, yearly contracts with monthly releases and weekly or daily shipping schedules. Contracts are containers for collections of commitments. For example, a purchase order is a contract wherein the line items are commitments. _Key economic relationships_ Fulfills An economic event may fulfill a prior commitment. Reciprocity Reciprocity is a mandatory relationship between two or more commitments. Commercial contracts require reciprocal commitments, called "consideration". Duality Duality is a relationship between Economic Events, where one is the legal or economic consideration of the other. Examples include a payment for a product or service. If one economic event occurs, but its dual or expected consideration has not occurred, the giving partner type has an imputed claim against the taking partner type for the value of the economic resources transferred. _Common patterns_ *Order-Fulfillment This is certainly the most common trading collaboration pattern. Orders are kinds of Economic Contracts.  Order line items are Economic Commitments usually to deliver products or services in exchange for money. Orders may be formed by simple offer-acceptance commercial transactions or contract negotiation patterns (see below). Fulfillment means to execute Economic Events that fulfill the commitments. For example, actually delivering the products or services and paying for them. The business collaboration model will define which event is supposed to come first:  delivery or payment.  So the pattern could be Order-Delivery-Payment or Order-Payment-Delivery. Which ever event comes first, it establishes a claim (the Duality relationship) for the fulfillment of the reciprocal commitment, either payment or delivery. The fulfillment event is obliged to match the commitment in terms of quality, quantity and timing.  There could be terms and conditions in the contract (the Order) specifying what happens if the commitments are not met.  These terms and conditions could be embodied in the collaboration model so as to determine the appropriate compensating events. Receiving discrepancies are another rich set of fulfillment problems, which may call for other compensating events. When all the commitments are fulfilled, the collaboration pattern is ended.  (From a business perspective, that is the completion of a *business* transaction.) Harking back to the stories of document use and abuse,  the collaboration model must define which business documents and commercial transactions signify economic events, and which are auxiliary information distributions. In other words, the mapping from business document to economic event is not a given, it is a matter of agreement among the trading partners. * Contract Negotiation In contract negotiations, the negotiating parties are attempting to agree on economic commitments.  Economic commitments need to be mutual (both parties must agree) and reciprocal (there must be a consideration or something in return for something promised). Negotiation implies that the process of agreeing to mutual and reciprocal commitments may take several steps or back-and-forth commercial transactions.  During the process of negotiation, the commitments are not yet "committed" – they are in some other state.   Negotiation is usually modeled as a state model, where the states are those of the commitments, e.g. Offered, Countered, Rejected, Accepted, etc. I do not think it is up to ebXML to specify a state model for negotiation.  Several other groups, including OMG and FIPA, are already doing this. http://www.osm.net/ecdtf.html http://www.osm.net/upload/99-03-01.pdf "Negotiation Facility Final Revised Submission" "This specification provides a framework for collaboration on which negotiation leading to agreement and subsequent engagement can be established as contractually binding commitments." http://www.fipa.org/repository/ips.html (Need to be a member to look at these, unfortunately, but the state charts are similar.) Software to manage negotiation processes must be able to keep track of and manage the states of the commitments and the contract as a whole. Such state management is almost certainly not handled by existing internal business applications.  Until the commitments are accepted, the contract is not really ready for most internal business applications, which assume accepted orders. Moreover,  the states are not really internal, but part of the public semantics of the business collaboration. And the states of the commitments determine what commercial transactions could happen next. The Economic Contract and Economic Commitment classes and their relationships as shown in

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Response:

Every week or two there is a really good message on the ebXML mailing lists; this one was highly acclaimed by several of the other members of ebXML, so I’m posting it here on alt.accounting. see http://www.ebxml.org/ for more.

Thanks, Todd.  Wait for the highly critical ebXML responses, they are coming. I lurk on this newsgroup, too, so if any of the assembled accountants have any constructive or other criticism or comments or questions on my message, I will try to reply. -Bob Haugen

Response:

Question:

Hello, All! Just looking for a list of accounting programs that someone might want to look at when they are outgrowing QB.  Read large inventory, lots of small parts, about 1000 invoices per month, each with 10 – 20 items on it. Thanks!   c. — Sincerely, Cindy Fox Computer Training Solutions www.azcts.com www.cindyfox.com (602) 692-8923

Response:

Hello, All! Just looking for a list of accounting programs that someone might want to look at when they are outgrowing QB.  Read large inventory, lots of small parts, about 1000 invoices per month, each with 10 – 20 items on it.

We are finding that the main drawback about quickbooks is that a) With a data file now pushing 75Mb (yes Mb!!) that the thing builds reports VERY slowly! b) There is no way that transaction data can be inported – only lists can be imported WHY NOT TRANSACTIONS!   Try keying in 1000+ customer payments on the first day of each month when you could import them directly from a bank transaction report in electronic format!

Response:

Let me know when you find it.  QB is beautiful,  but it assumes that all small businesses stay small  - even though it ac tually helps them grow – and outgrow QB. Can’t understand why Intuit does not recognise the need for "QB Master"  - a real heavyweight program to which we can all graduate as biz grows.

Response:

If you have out grown QB and looking for a mid range accounting package that has full double entry system build on an open database system then may i suggest www.crystalclearaccounting.com — Ken Watson Accounting Made Crystal Clear by: http://www.crystalclearaccounting.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, All! Just looking for a list of accounting programs that someone might want to look at when they are outgrowing QB.  Read large inventory, lots of small parts, about 1000 invoices per month, each with 10 – 20 items on it. We are finding that the main drawback about quickbooks is that a) With a data file now pushing 75Mb (yes Mb!!) that the thing builds reports VERY slowly! b) There is no way that transaction data can be inported – only lists can be imported WHY NOT TRANSACTIONS!   Try keying in 1000+ customer payments on the first day of each month when you could import them directly from a bank transaction report in electronic format!

Response:

Take a look a Visual AccountMate or VFP2000. Depending on your needs I think you would be very happy with either program. — Myron Joy CPA       Joy & Associates P.C.       Phoenix Az Accountants and Information Technology Consultants.  Developers of ClientLink E-Accounting Software. Visual AccountMate Business Partner.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, All! Just looking for a list of accounting programs that someone might want to look at when they are outgrowing QB.  Read large inventory, lots of small parts, about 1000 invoices per month, each with 10 – 20 items on it. Thanks!   c. — Sincerely, Cindy Fox Computer Training Solutions www.azcts.com www.cindyfox.com (602) 692-8923

Response:

Cindy – Take a look at our web site http://www.findaccountingsoftware.com We’ve compiled a comprehensive list of accounting software solutions with information on the developer, product line and individual applications. In addition, you can find local consulting firms with whom to work. If you don’t have the time for searching on your own, we’ll help narrow the field. Simply fill out the Online RFP detailing your project. We’ll call you to make sure your project needs are understood and then help find different solution options that fit your needs. Mike Budiac CPA Online http://www.cpaonline.com Just looking for a list of accounting programs

that someone might want to look at when they are outgrowing QB.  Read

large inventory, lots of small parts, about 1000 invoices per month, each with

10 – 20 items on it. Thanks!   c. — Sincerely, Cindy Fox Computer Training Solutions www.azcts.com www.cindyfox.com (602) 692-8923

Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?

In *our* country, Kanga? Would be different in the US or UK…  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues

Not handled in the Family Court. 2.  Custody issues

Flagrant gender bias…no doubt. The pity is, they *know* what gender bias is, they profess not be this way, and then immediately say and do stuff like this…. the counsellor showed my on a whiteboard my ex’s ‘demands’, which included a ‘generous’ 6 days/4 nights per month access for me to my angels. When I asked the patronising counsellor why I was being offerred such a ludicrously small amount of time, she said.."Oh, most men find this quite OK. What with their busy work schedules and all (the liberated women now regresses to 1950s work ethics) that this fits in well." Oh, I say, do you know that my ex works full time? Why aren’t you offerring *her* this? Oh, er, um….it didn’t occur to us that you would like more time. Of course not, because NO ONE IS ASKING ME. You’ve asked her, though. Even the frickkin’ psychologist in his report says that I’ll need to accept that what’s fair to me (50% custody) may not be considered in the best interests of the children. What is implied is that if there is going to be a non-50% arrangement, be warned that as a man you will be wearing the smaller percentage. It is never contemplated that the mother should be asked to accept less. Well, when I go back on Nov 15 for final orders, I’m going in with all guns blazing. 3.  Settlement issues

I didn’t think these matters were settled in the Family Court either, Kanga. Is there gender based discrimination?

