Question:

So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be done from home?  Any input would help! Hope you’re all great, Katie — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

{{{{{{{Katie}}}}}}}  Wish I could help.  :-( Di

So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be done from home?  Any input would help! Hope you’re all great, Katie

– The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be done from home?  Any input would help! Hope you’re all great, Katie

Hi Katie, I’ve spent years thinking long and hard about what jobs I might be able to do from home as an anxiety disorder person. Among my own thoughts have been writing about anxiety disorders, writing about personal experience, writing fiction, somehow inventing some great and novel computer program or game, etc. Personally, I keep running into a few obstacles. * First, it’s really hard to come up with unique and wonderful ideas and, even when we do, it’s hard to sell it to publishers, distributors or the like. * Regarding anxiety disorders, I have problems "selling" material to fellow patients because I feel that would be taking advantage of people like myself. Though I have been published in this sense, I’ve never made any money from my writing. * If I could create a product I felt comfortable selling, would this be simply a "one-hit-wonder" that damages my disability status and does not result in a sustainable, long-term income? * If I could provide a service for an employer from home, would this damage my disability status, include good medical insurance and would this provide secure income to live from? * Would working from home involve a level of stress that would be unhealthy for an anxiety disorder person like myself? I don’t want to sound entirely negative. For each of us, there may be some wonderful, creative and comfortable solution. I’ve been looking for such a solution for a long time, I was thinking about it today and I’ll keep thinking about it. I’m just saying that home employment is difficult for most anxiety disorder people. Especially people with severe and chronic forms of anxiety disorders who often get neglected in more general statistics. Best Wishes, Arthur — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

Hi Katie:  I hope you will explore some therapy options before giving up on your job.  While there are jobs that can be done at home, some of them require very specialized skills:  medical transcribing, bookkeeping and accounting, graphic design, copyediting and page layout, to name a few. Staying at home may simply increase your anxiety and lead to agoraphobia. You’ve gone through a huge change in your life… Be gentle with yourself but also keep getting out and going to work if you can.  Boston has many excellent psychiatrists and therapists…  You could start by calling Mass. General Hospital or something Harvard-affiliated.  (Margrove will know specifics.) Hang in there. xxoo Anne — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

what are jobs that can be done from home?

I’m sorry your job isn’t working out for you, Katie. There’s always web design and computer programming, which is pick-up-able. Especially web design. Learning HTML is a breeze, and the other technologies that go along with it, like CSS. Then you just have to find clients, which isn’t too hard, as someone always wants a web page done. Then you have to haggle about prices, deal with their endless unrealistic needs, and try to placate these loons. Great job. Actually, I’m not one to talk to about web design, because I’ve given up on clients. I just do my own stuff in my spare time. But with enough motivation and sticking power, it’s certainly something you can do at home. Dawn has mentioned phone sex operator. Not exactly the best job in the world, but you do get to meet lots of interesting extremely lonely men, on their last shred of dignity. That’s a plus. There’s always freelance writing. This is the ideal work-at-home job. Stephen King probably hasn’t left his house in years, except for the occasional honorary dinner, which can be nice, I suppose, especially if it’s Chinese food. Writing is the one job where you can be completely agoraphobic, and still be rich and famous. Anyway, all this silliness aside, I hope you find something that better suits you, and like I said, I’m sorry things aren’t working out. Ian — http://sundry.ws/ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

Hi everyone!  Thanks for the support and ideas.  You guys are the greatest.  As for some of the questions…  Is there anything different about your anx/pan symptoms now than in the past?   Feeling different, better, worse, new triggers ….  OR are you feeling pretty much the same crappy symptoms?

Pretty much the same crappy symptoms but I think they’re a bit worse in terms of nausea and PAs because of the change in environment. If you haven’t had  your thyroid function checked,  go there  ASAP  ( pun intended).  Ditto with your blood sugar.   ( Disregard the advise if you’ve BTDT)

I found a great PCP (it’s easy working at a hospital!) and I’m actually getting a full blood workup tomorrow.  I’ve been having stomach problems (hence the nausea) and associated weight loss… so she’s a little concerned that something else besides anxiety is going on. Nothing like the fear of sickness to up the anxiety ante, right? As for things here, my BF moved up last week and it’s great to have him here.  It’s also frustrating to have to be responsible to another person since I was here alone for a month, but that too shall pass.  I love living here in Boston and although I miss some of the things about NYC, this is a much better place for me to be. Thank you all again! Katie — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be done from home?  Any input would help! Hope you’re all great, Katie

Katie, I’ve got an idea that I’m thinking about starting myself, half as a hobby, and maybe I can make some money if I get good at it.  My cousin makes candles and sells them – she makes pretty good money – about $18 per candle, but it depends on how fancy she makes them. They are very nice quality candles, better than those "Yankee" whatever ones.  I’ve read a little about the start up costs – they are minimal compared to a lot of other businesses you can start. If you mess up a candle, you melt the wax down and start over.  The biggest expense are the molds – but they sell those on Ebay for around $20.  She does have one room that she uses for her candle making – space COULD be a problem, but you may not have to have a whole room for it – I don’t know.  I just know Barb makes a decent living that way. If you want to talk to her about it, email me and I would be glad to put you in touch with her. Also.. I know many people make a living as transcriptionists – I think you already know the medical terminology, so that’s about half of it, the other is a transcription machine, A Steadman’s Medical Dictionary (or encyclopedia, whatever..) .. but you have to find clients, and how you do that, I do not know.. but I do know some people do that.  I’ve thought on it, but I never want to do anything in the medical field again. I’m done. Sally PS.. You just find the way that is right for you, as far as the anxiety goes.  I couldn’t work for a very long time, and there is a possibility in the future, I may be that way again. That’s why I’ve been trying to brainstorm, too. Getting ready for "what if" in the future, if it ever happens.. I’ll already have a plan. — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

::So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of ::control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be ::done from home?  Any input would help! ::Hope you’re all great, Dear Katie, I`m so sorry you are struggling with anxiety. I know hard it is to go to work everyday with high anxiety. It is hell. I don`t have any advice about home based business. I do have a book I bought a few years ago called, ‘101 Best Home-Based Business For Women’. I will more than gladly give it to you. Just (((((Katiebug))))) Jackie ~*~Would you respect my mind more if it bounced gently when I walked?~*~ — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

Response:

So, I’m not doing well going to work everyday.  The anxiety is out of control!  Here’s the brainstorm question… what are jobs that can be done from home?  Any input would help! Hope you’re all great, Katie

Hi Katie, I don’t post a lot here, just check in from time to time. I find my anxiety is about GOING to work, not "being" there.  Once I  AM truly there in person and engaged in the day, I am fine.   GETTING there is the most difficult part, the drive, the transition, the engagement with the days events. You’ve made  a major life transition, which  could give ANYONE  pause. That you’ve done this  so quickly is huge success for you.  Is there anything different about your anx/pan symptoms now than in the past?   Feeling different, better, worse, new triggers ….  OR are you feeling pretty much the same crappy symptoms? If the symptoms haven’t changed, its just  the same old, same old, SSDD  or SSDP ( same s**t different place) Wherever you go– there you are.  I can ( and DO)  have those symptoms sitting at my pooter in my PJ’s in my own house! So what the H.  IF I’m gonna have the problem, I may as well be OUT of the house doing something productive,  with pay,  and  with other people. Just my mileage, yours may vary. {{{  Katiebug}}}  Some days  are better than others, and don’t let the tough days cut you off from enjoying  the better ones.  Isn’t your Significant Other almost due to join you in Beantown?  Something  to look forward to? Am I understanding that you are working in a hospital setting??   You are new to the area, will need a PCP, go chat  up age appropriate co-workers for their recommendations and realize that  THAT is normal chit chat for people in transition. If you haven’t had  your thyroid function checked,  go there  ASAP  ( pun intended).  Ditto with your blood sugar.   ( Disregard the advise if you’ve BTDT) But as tempting as it gets,  DO NOT  THROW IN THE TOWEL.  Staying home will box you into a corner that will eventually be a shoebox,  not a place you want to live.  When you don’t want to live and work at home, where do you go? Blessings on ya,  Katiebug.    Its  tough, but you’ve placed your face to the sun.  When the sun comes out in New England,  you will feel better. Sue Western Maine Here at ASAP, you are as normal as  the rest of us. — The charter is available at: http://readystump.algebra.com/~asapm