Not the slightest doubt. I’ve watched the process in action, I’ve been part of it, and it is definitely biased. Trouble is, so many of the people in the system can’t see their own bias. Like most discrimination, it’s bound up in subtle ways. The use of words, the assumptions that are unspoken…I know what women pre-1970s must have had to deal with. What do YOU think?

It’s what I KNOW now, not what I think. The Australian Family Law Court still sees separated men as rampaging playboys, unconcerned oabout their children and wanting as little time as possible with them. While this might apply to some men, it’s annoying and frustrating to be a caring and loving dad and be treated like an insignificance in your children’s lives. It really is no wonder that many men just give up. The thought of doing this, leaving the state or the country and starting a new life/family elsewhere has occurred to me…and geez…I’m about as committed to fatherhood as one can be. Big Surf Before you buy.

Response:

Amanda, I totally empathise with you and will write to you.  My heart is with you totally. HUGZ KANGA

Response:

Hi Surf, Thanks for your comments Yeah, I know the Australian Law Court is different to other countries, but I ‘amended’ the title of my post because I wanted comments from people of any nation, in respect to Family Law Court issues.  I amended it too because I realised that the Australian Law Court is actually different to the Western Australian Law Court as well!!! So I thought, "Right! I will change it and take the ‘Australian’ out!! ~S~ I also wanted varying opinion  (which I got and thankyou all!)  so I could formulate in my own mind the attitudes different people would have, so I would be armed and prepared for when I was faced with the same issues. The way my x thinks is the way a lot of men think, not just in Australia but all over the world.  And that is, under whatever circumstances try to ‘reduce’ child support for the children and limit ’settlement’ properties and assets to the x.  Not all father’s and husband’s are like this..but my x is and I was needing to know the opinions of other’s who felt the same as me and as my x.  I just want to be able to understand why they feel like this. Justice does not always prevail for the woman or for the man.  Every case is different.  In my case..I just hope justice prevails! Regarding the child support issues.  This is being handled in the WA Family Court for me.  If a registered application to the Child Support Agency is unreasonable and the father is ‘hiding’ funds (as they sometimes do when they are self – employed) it then has to be taken to the Family Court of WA for re-assessment.  We have our own Family Court here in WA which is a State Family Court and it actually exercises jurisdiction in both Federal and State jurisdictions in family law.   (Family Law Court Act). It’s very complicated, but if you want to suffer through my explanation here it is – the Family Court of WA has jurisdiction throughout the State subject to the **Family Law Act** in areas as: 1.  Marital Property 2.  Family Law Act, adoption and child welfare – with respect to the custody, guardianship, access, welfare, maintenance and preliminary expenses in the marriage. They do other stuff too…the Family Court of WA Rules deal with court seal, sittings, oaths, affirmations, recording decrees, registering proceedings and appeals and the Family Court of WA Regulations deal with accounting, enforcement and toher matters such as registries and recording of proceedings. It is easy to confuse Australian Court and State Court with the WA Family Court.  WA is different to the other states!  (As we are in the referendum we had opposing Daylight Saving – like Q’land – but well..we are so far away from the other states, why not be different!! LOL!)  However we are only really different in that we have set up our own Family Court here….which I think works better. About the custody issues…yeah I know in your case it has been a battle.  I would just like to say Surf..that you are a bit different to most dads. Most dads probably aren’t as determined to fight for their kids like you are.  I know my x just accepts that he will see the kids during the holidays and that’s it.  He really misses them I know, but because he lives 500 km’s away I think he just accepts that is when he will see them.  I do wonder why he doesn’t make an effort to have some time with them during the school terms seeing he is in his ‘non working time then’ but well….who knows…he must have his reason’s.  We don’t have a ’set’ child access agreement, it is flexible…except in some of the orders he wants to present (regarding the residential orders) ..but that is another story! I guess in a lot of ways the kids can accept this too.  They just know they are with Mum during school term and with Dad during holidays.  I have even thought, "Gosh, I have to be the one with the ‘whip’ and getting them to do homework etc..and ferry them about to extra school and sport commitments!" But then, I was always the one that did that before anyway, so nothing has changed!  Our kids are older (15 & 12) so they also choose where they want to be.  And so far they haven’t spent all holidays with their Dad – they have mostly but not all.  I do feel sorry for guys like you Surf, who want the ‘day to day contact’ and have to fight to get it.  It seems so unfair. I think children are better off if the parenting is shared…if circumstances permit, but it is sad if it is a perpetual fight to be able to do so. On that note..Surf, I know where you are coming from in regard to your children.  All you can do is be there for your children and be as loving as I know you are when you have them.  That is all you can do.  Children need to be loved by both parents and they need to know that both parents loved each other enough to have them and to bring them into the world.  If we can think positive thoughts about our x’s it will reflect in the children’s well being.  There is nothing more sad than children having ‘mixed loyalties’ and feeling they have to be protective over a parent. The feeling of having to protect or be wary of what they say (to their parents about the other parent) should not be encouraged either.  We have to be as open with our children as we would have been if we were still together with them.  We need to try to forget about their ‘new partners’ and that may have an influence on our children’s lives….We need to be strong for our children  (Lolly reminded me of that in a post yesterday when I was feeling pretty weak) and we need to try to not harbour revenge because that only harms us and the children in the end.  Try to be positve about your x Surf. I declared last night I would try to be positive about the kid’s Dad and funny….my son said, "I want to ring Dad now!"  And he did..and talked with him for over an hour and so did my daughter.  It was almost like a release for them…as if they thought, "Well Mum is being really positive about Dad so he must be OK!"  I do think it is a much more loving environment for the kid’s to be in…when we show that…."Dad/Mum  is not such a bad bloke/sheila afterall!!" (Even if he/she isn’t! He/she is still the kid’s Dad/Mum!!!) Yeah!~ Now I am really sidestepping and rambling…It’s almost like the calm after the storm.  I felt so turbulant and restless last night, like I thought, "Gee! Can I go on with another year of unsettled life!"  (To do with my court case which looks like it will go on for another year) Today..I just feel calm.  Like I will just accept what will be. I hope the peaceful feeling lasts in me and Surf…I hope you will feel inner peace about your situation soon and will begin to maybe look at the good points in your x so that one day, you can say friendly kind things to your children about the ‘good times’ you spent as a ‘family’.  I know that I can say that my x and I did have good times.  We had bad….BAD times too. But I want to dwell on the good ones now. Time for a coffee to ‘whet the whistle’! Luv and hugs Kanga

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How fair do you think the Family Law Court is? In *our* country, Kanga? Would be different in the US or UK… Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues Not handled in the Family Court. 2.  Custody issues Flagrant gender bias…no doubt. The pity is, they *know* what gender bias is, they profess not be this way, and then immediately say and do stuff like this…. the counsellor showed my on a whiteboard my ex’s ‘demands’, which included a ‘generous’ 6 days/4 nights per month access for me to my angels. When I asked the patronising counsellor why I was being offerred such a ludicrously small amount of time, she said.."Oh, most men find this quite OK. What with their busy work schedules and all (the liberated women now regresses to 1950s work ethics) that this fits in well." Oh, I say, do you know that my ex works full time? Why aren’t you offerring *her* this? Oh, er, um….it didn’t occur to us that you would like more time. Of course not, because NO ONE IS ASKING ME. You’ve asked her, though. Even the frickkin’ psychologist in his report says that I’ll need to accept that what’s fair to me (50% custody) may not be considered in the best interests of the children. What is implied is that if there is going to be a non-50% arrangement, be warned that as a man you will be wearing the smaller percentage. It is never contemplated that the mother should be asked to accept less. Well, when I go back on Nov 15 for final orders, I’m going in with all guns blazing. 3.  Settlement issues I didn’t think these matters were settled in the Family Court either, Kanga. Is there gender based discrimination? Not the slightest doubt. I’ve watched the process in action, I’ve been part of it, and it is definitely biased. Trouble is, so many of the people in the system can’t see their own bias. Like most discrimination, it’s bound up in subtle ways. The use of words, the assumptions that are unspoken…I know what women pre-1970s must have had to deal with. What do YOU think? It’s what I KNOW now, not what I think. The Australian Family Law Court still sees separated men as rampaging playboys, unconcerned oabout their children and wanting as little time as possible with them. While this might apply to some men, it’s annoying and frustrating to be a caring and loving dad and be treated like an insignificance in your children’s lives. It really is no wonder that many men just give up. The thought of doing this, leaving the state or the country and starting a new life/family elsewhere has occurred to me…and geez…I’m about as committed to fatherhood as one can be. Big Surf Before you buy.