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My word! You are suffering an attack of common sense… take 2 aspirin and see a professional health care specialist as soon as possible. But joking aside, AMA Allopaths are a monopoly that should be broken apart. I think the biggest hurdle is the "license to practice medicine" that permits manslaughter without criminal consequences. There was a sound reason to hold a physician immune from "deliberate injury" claims, because the very ill or terminal patients would be ignored, for fear of liability. But the bureaucratic practice of medicine, rigidly controlled and confined, creates the protective umbrella for the medicrats to perform walletectomies and remove pursitis. Possible reforms: [] Eliminate licensing, and have patients sign waivers, not unlike hospitals (which are not licensed, but duck criminal culpability just the same). [] Establish state or national exams, for bestowing credentials, ending monopoly of medical schools. [] Eliminate the "controlled substance" laws, and have people sign waivers of liability to purchase harmful or narcotic substances for themselves. [] End abusive medical education and internships. [] Abolish "practicing medicine without license" laws. [] Open medical / health care education to everyone. Universal health care is a reality when anyone can provide care for his neighbor, without fear.

lets see…floppy aortic valve needs a replacement, lets see what the guy next door has in his garage. Tool list: hedge clippers 1/2 inch socket set mitre saw shop vac good to go… No doctor/physician ever cures a patient… people cure themselves, with or without assistance.

See above you moron. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE  http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm  HIPAA and the Criminalization of American Medicine  http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cj22n1/cj22n1-9.pdf   Have a healthy life   Bluerhymer

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE   http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm I think you need a new doctor, Raymond. There may be many who fit your description but so far I haven’t met one.    Dear "Lucky" Patricia,     Indeed you are lucky. I pray that your good fortune continues. And if you read my post thoroughly you should have noticed that I did not discuss any of my own personal experiences with doctors, although I could have.    You obviously have not been the fatal victim of a drunken driver either, yet over 15,000 persons each year die as a result of their reckless behavior. ( 16,652 in 2001 with 513,000 injured as the result of drinking ).

And far more drivers reach their destinations alive & well.   And yet, this number is far lower than similar deaths of patients who succumbed to the reckless behavior of doctors. And of course, all drivers do not drive drunk just as all physicians do not make medical errors that result in the death of patients.

Just as there are people in EVERY profession (many of whom could potentially be a danger to others) who don’t know what the heck they’re doing or who don’t give a rat’s behind about their work. Cops, airline pilots, soldiers, truck drivers — the list goes on & on — include such people among their ranks.  Fortunately, just as in the case of MD’s, these are the minority.  There are incompetent doctors. They are not the majority of those practicing medicine — they are simply the ones we read the horrifying stories about.  In addition, we must remember that — unlike victims killed by drivers under the influence — people going to MD’s often arrive at the office with a problem to begin with (indeed a problem that may be quite serious) that may make their treatment an uphill battle no matter what is done.   I suspect that you are very wealthy and have never been without good health care insurance, nor been the victim of the greedy HMO executive.

Many of us have had periods without health insurance at all.  I went 9 years without any coverage — even though I always worked, paid my bills & taxes, & fell into the category of middle-class homeowner. During that time, I never had difficulty finding MD’s (& a great dentist) who provided me with competent medical care. The health insurance industry, a public demanding quick fixes for problems they quite often refuse to accept any responsibility for preventing or mitigating, the pros & cons of how we administer medical care, & our wishful thinking that every patient’s story should have a happy ending can make the provision of health care difficult sometimes.  An idea like specialization is a double-edged sword that can provide the best possible diagnosis & treatment of a disorder — or it can overly narrow a doctor’s scope of expertise & limit the successful resolution of a problem.  Having an HMO pay for doctors’ office visits, diagnostic tests, prescriptions, &/or surgery may be the only way a patient can access such services — or it may prevent the patient from getting the treatment(s) that they desperately need. The problems we complain about aren’t cut & dried with simple answers. It would be nice to be able to accurately place the blame for the problems we have in our health care system at the feet of a single group, which would let us  feel we finally had "the answer" to solving them.  But there isn’t any one group that really fits the bill. Michele I ENJOY being a cranky bitch.

Response:

Eric – good reply to a ridiculous post. I, too, have had several negative experiences, over the many years, with doctors who"goofed’ one way or another.  That does not mean the majority are sub-standard.  The fact that the writer is confused about hypertensive medicines and/or anti-depressants tells you something about his inabiity to arrive at a fair judgment. Olly

   Dear Eric: Olly Mensch is within his prerogative to be critical since in Yiddish "Mensch" or "Mensh" means a person  having admirable characteristics, such as fortitude and firmness of purpose.   However, he may be interseted in knowing that it is not I who am confused about the named drugs.   He should therefore contact Mr.Stan Montgomery author of:   The Downward Spiral of Medical Corruption, who wrote in his article: "The psychs have now reached their influence into all medical practices since more antihypersensative drugs and antidepressent drugs are prescribed by family physicians than psychiatrists."   See: http://www.flash.net/~salvager/corrupt.htm   Best wishes and Shalom   The Tenth Man   Bluerhymer

Response:

.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My word! You are suffering an attack of common sense… take 2 aspirin and see a professional health care specialist as soon as possible. But joking aside, AMA Allopaths are a monopoly that should be broken apart. I think the biggest hurdle is the "license to practice medicine" that permits manslaughter without criminal consequences. There was a sound reason to hold a physician immune from "deliberate injury" claims, because the very ill or terminal patients would be ignored, for fear of liability. But the bureaucratic practice of medicine, rigidly controlled and confined, creates the protective umbrella for the medicrats to perform walletectomies and remove pursitis. Possible reforms: [] Eliminate licensing, and have patients sign waivers, not unlike hospitals (which are not licensed, but duck criminal culpability just the same). [] Establish state or national exams, for bestowing credentials, ending monopoly of medical schools. [] Eliminate the "controlled substance" laws, and have people sign waivers of liability to purchase harmful or narcotic substances for themselves. [] End abusive medical education and internships. [] Abolish "practicing medicine without license" laws. [] Open medical / health care education to everyone. And just how will this improve medical care?      What would medicine look like without any ethical, professional, scientific or educational standards, and if in addition, any fear of litigation was removed?    (Which, incidentally, the signing of waivers doesn’t.) Or is this a joke — you are sending the previous correspondent up? Peter Moran

    Doctor Miller, the small-town physician,     Could cure almost any condition.         And not only that,         With a change of his hat,     He was also the small-town mortician.                                     –Rich ;o)

Response:

(My mothers doctor was a rather successful mortician) Anth

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE      http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm I think you need a new doctor, Raymond. There may be many who fit your description but so far I haven’t met one.    Dear "Lucky" Patricia,     Indeed you are lucky. I pray that your good fortune continues. And if you read my post thoroughly you should have noticed that I did not discuss any of my own personal experiences with doctors, although I could have.    You obviously have not been the fatal victim of a drunken driver either, yet over 15,000 persons each year die as a result of their reckless behavior. ( 16,652 in 2001 with 513,000 injured as the result of drinking ). And yet, this number is far lower than similar deaths of patients who succumbed to the reckless behavior of doctors. And of course, all drivers do not drive drunk just as all physicians do not make medical errors that result in the death of patients.   I suspect that you are very wealthy and have never been without good health care insurance, nor been the victim of the greedy HMO executive.   "If you’ve ever grumbled about how the press plays up one of tragedy while ignoring millions of successes, you won’t enjoy reading this. But you should. There’s a lesson here about managed care’s failure to tell its story effectively."   See: A News Reporter Explains His ‘Horror Stories’.   by Wm. Sherman, a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist and Emmy and Peabody award-winning television news correspondent and producer. He won the Pulitzer for an 18 part series on abuses of the national medicalprogram by providers who were delivering substandard care.   http://www.managedcaremag.com/archives/9709/0709.reporterview.shtml   More reading;   Incriminating Documents; Nurses vs. HMOs   http://www.anticorp.com/hardcorp/hmo.htm   http://www.boschs.org/articles/slim/er-horror.shtml   Bluerhymer Neither my father (then) or my daughter (now) resemble the kind of physician you describe. My primary care doctor knows my name, my concerns and IF I do need some kind of test it’s arranged and he or his PA will call with the results. If the news is good..no problem if it isn’t … I have an appointment that day or the next to discuss the matter with him and make an informed decision on what to do about it. Lucky in Florida… Patricia