Response:

I know that there are lot of truly good fathers who are hurt by some vindictive women but n the other end of the spectrum, my children and I were both abused by my ex and the judge wouldn’t hear any testimony on it. She said that he could have them for 4-6 months a year. I have to pay him child support when they’re wih him. What is that about ???? I don’t think she got any that month or something.

Response:

I don’t agree that women always get what they want out of a divorce and that men are cheated, that’s a bunch of BS in my case.  I am going through a divorce now, he filed while I was out of town and filed for emergency custody of our 3 year old daughter.  I am not a drug abuser or an alcoholic.  My attorney says he doesn’t think I stand a chance in h— of getting custody of our daughter because rodney has had temp. custody of her since March (his attorney keeps getting our final postponed!)  Now can anyone out there give me some advice, I would really appreciate your help! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

I know that there are lot of truly good fathers who are hurt by some vindictive women but n the other end of the spectrum, my children and I were both abused by my ex and the judge wouldn’t hear any testimony on it. She said that he could have them for 4-6 months a year. I have to pay him child support when they’re wih him. What is that about ???? I don’t think she got any that month or something.

I too have to pay my soon to be ex child support, and we are suppossed to have joint temporary custody,  explain that one! Haha! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Still looking, went to one but it was a Front for a Lawyer. One who I used for a week. Cut her loose when she left me hi and dry in court. a no show when I needed good representation. I was arrested for violating a bogus order of protection. One that was eventually thrown out, The public defender took me on through the process, cost me $1,000 bail and $2,000 for legal fee’s with a criminal lawyer and the whole thing was thrown out of court. So even the supposed "Fathers rights lawyers" are sometinmes worthless. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Right on George. So, can you recommend a group on Long Island for our brother there? Some of the groups that hold themselves out as FR groups are just fronts for lawyers. Folks need to know about the *real* people who are out there on the front lines. And a better group of folks you won’t find anywhere. Best & Kindest – BD Let me just add a couple comments to BD’s excellent followup: Women are damaged by this system, as well.  The second wives in our group are at least as mad as the father’s themselves.  Fathers also have mothers, sisters, girlfriends, daughters, co-workers and all kinds of other people who are affected. This is a malady that evidences itself as persecuted men, but it affects almost everyone. As to the name "Father’s Rights" – well, it *is* not a perfect descriptor, but it immediately tells people who we are, and attracts the primary sufferers.  I was told that "your name has to advertise who you are." And another thing about women in our movement is that they can say the things that we can’t.  If a man was writing about divorce the way that Kathleen Parker has been, he would be denounced as an angry man who just wanted to reassert the patriarchical subjugation of women. When a womans says it, it carries a lot more weight. As I always say, this is not a men vs women issue.  The gender prejudice exists only in the minds of the powerful – the judges and politicians who seek only personal gain, and are willing to destroy the country for it.  And if they thought they could gain a smidgen of money or power by reversing the situation and discarding mothers it would be done in a year. It is not men vs women, it is the powerful vs the people., * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Right on George. So, can you recommend a group on Long Island for our brother there? Some of the groups that hold themselves out as FR groups are just fronts for lawyers.

Okay, I am with the ACFC and the home page (www.acfc.org) does not show any affiliates in NY at all.   I checked the Children’s Rights Council and they list two affiliates in NY: CRC of New York   Suite 1   231 Main Street   Vestal, NY 13850   Mr. Kim Boedecker-Frey, Coordinator   607.785.9338  New York City CRC of New York City 499 Fort Washington Avenue #3D New York, New York 10033 hotline: 212 431 7724 home: 212 740 7008 These would at least enable you to find a group close to you. Good luck, and keep fighting. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Folks need to know about the *real* people who are out there on the front lines. And a better group of folks you won’t find anywhere. Best & Kindest – BD Let me just add a couple comments to BD’s excellent followup: Women are damaged by this system, as well.  The second wives in our group are at least as mad as the father’s themselves.  Fathers also have mothers, sisters, girlfriends, daughters, co-workers and all kinds of other people who are affected. This is a malady that evidences itself as persecuted men, but it affects almost everyone. As to the name "Father’s Rights" – well, it *is* not a perfect descriptor, but it immediately tells people who we are, and attracts the primary sufferers.  I was told that "your name has to advertise who you are." And another thing about women in our movement is that they can say the things that we can’t.  If a man was writing about divorce the way that Kathleen Parker has been, he would be denounced as an angry man who just wanted to reassert the patriarchical subjugation of women. When a womans says it, it carries a lot more weight. As I always say, this is not a men vs women issue.  The gender prejudice exists only in the minds of the powerful – the judges and politicians who seek only personal gain, and are willing to destroy the country for it.  And if they thought they could gain a smidgen of money or power by reversing the situation and discarding mothers it would be done in a year. It is not men vs women, it is the powerful vs the people., * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Right on George. So, can you recommend a group on Long Island for our brother there? Some of the groups that hold themselves out as FR groups are just fronts for lawyers. Folks need to know about the *real* people who are out there on the front lines. And a better group of folks you won’t find anywhere. Best & Kindest – BD – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me just add a couple comments to BD’s excellent followup: Women are damaged by this system, as well.  The second wives in our group are at least as mad as the father’s themselves.  Fathers also have mothers, sisters, girlfriends, daughters, co-workers and all kinds of other people who are affected. This is a malady that evidences itself as persecuted men, but it affects almost everyone. As to the name "Father’s Rights" – well, it *is* not a perfect descriptor, but it immediately tells people who we are, and attracts the primary sufferers.  I was told that "your name has to advertise who you are." And another thing about women in our movement is that they can say the things that we can’t.  If a man was writing about divorce the way that Kathleen Parker has been, he would be denounced as an angry man who just wanted to reassert the patriarchical subjugation of women. When a womans says it, it carries a lot more weight. As I always say, this is not a men vs women issue.  The gender prejudice exists only in the minds of the powerful – the judges and politicians who seek only personal gain, and are willing to destroy the country for it.  And if they thought they could gain a smidgen of money or power by reversing the situation and discarding mothers it would be done in a year. It is not men vs women, it is the powerful vs the people.,

* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Does anyone know of a good group on Long Island in NY???? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – River, You should think about getting involved in some father’s rights groups. There’s a lot of work to be done, and us guys need all the help we can get. The agenda is very simple: "Tell the Truth".  If you do decide to get involved with these groups – plan to get in for the long haul – long term dedicated members are what is needed. The absurd lies and systematic corruption that fathers have to deal with will eventually be put aside by the truth. And since we have the truth on our side – that makes our job easier. But, commitment to the cause is important. That’s were *you* can make a difference. Best & Kindest  -  BD Well, now that we’re not talking about Australian family law court….. 1. no 2. no 3. no For the most part, the woman can do as she wishes, hurt folk as much as she wants, screw around, whatever, and unless she abuses the kids in some significant way, she will get whatever she wants from the courts. There is no justice if you’re a man. How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Response:

Let me just add a couple comments to BD’s excellent followup: Women are damaged by this system, as well.  The second wives in our group are at least as mad as the father’s themselves.  Fathers also have mothers, sisters, girlfriends, daughters, co-workers and all kinds of other people who are affected. This is a malady that evidences itself as persecuted men, but it affects almost everyone. As to the name "Father’s Rights" – well, it *is* not a perfect descriptor, but it immediately tells people who we are, and attracts the primary sufferers.  I was told that "your name has to advertise who you are." And another thing about women in our movement is that they can say the things that we can’t.  If a man was writing about divorce the way that Kathleen Parker has been, he would be denounced as an angry man who just wanted to reassert the patriarchical subjugation of women.  When a womans says it, it carries a lot more weight. As I always say, this is not a men vs women issue.  The gender prejudice exists only in the minds of the powerful – the judges and politicians who seek only personal gain, and are willing to destroy the country for it.  And if they thought they could gain a smidgen of money or power by reversing the situation and discarding mothers it would be done in a year. It is not men vs women, it is the powerful vs the people., – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Right on, Lolita. Hey, Lolly, you know, you’re a pretty cool dudette. You know, those fathers’ right groups could use a smart, compassionate and thoughtful person such as yourself! Hey – what do you say? <g Best & Kindest  -  BD WOW Thanks BD!  *blush* Well, I say: "If I can be of any help, then I’ll be in it!" But would the fathers’ rights groups accept a woman into their inner realm? LSA

Response:

Right on, Lolita. Hey, Lolly, you know, you’re a pretty cool dudette. You know, those fathers’ right groups could use a smart, compassionate and thoughtful person such as yourself! Hey – what do you say? <g Best & Kindest  -  BD – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA Kanga, from the previous posts, and from the way society still thinks, discrimination does exist in the courts, and fortunately, (for you) it’s in your favour. However, I don’t agree with this status-quo at all. Maybe one day into the next millennium, men and women will be treated equally. Here’s hoping that the powers that be become oblivious to gender. I would suggest that instead of seeing someone as an XY, or an XX, they see them as an HB (a human being). LSA

* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

hiya lolita, But would the fathers’ rights groups accept a woman into their inner realm? LSA

    To put it bluntly – a good one would. For these groups to weigh too heavily into the "Screwed NCP father" crowd is not, by many, considered to be the best thing – although those are the folks who certainly have no doubt about the issues. But much support tends to come from many women as well, we see children of divorce, wives and girlfriends of NCP fathers, NCP mothers, grandmothers who are affected by the grandparent issues, and women who find in the "fathers’" groups support for other items of the agenda, such as: government Social Services issues, foster care issues, and any other items of the rather lengthy agenda that the Fathers’ rights groups have taken upon themselves. (Many feel that the term Fathers’ Rights is inaccurate – Family Rights would probably be more accurate – but that tends to be confusing – no one understands that term – or confuses it with the conservative pro-family agenda. NOW has made great hay by blurring this issue.) The few Fathers’ Rights events that I have attended were 60-40 or 50-50 male and female – these issues have a strong attraction to those of either gender who understand them. The problem that many see however is long term commitment – it is necessary for anyone who chooses to get involved in these matters to understand the truly powerful and absurd forces that are attacking those who speak truth of these issues – and attack them in many forms. It downright bizarre. But for change – those who know the truth must be willing to speak it – and furthermore, be willing to work for it. With respect to the serious family court matters, the level of covert, overt and systematic corruption is breathtaking. For those that aren’t willing to get active – (gee, write your congressperson or representative, at least,) then a corrupt system is what they deserve. For those that are willing to work against that corruption – you have earned the right to say: "To hell with those slimly bastards!" And, that is a right that proudly I utilize at every opportunity! <g Best & Kindest –  BD ("I want to know if you will stand in the center of the fire with me and not shrink back."   – Oriah, Mountain Dreamer, Indian Elder – *I Want To Know* ) * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

I never said I would not take care of my kids!

I wasn’t trying to imply that you weren’t, I was responding to the ?myth? of the deadbeat dad. I felt just like you, was going to fight to my last penny to get my kids back. I saw how this was affecting them, and decided to put myself on hold to keep frim putting them through further pain. My two are 6 and 9.  I just said a lot of NCP’s are not as strong and after all the BS they get put through they just give up and split.

I didn’t give up and split, I just don’t want any more pain, and I want the fighting to stop. It’s not good for me, her, or the kids. I for one am going to fight the bitch until I have either won (by winning I mean get my relationship with my two older kids back or get custody in which case they’lll be going to theropy for years to come) or I go backrupt and have lost all financial resources. I refuse to give in for the sake of my 3 kids. I just took the youngest back a little while ago. She’s six and it always hurts when I drop her off because even with a court order saying I can call her every night between 7 and 7:30 her mother leaves the phone off the hook so I cannot get through.

I took my kids *home* last night, and they both cried about how it’s not fair that they only see me every other weekend. It hurts like hell, but waht are the alternatives? To have them cry when their mom brings them home to me because that’s not fair? I’m not trying to say that you shouldn’t fight for your kids, but I am saying that for *me* that it would only cause more heartbreak all the way around.  I for one will not give up so long as I’m breathing. The last thing – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – my little girl said tonight was Thank you for a great weekend and I love you. That’s what makes it worth fighting for. So for those who are tired of the ex’s bs just do it for the kids!!!!! I know that as far as I’m concerned, even though I feel greatly screwed by the courst and me s2bx, I still take my responsibilities to my children very seriously. Getting screwed by you wife is no excuse to screw over your kids. <snip The men get fed up and leave, so thats why we have so many deadbeat dads. THEY ARE FED UP WITH THE CRAP THE LEGAL SYSTEM GIVES THEM! BEAR If the statistics are even half correct in Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths by Sanford L. Braver & Diane O’Connell, the number of deadbeat dads is quite small once you exclude those in prison, on welfare or otherwise unable to pay… at least in the US. Floridanewbie

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Right on, Lolita. Hey, Lolly, you know, you’re a pretty cool dudette. You know, those fathers’ right groups could use a smart, compassionate and thoughtful person such as yourself! Hey – what do you say? <g Best & Kindest  -  BD WOW Thanks BD!  *blush* Well, I say: "If I can be of any help, then I’ll be in it!" But would the fathers’ rights groups accept a woman into their inner

realm? As long as you serve the beer and wash up afterwards. LOL!!! Big Surf Before you buy.

Response:

Arizona State University research psychologist Sanford Braver conducted the largest federally funded study of divorced fathers. As part of his research, he conducted a survey asking similar questions. The results are discussed in his book; "Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths." How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Before you buy.

Response:

I never said I would not take care of my kids! I just said a lot of NCP’s are not as strong and after all the BS they get put through they just give up and split. I for one am going to fight the bitch until I have either won (by winning I mean get my relationship with my two older kids back or get custody in which case they’lll be going to theropy for years to come) or I go backrupt and have lost all financial resources. I refuse to give in for the sake of my 3 kids. I just took the youngest back a little while ago. She’s six and it always hurts when I drop her off because even with a court order saying I can call her every night between 7 and 7:30 her mother leaves the phone off the hook so I cannot get through. I for one will not give up so long as I’m breathing. The last thing my little girl said tonight was Thank you for a great weekend and I love you. That’s what makes it worth fighting for. So for those who are tired of the ex’s bs just do it for the kids!!!!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I know that as far as I’m concerned, even though I feel greatly screwed by the courst and me s2bx, I still take my responsibilities to my children very seriously. Getting screwed by you wife is no excuse to screw over your kids. <snip The men get fed up and leave, so thats why we have so many deadbeat dads. THEY ARE FED UP WITH THE CRAP THE LEGAL SYSTEM GIVES THEM! BEAR If the statistics are even half correct in Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths by Sanford L. Braver & Diane O’Connell, the number of deadbeat dads is quite small once you exclude those in prison, on welfare or otherwise unable to pay… at least in the US. Floridanewbie

Response:

River, You should think about getting involved in some father’s rights groups. There’s a lot of work to be done, and us guys need all the help we can get. The agenda is very simple: "Tell the Truth".  If you do decide to get involved with these groups – plan to get in for the long haul – long term dedicated members are what is needed. The absurd lies and systematic corruption that fathers have to deal with will eventually be put aside by the truth. And since we have the truth on our side – that makes our job easier. But, commitment to the cause is important. That’s were *you* can make a difference. Best & Kindest  -  BD – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, now that we’re not talking about Australian family law court….. 1. no 2. no 3. no For the most part, the woman can do as she wishes, hurt folk as much as she wants, screw around, whatever, and unless she abuses the kids in some significant way, she will get whatever she wants from the courts. There is no justice if you’re a man. How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Response:

Right on, Lolita. Hey, Lolly, you know, you’re a pretty cool dudette. You know, those fathers’ right groups could use a smart, compassionate and thoughtful person such as yourself! Hey – what do you say? <g Best & Kindest  -  BD

WOW Thanks BD!  *blush* Well, I say: "If I can be of any help, then I’ll be in it!" But would the fathers’ rights groups accept a woman into their inner realm? LSA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Kanga, from the previous posts, and from the way society still thinks, discrimination does exist in the courts, and fortunately, (for you) it’s in your favour. However, I don’t agree with this status-quo at all. Maybe one day into the next millennium, men and women will be treated equally. Here’s hoping that the powers that be become oblivious to gender. I would suggest that instead of seeing someone as an XY, or an XX, they see them as an HB (a human being). LSA

Response:

I know that as far as I’m concerned, even though I feel greatly screwed by the courst and me s2bx, I still take my responsibilities to my children very seriously. Getting screwed by you wife is no excuse to screw over your kids.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip The men get fed up and leave, so thats why we have so many deadbeat dads. THEY ARE FED UP WITH THE CRAP THE LEGAL SYSTEM GIVES THEM! BEAR If the statistics are even half correct in Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths by Sanford L. Braver & Diane O’Connell, the number of deadbeat dads is quite small once you exclude those in prison, on welfare or otherwise unable to pay… at least in the US. Floridanewbie

Response:

<snip The men get fed up and leave, so thats why we have so many deadbeat dads. THEY ARE FED UP WITH THE CRAP THE LEGAL SYSTEM GIVES THEM! BEAR

If the statistics are even half correct in Divorced Dads: Shattering the Myths by Sanford L. Braver & Diane O’Connell, the number of deadbeat dads is quite small once you exclude those in prison, on welfare or otherwise unable to pay… at least in the US. Floridanewbie

Response:

Well, now that we’re not talking about Australian family law court….. 1. no 2. no 3. no For the most part, the woman can do as she wishes, hurt folk as much as she wants, screw around, whatever, and unless she abuses the kids in some significant way, she will get whatever she wants from the courts. There is no justice if you’re a man.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Response:

This is how Family Court is no matter where you are! New york is just as bad, a woman can walk in, make an allegation and she has an "Order of Protection" , I’ve been though is 7 times in 2 years. My S2BX goes in and claims I did something. Now when I pick up the kids I bring the Police and she complains to her lawyer. Its offencive, but its ti,e protect my self. Not only has she gotten these orders but had me put in jail 3 times for violating them and it cost me money to get the criminal charges dropped. She violates the Suppreme Court orders for visitation and nothing happens. We’re not not even divorced yet and she lives with her boyfriend and my kids in the house I’m paying for and its in my name. I have to hire a Privite Detective to prove it. Its the way of the court, the woman gets away with it all, she gets the kids, the property and most of your income. The men get fed up and leave, so thats why we have so many deadbeat dads. THEY ARE FED UP WITH THE CRAP THE LEGAL SYSTEM GIVES THEM! BEAR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, now that we’re not talking about Australian family law court….. 1. no 2. no 3. no For the most part, the woman can do as she wishes, hurt folk as much as she wants, screw around, whatever, and unless she abuses the kids in some significant way, she will get whatever she wants from the courts. There is no justice if you’re a man. How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Response:

How fair do you think the Family Law Court is?  Does justice does prevail in the areas of: 1.  Child support issues 2.  Custody issues 3.  Settlement issues Is there gender based discrimination? What do YOU think? KANGA

Response:

Question:

Hi all, This is more finance than accounting, but I thought someone might be able to at least recommend where to go to find out the answer to my question.  I couldn’t see a newsgroup dealing directly with swaps, bonds, or finance (other than personal finance). BTW: I tried asking my lecturer/tutor but he is TERRIBLE at explaining things.  He is normally a physics lecturer (say no more). Can anyone please explain to me how swaps are valued using bonds?  The formula for the fixed bond (ie, fixed part of the swap) is calculated by discounting all the future interest payments, and the final principal payment, back to current prices.  The floating bond is calculated by just discounting the current interest payment (based on the previous LIBOR), as well as the principal back to todays rate.  So if the swap had 1.5 years to go with interest payments every 6 months, under the fixed bond you would discount  the first payment at the risk-free rate for 0.5 years, the second pmt at the risk-free rate for 1 year, the third pmt (includes interest & principal) at the risk-free rate for 1.5 yrs. Under the floating bond, the next interest (in 6 months) payment and the principal are discounted at the risk-free rate for 0.5 years.  So I guess I am wondering why the floating rate isn’t calculated by discounting back to current prices all the interest payments (at the probable future interest rate) as well as the principal.  Regardless of whether the principal is paid back in 6 months or 3 years, it is still discounted back as if it were going to be paid at the next interest date. All my tutor said was that Bfl (ie, floating bond) will equal the notional principal in the swap agreement immediately after the next payment date. All the formulas we have been given assume continuous compounding of interest(, ie, e^rt) Thanks for any help anyone can provide – this stuff is really tough!! ADAM

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, This is more finance than accounting, but I thought someone might be able to at least recommend where to go to find out the answer to my question.  I couldn’t see a newsgroup dealing directly with swaps, bonds, or finance (other than personal finance). BTW: I tried asking my lecturer/tutor but he is TERRIBLE at explaining things.  He is normally a physics lecturer (say no more). Can anyone please explain to me how swaps are valued using bonds?  The formula for the fixed bond (ie, fixed part of the swap) is calculated by discounting all the future interest payments, and the final principal payment, back to current prices.  The floating bond is calculated by just discounting the current interest payment (based on the previous LIBOR), as well as the principal back to todays rate.  So if the swap had 1.5 years to go with interest payments every 6 months, under the fixed bond you would discount  the first payment at the risk-free rate for 0.5 years, the second pmt at the risk-free rate for 1 year, the third pmt (includes interest & principal) at the risk-free rate for 1.5 yrs. Under the floating bond, the next interest (in 6 months) payment and the principal are discounted at the risk-free rate for 0.5 years.  So I guess I am wondering why the floating rate isn’t calculated by discounting back to current prices all the interest payments (at the probable future interest rate) as well as the principal.  Regardless of whether the principal is paid back in 6 months or 3 years, it is still discounted back as if it were going to be paid at the next interest date. All my tutor said was that Bfl (ie, floating bond) will equal the notional principal in the swap agreement immediately after the next payment date. All the formulas we have been given assume continuous compounding of interest(, ie, e^rt) Thanks for any help anyone can provide – this stuff is really tough!! ADAM there a lot of literature about swap valuation.

you can get a good example, and easy of understand, in the financial accounting standards board. (www.fasb.org). there is a course of financial instruments and some part of it is free. In the free part you can get the example of a swap valuation.  Also in the sfas 133 accounting for derivatives and hedging activities there are some examples. you can not get it in internet, but you would have the FASB statement in the library of your university.  there it follow the compond interest method. They are very simple, because they want to explain how to account a swap, nor how to value it. the valuation of a swap can be done of many forms, so i need your example to know where are you lost. i can say some things: 1. if you want to value the swaps as bond you must know that the swap there are only paymetn of interest, there are not exchange of principal (generally). 2. The best way is to value the payment of interest throught zero coupon bond. so the fixed part will be a sum zero copuon where with a period of life according to each payment. 3. to discount the payment of the swap you better has to use "forward rate of interst", nor spot rates. 4. in valuing the variable part, you have only to consider the next payment because the other payment will be value its nominal:  (1+i) Nominal of debt/ (1+i). think about it and if you want we can work with an example. A question; as you can see i am not english speaking (i am from spain) what do you mean when you say your lecture is a "physics lecturer") Is that mean that he read its lessons? in what university are you studing? bet wishes Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

We have contemplated developing a general purpose application framework that includes code to synchronize general journal (only) entries between it and a QuickBooks file.  It would operate with the limitation that for any non account resource being monitored (such as inventory, a/r, a/p, etc.) – either it takes full responsibility, or it lets QuickBooks take full responsibility for that type of resource. How severe this limitation would be depends on what the application is doing – in some cases this limitation is substantial.

This product would be fantastically useful, even with that limitation. I understand that your product would have to be a batch application, because it would create IIF files rather than actually writing entries into the .QBW file.  Thus, there wouldn’t be realtime sharing of the ledger anyway.   Would you please advise if I have the facts right, and on the likelihood or delivery date of your product? * Todd F. Boyle CPA    http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033       (425) 827-3107 * XML Accounting Web ledger ASP netledger, web GL Dialtone, whatever.

Response:

Does anyone know how you could import in physical inventories and / or purchase orders and / or sales order data into QuickBooks? Thanks, Steve

You need to import transactions using  Intuit’s IIF file format to do the above. We sell a QuickBooks export product called Office/Q.  Below is a prewritten q/a that we send to customers asking about importing into QuickBooks: Can Office/Q be used to import data or do you have another product that can import data into QuickBooks? No, not directly.  This is a very difficult thing to do because of relationships between data in QuickBooks files that must be preserved and the complexity of the internal file format.  Much of the data that we export is derived from other data in the file – and the relationships between the data are very complex. As an example, importing a single vendor bill can change stored data in every subsequent (by date) cash sale, invoice, or credit memo that contains inventory items from that vendor bill.  There are several complex ‘relationships’ like this – most involve transactions. Internally, some of these relationships are different in different versions of QuickBooks.  Properly dealing with this stuff would be beyond the capabilities of most programmers – with the result that the file would be unreadable by QuickBooks. In addition, there is considerable housekeeping data, indexes, pointers, etc. that QuickBooks maintains internally that we would need to duplicate.  Some of this data changes significantly between different QuickBooks versions. We’ve been asked to do an import product hundreds of times. Basically, there’s no product we could create that would be a significant improvement over importing using the IIF file format.  When IIF files are imported, they are processed through the same transaction processing logic used by manually input data. IIF is very powerful, but the learning curve is long because you need to really understand QuickBooks.  Intuit’s documentation of the IIF file format is insufficient for many cases.  Office/Q helps tremendously because you can make small changes using IIF test files and observe how the file itself is changed. Also, one of the biggest problems creating IIF files is that new fields often need to exactly match existing records in the file. Office/Q can be used to programmatically observe what is already in the file – as data is created to insert. IIF import works very well in cases where there is a high volume of a few types of identical transactions that are input as a regular part of doing business.  Typical examples:  customer invoices that recur very frequently – such as monthly identical billings, transactions input through web forms, etc. – or very frequently recurring payables, statement charges, journal entries, etc.  In these cases, the development work is highly leveraged and the program that generates the data is controllable. IIF does not work well for ‘one shot’ projects where there are a large number of different types of transactions – such as transferring data from one QuickBooks file or another accounting program to a QuickBooks file.  Each type of transaction requires a significant amount of work – and many QuickBooks transaction types cannot be imported using IIF. In addition, data that has been imported into a QuickBooks file using IIF can never be deleted or modified using IIF (although it can be deleted / modified using the user interface).  This makes it difficult to create synchronized applications where data from the feeding application can change. Also, there are some types of transactions (such as paychecks) that can’t be imported using IIF. We have contemplated developing a general purpose application framework that includes code to synchronize general journal (only) entries between it and a QuickBooks file.  It would operate with the limitation that for any non account resource being monitored (such as inventory, a/r, a/p, etc.) – either it takes full responsibility, or it lets QuickBooks take full responsibility for that type of resource. How severe this limitation would be depends on what the application is doing – in some cases this limitation is substantial. Because of the high demand, in early September, we are going to start doing IIF consulting projects for companies that need to import data into QuickBooks.  Typical cost will be $2k-$4k and will include complete analysis of the application, documentation, source code, etc. We are willing to fixed bid these if the customer has a thorough specification.  We will have 1 or 2 employees dedicated full time to these projects.  We have done a couple of these projects before and they have been very successful.  We have very deep knowledge of how QuickBooks works internally – which gives us a big advantage in doing this type of work.      Scott Treseder, Office/Q Developer      100% QuickBooks to VBA data extraction Clone your QuickBooks file to an Access 97 database Plus ActiveX DLL for Delphi, C++, Java, SqlServer http://www.datablox.com/qb/qboview.htm  Spokane, WA

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Because of the high demand, in early September, we are going to start doing IIF consulting projects for companies that need to import data into QuickBooks.  Typical cost will be $2k-$4k and will include complete analysis of the application, documentation, source code, etc. We are willing to fixed bid these if the customer has a thorough specification.  We will have 1 or 2 employees dedicated full time to these projects.  We have done a couple of these projects before and they have been very successful.  We have very deep knowledge of how QuickBooks works internally – which gives us a big advantage in doing this type of work.

May I suggest a fairly simple product, that would be quite useful: an XML addon. The Datablox XML addon would be a DLL which could be used by any COM-based development environment such as VB, ISAPI, etc. to read the .QBW file and generate text output.   The text output would be accessible immediately in memory or outputted to files on disk, transmitted over internet, etc. The text output would be formatted in standard XML so that it could be presented visually on browsers, or read or executed by any remote machines or software capable of reading XML. There would be three broad classes of text output: 1.  tranactions output such as invoices, POs, and payments.  These would be formatted in accordance with XML standards such as Biztalk, cXML, OAGi, Rosetta, XML/EDI, OFX/IFX etc. This would enable a Quickbooks user to participate in internet commerce without changing platforms or going thru the monopoly gateway being build on Intuit.com. 2. reports which are listings of transactions, account debits/credits, journals, aging lists, etc.  These will be formatted in accordance with your own tag set which would enshrine into a DTD the obvious tags which are hardcoded into every Quickbooks report. 3. Financial Statements.  These will be formatted in accordance with the AICPA’s GAAP XML which is due to be announced in August 1999. This will enable any Quickbooks user to publish XML Financial Statements way ahead of all the other software packages except Great Plains who are involved in actually writing the rules on GAAP XML right now. Taken as a whole, the 2nd and 3rd functions above would be good for small business, because XML is becoming a Lingua Franca for transmitting accounting data in machine readable format. Many other smaller software providers will be able to import and export accounting data, enabling less of a monopoly by large vendors.   Quickbooks data could be imported by any XML-enabled accounting software for a free trial.  Those vendors need Datablox XML, because there is no way they can invest the cost of learning the QBW format like you have done, Scott. Please begin working on Datablox XML immediately, and do not wait for XML DTDs.  If your software depends on the structure of the DTD, it’s written wrong anyway.  The whole point of XML is to enable content-independent code.  I suspect that you will find a lot of generic XML components and code already written, which can be used as components with your existing DLL right out of the box.  For example the ADO driver for XML reads and writes XML docs much as the familiar text driver for DAO or ADO can open an ASCII Text file such as a .CSV file, as a database. Get ready to have your head turned upside down by the whole new thinking in XML data manipulation: forget about the table and row structure in SQL and databases.  XML is a tree structure.   arrrgggh.. * Todd F. Boyle CPA    http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033       (425) 827-3107 * XML Accounting Web ledger ASP netledger, web GL Dialtone, whatever.

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Does anyone know how you could import in physical inventories and / or purchase orders and / or sales order data into QuickBooks? Thanks, Steve

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Question:

Maybe we should check the positions of the planets; it seems that several of us had a "Lost Weekend"! Bird Since 11/1 128/130/110

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: Maybe we should check the positions of the planets; it seems that several of us : had a "Lost Weekend"! I sure did. AAACK. I think that after several months of doing all low carb, it’s becoming obvious I’ll have to reintroduce carbs slowly, not jump feet-first into the CAD lifestyle again. Sigh. Not posting my real numbers (hanging head in shame) Lydia 145/140/130 — Lydia Ash                         /       I don’t want the world. http://falcon.cc.ukans.edu/~ash /

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Maybe we should check the positions of the planets; it seems that several of us had a "Lost Weekend"! Bird

Count me in. .  Went to a wedding on Sat.  Had pesto ravioli for an hors doeuvre.  But I also had scallops wrapped in bacon:).  Didnt do too badly at dinner – just 2 pieces of Roast Beef(no mashed potaotoes and no bread) but drank A LOT of wine:(.  Then yesterday I went to my moms for dinner and had ravioli with marinara sauce, a meatball and a piece of Italian bread.  Back on the low carb bandwagon today! Sue

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Count me in too.  This past weekend, I decided to try CAD and I used breakfast as my reward meal.  The first day I felt fine, but the second day on it, I felt terrible.  My stomach was hurting so bad.  I felt like total crap. And I gained 5 lbs.  Back to induction for me. Joe 201/170.5/165 since June 07, 1998

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Well it even reached over here to New Zealand. My son had his farewell from his work, and his bosses invited me along, and lo and behold — an Italian restaurant. Well I couldn’t see much LC fare there and thought what the hang, I’ll just go for it … I’ve been the same weight for months ANYWAY!! Had pasta, Tiramisu, wine … plus some ‘legal’ food too. Weight went from 201.5 to 205.5 …. I just jumped back on the LC wagon.  didn’t even have any cravings, just felt a bit bloaty.  Well low and behold, in the last week I have gotten back under 199.5 – I got there a month or so ago but bounced back up despite keeping consistently lowcarb. Funny too because when I had a controlled "cheat" to try and bump my metabolism, it didn’t work.  THis time, when I thought "darn it all!" it DID work!!!  There’s no accounting for bodies, but I just hope I can remain in the beloved 100’s now!!! Maybe we should check the positions of the planets; it seems that several of us had a "Lost Weekend"! Bird Count me in. .  Went to a wedding on Sat.  Had pesto ravioli for an hors doeuvre.  But I also had scallops wrapped in bacon:).  Didnt do too badly at dinner – just 2 pieces of Roast Beef(no mashed potaotoes and no bread) but drank A LOT of wine:(.  Then yesterday I went to my moms for dinner and had ravioli with marinara sauce, a meatball and a piece of Italian bread.  Back on the low carb bandwagon today! Sue

– ~^

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Depending on what version of MAS90 you are working with you might be able to make use of Alias Item numbers to have some of the more customer specific numbering show on the invoice. Also, before you give up in despair — try going to http://www.macabe.com as they have a ton of pre-packaged modifications for MAS90. Just be sure to check with them and verify any modifications you are interested in are available for MAS90 for Windows. Good luck! Regards, Wayne Schulz Schulz Consulting http://www.s-consult.com MAS 90 accounting software consultants since 1986 860-295-9271 Keywords: MAS90 , Connecticut, CT, Accounting, Support

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I work for a $5million parts distribution company that is trying to find a good software match for the full range of accounting:  inventory, billing, payables, purchasing, gl, etc.  We’re trying to get MAS90 for DOS to work for us with only minimal success…it’s pretty restrictive.  One major problem is with inventory… we need to be able to show the customers part number on all the documentation and invoices while pulling our own part number from stock. MAS90 requires our part number be used in order to pull it from inventory. Kitting doesn’t work since you can’t dropship kits. (using customer part number as a kit number with our part number as a component)  MAS90 wants $10,000-$12,000 to upgrade from DOS to their Windows version, so we might as well look at a different system for that kind of expense, and we don’t know that the new version will be that much of an improvement. Can anyone suggest a more flexible program that is reasonably priced? Any ideas on a temporary solution to this inventory problem (at least until we can get a better software program implemented)?

The SouthWare Excellence Series has the capabilities you are requesting. It can be configured to support a part number that is up to 30 digits long. It can also allow ordering from a vendor catalog that is MUCH larger than your stock file.  It also supports vendor numbering, customer numbering, replacement parts, related parts.  It also does your drop ship.  Price is about the same as MAS 90, but there are more modules. Read more about it at  http://www.excelco.com/swinfo.htm  RFQ http://www.excelco.com/ven/southw.htm  Features and Flexibility Chart — John Mosier,  excelco    voice: (800) 553-6911      fax: (602) 992-2026 Phoenix, AZ 85028        http://excelco.com/ Accounting System Selector

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I work for a $5million parts distribution company that is trying to find a good software match for the full range of accounting:  inventory, billing, payables, purchasing, gl, etc.  We’re trying to get MAS90 for DOS to work for us with only minimal success…it’s pretty restrictive.  One major problem is with inventory… we need to be able to show the customers part number on all the documentation and invoices while pulling our own part number from stock. MAS90 requires our part number be used in order to pull it from inventory. Kitting doesn’t work since you can’t dropship kits. (using customer part number as a kit number with our part number as a component)  MAS90 wants $10,000-$12,000 to upgrade from DOS to their Windows version, so we might as well look at a different system for that kind of expense, and we don’t know that the new version will be that much of an improvement. Can anyone suggest a more flexible program that is reasonably priced? Any ideas on a temporary solution to this inventory problem (at least until we can get a better software program implemented)?

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I believe the state where work is performed has jurisdiction over income tax assessment and payroll withholding by employers. You will find that persons working in Illinois will have Illinois tax withheld. They then will take a credit on thier Indiana return for income tax paid to Illinois. Ok….I work for a very large payroll processing company.  I’m trying to resolve issues with the rescinding of the reciprocal agreement between IL and IN.  The question of the day (which the states themselves can’t give a consistent answer on) is this: If someone lives in IL and works in IN, you have state withholding of 3.4% for IN…but do the taxes show on the W-2 as taxable for both IL and IN? And then the employee just apply for a credit of payments from IN to IL at the end of the year? Because if they live in IN and work in IL then you withhold 3.0% for IL and .4% for IN and show the wages taxable in *both* states.  This we have as fact. Any help would be appreciated. K.

    I had a client who was a truck driver.  The rule of thumb is, the State they live in.  My client drove from Indiana to Michigan.  Also from time to time, the drove to other States.  That doesn’t matter. They lived in Indiana. — Covey Accounting Service, L.L.C. http://user.centralnet.net/dcovey      Accounting and database specialist.

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I believe the state where work is performed has jurisdiction over income tax assessment and payroll withholding by employers. You will find that persons working in Illinois will have Illinois tax withheld. They then will take a credit on thier Indiana return for income tax paid to Illinois. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok….I work for a very large payroll processing company.  I’m trying to resolve issues with the rescinding of the reciprocal agreement between IL and IN.  The question of the day (which the states themselves can’t give a consistent answer on) is this: If someone lives in IL and works in IN, you have state withholding of 3.4% for IN…but do the taxes show on the W-2 as taxable for both IL and IN? And then the employee just apply for a credit of payments from IN to IL at the end of the year? Because if they live in IN and work in IL then you withhold 3.0% for IL and .4% for IN and show the wages taxable in *both* states.  This we have as fact. Any help would be appreciated. K.

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Ok….I work for a very large payroll processing company.  I’m trying to resolve issues with the rescinding of the reciprocal agreement between IL and IN.  The question of the day (which the states themselves can’t give a consistent answer on) is this: If someone lives in IL and works in IN, you have state withholding of 3.4% for IN…but do the taxes show on the W-2 as taxable for both IL and IN? And then the employee just apply for a credit of payments from IN to IL at the end of the year? Because if they live in IN and work in IL then you withhold 3.0% for IL and .4% for IN and show the wages taxable in *both* states.  This we have as fact. Any help would be appreciated. K.

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Question:

Translation: vaporware.  CYMA is taking a page straight out of Microsoft’s book. Remember Windows ‘92 er ‘95. Arthur Anderson Technologies?  Hopefully they’ll support this better than they’ve supported their packages in the past, and hopefully this works better than their fixed assets package. surfer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     CYMA Systems is doing just fine. A lot of the functionality that you are looking for will be coming in future upgrades to the product and much of it will be introduced in the appropriate modules. They are planning a major overhaul of the payroll module this summer ( Sept/Oct release date ) and the Inventory module is scheduled to be developed this fall ( Dec/Jan release date(?)). CYMA had originally planned to develop the Inventory module  late last year, but changed plans and developed the Client Writeup module in its place in order to accomodate Arther Anderson Technologies. CYMA had originally planned to develop the Client Writeup module late this year. If there is a feature which you don’t see but would like, write to CYMA Systems     The rumors regarding the financial health of CYMA Systems are misinformation being spread by a disgrundled ex-employee. In fact, CYMA finished last year in the black. Tim Scheidler J. T. Mudd and Associates, Inc. a certified CYMA dealer -Hey!   Have you heard anything more? -I am very impressed with their ledger.   True, it isn’t as -fully integrated or feature rich as Peachtree Quickbooks or -Accpac… a dangerous situation for them. -They have a tieup with Andersen.  Andersen A+ Tax -software imports ledgers from CYMA.   Cool feature, AFAIC. -I expect CYMA will pull thru somehow.  They burned a hell -of a lot of cash on promotion in 1997.  Shoulda spent it on -developmt, in my opinion.  Maybe they will just remain very -small?  There are tons of small "cottage industry" ledgers, -which will be there forever. -The accounting market is very very tough.  See the -Accounting Technology mag. art. this month with -cover art. "Consolidation" of software vendors….. -* Todd F. Boyle CPA              www.isomedia.com/homes/tboyle -* 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033            (425) 827-3107 -* co-moderator        biz.comp.accounting -Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new -product. – -I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving -they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running -behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be -scrapped. -Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new -product. – -I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving -they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running -behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be -scrapped.

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    CYMA Systems is doing just fine. A lot of the functionality that you are looking for will be coming in future upgrades to the product and much of it will be introduced in the appropriate modules. They are planning a major overhaul of the payroll module this summer ( Sept/Oct release date ) and the Inventory module is scheduled to be developed this fall ( Dec/Jan release date(?)). CYMA had originally planned to develop the Inventory module  late last year, but changed plans and developed the Client Writeup module in its place in order to accomodate Arther Anderson Technologies. CYMA had originally planned to develop the Client Writeup module late this year. If there is a feature which you don’t see but would like, write to CYMA Systems     The rumors regarding the financial health of CYMA Systems are misinformation being spread by a disgrundled ex-employee. In fact, CYMA finished last year in the black. Tim Scheidler J. T. Mudd and Associates, Inc. a certified CYMA dealer -Hey!   Have you heard anything more? -I am very impressed with their ledger.   True, it isn’t as -fully integrated or feature rich as Peachtree Quickbooks or -Accpac… a dangerous situation for them. -They have a tieup with Andersen.  Andersen A+ Tax -software imports ledgers from CYMA.   Cool feature, AFAIC. -I expect CYMA will pull thru somehow.  They burned a hell -of a lot of cash on promotion in 1997.  Shoulda spent it on -developmt, in my opinion.  Maybe they will just remain very -small?  There are tons of small "cottage industry" ledgers, -which will be there forever. -The accounting market is very very tough.  See the -Accounting Technology mag. art. this month with -cover art. "Consolidation" of software vendors….. -* Todd F. Boyle CPA              www.isomedia.com/homes/tboyle -* 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033            (425) 827-3107 -* co-moderator        biz.comp.accounting -Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new -product. – -I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving -they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running -behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be -scrapped.

-Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new -product. – -I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving -they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running -behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be -scrapped.

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Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new product. I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be scrapped.

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Hey!   Have you heard anything more? I am very impressed with their ledger.   True, it isn’t as fully integrated or feature rich as Peachtree Quickbooks or Accpac… a dangerous situation for them. They have a tieup with Andersen.  Andersen A+ Tax software imports ledgers from CYMA.   Cool feature, AFAIC. I expect CYMA will pull thru somehow.  They burned a hell of a lot of cash on promotion in 1997.  Shoulda spent it on developmt, in my opinion.  Maybe they will just remain very small?  There are tons of small "cottage industry" ledgers, which will be there forever.   The accounting market is very very tough.  See the Accounting Technology mag. art. this month with cover art. "Consolidation" of software vendors….. * Todd F. Boyle CPA              www.isomedia.com/homes/tboyle * 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033            (425) 827-3107 * co-moderator        biz.comp.accounting Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new product. I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be scrapped.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard about the problems CYMA Systems is having with its new product. I have heard that they about to go under.  Since prior to Thanksgiving they have laid off about 2/3s of their employees.  They are running behind on their updates and it looks like the inventory module will be scrapped.

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Question:

SU- Mr. Campbell is giving aviation, journalism, and yes, the internet, a bad name.  I find it really sad that his threats and intimidation  in the face of reasonable questioning are I guess that is where I would have to disagree…  I have been lurking around here for awhile and all I saw was someone posting messages about airplanes, who was being constantly attacked personaly by a group of individuals with an obvious "ax to grind"…  I didn’t consider them "reasonable questions"…  If they were asked of me, I would have replied that "it was none of your business"… Since no one knows who you are, or what is in your past, you must agree with that principle (no flame intended, just an observation) Personaly, I don’t care who he is, who you are, or who anyone else is or what they do or have done, as long as they write about airplanes (preferably homebuilt)…  that is what he was doing, his accusers were not… SU- A close friend of mine has been harassed, SU- intimidated…by Mr. Campbell, as well as slandered in his SU- magazine. Then he should pursue mr. campbell thru the courts to redress any wrong done him, but it doesn’t belong in the rec.aviation conference… SU- Mr. Campbell likes to think of himself as larger than life and SU- self important, and his vehicle for inflating his ego and SU- self image is his magazine.  What he is now trying to do is to SU- establish himself online so that he can continue this trend in SU- cyberspace. I don’t care if his ego is the size of Texas, and he’s the world’s biggest horses A**…  If he wants to write about airplanes, I’ll read his posts and decided for myself if the information is worthwhile… SU- rebuttal or regard for the truth.  The difference between the ‘net SU- and his magazine is that people have a chance to say what the SU- real deal is about Campbell and I couldn’t care less what "the real deal is about Campbell"… On the other hand, if you wish to comment or dispute posts/articles, or take exception what is said about a particular airplanes, flame away… SU- Exposing his real history, which he has vigorously sought SU- to suppress, is merely establishing a baseline of just where SU- his credibility-level really is. Again, unless EVERYONE in this conference is subject to the same scrutiny, it’s none of your/my/our business… SU- There’s still an awful lot about US Aviator’s publisher and SU- editor-in-chief that needs to be said, questioned, and SU- analyzed in public….. I don’t think it is inappropriate SU- that this newsgroup serve as a public forum for that discussion. I guess that’s the bottom line, and my whole disagreement with this thread…  I do not believe that this is the forum to discuss your personal problems with mr Campbell…  most of us here want to talk about airplanes, not mr campbell, his magazine, threats made by him or to him, what he did 15 years ago, whether he still beats his wife, who or what he is sleeping with or how often he showers and brushes his teeth…  take it someplace where someone cares, or start your own rec.avaitionIhatecampbell conference… SU- BTW, I prefer to remain anonymous not to snipe from the sidelines, If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck….. SU- or because I have anything to hide Sunsquid, just wondering, do you still beat your wife… I want a full accounting, and don’t try to be evasive, or your credibility within this conference will be found lacking and no one will be allowed to read your posts…. Larry BTW – to everyone else in this conference, I appologize for replying       again on this thread…  I’ll try to refrain from polluting the       net with my ramblings on this topic…. —