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE   http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm I think you need a new doctor, Raymond. There may be many who fit your description but so far I haven’t met one.    Dear "Lucky" Patricia,     Indeed you are lucky. I pray that your good fortune continues. And if you read my post thoroughly you should have noticed that I did not discuss any of my own personal experiences with doctors, although I could have.    You obviously have not been the fatal victim of a drunken driver either, yet over 15,000 persons each year die as a result of their reckless behavior. ( 16,652 in 2001 with 513,000 injured as the result of drinking ). And yet, this number is far lower than similar deaths of patients who succumbed to the reckless behavior of doctors. And of course, all drivers do not drive drunk just as all physicians do not make medical errors that result in the death of patients.   I suspect that you are very wealthy and have never been without good health care insurance, nor been the victim of the greedy HMO executive.   "If you’ve ever grumbled about how the press plays up one of tragedy while ignoring millions of successes, you won’t enjoy reading this. But you should. There’s a lesson here about managed care’s failure to tell its story effectively."   See: A News Reporter Explains His ‘Horror Stories’.   by Wm. Sherman, a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist and Emmy and Peabody award-winning television news correspondent and producer. He won the Pulitzer for an 18 part series on abuses of the national medicalprogram by providers who were delivering substandard care.

                       See CORRECTION BELOW – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   http://www.managedcaremag.com/archives/9709/9709.reporterview.shtml   More reading;   Incriminating Documents; Nurses vs. HMOs   http://www.anticorp.com/hardcorp/hmo.htm   http://www.boschs.org/articles/slim/er-horror.shtml   Bluerhymer Neither my father (then) or my daughter (now) resemble the kind of physician you describe. My primary care doctor knows my name, my concerns and IF I do need some kind of test it’s arranged and he or his PA will call with the results. If the news is good..no problem if it isn’t … I have an appointment that day or the next to discuss the matter with him and make an informed decision on what to do about it. Lucky in Florida… Patricia

Response:

My word! You are suffering an attack of common sense… take 2 aspirin and see a professional health care specialist as soon as possible. But joking aside, AMA Allopaths are a monopoly that should be broken apart. I think the biggest hurdle is the "license to practice medicine" that permits manslaughter without criminal consequences. There was a sound reason to hold a physician immune from "deliberate injury" claims, because the very ill or terminal patients would be ignored, for fear of liability. But the bureaucratic practice of medicine, rigidly controlled and confined, creates the protective umbrella for the medicrats to perform walletectomies and remove pursitis.

  All very true. Much of the problem comes from the protection the medical community receives from the President and the prostitutes in the Congress.   An estimated 40 percent of the 17,800 lobbyists registered in Washington promote health care agendas. ( $1.56 billion last year was spent to sway Congress and the Executive branch.)   There are 13 health care lobbyists for each of the 535 members of Congress.   How many lobbyists are there to protect you from this pathetically destructive community of murderers and thieves?   Ask your "HO" in Congress how much he/she takes to keep the issue one-sided, then vote him/her out of office. Clean house and start over. And both parties are guilty, so don’t pick on one of the parasite political groups.   See: Lobbyists That The founders Just Never Dreamed Of   "The ‘right’… to petition the government has come a long way in over 200 years, and health care organizations are not shy in excercising it."  http://www.managedcaremag.com/archives/0208/0208.lobbying.html   Check:   http://www.physicianreports.com   http://www.healthcaremag.com   Thank you   Bluerhymer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Possible reforms: [] Eliminate licensing, and have patients sign waivers, not unlike hospitals (which are not licensed, but duck criminal culpability just the same). [] Establish state or national exams, for bestowing credentials, ending monopoly of medical schools. [] Eliminate the "controlled substance" laws, and have people sign waivers of liability to purchase harmful or narcotic substances for themselves. [] End abusive medical education and internships. [] Abolish "practicing medicine without license" laws. [] Open medical / health care education to everyone. Universal health care is a reality when anyone can provide care for his neighbor, without fear. No doctor/physician ever cures a patient… people cure themselves, with or without assistance. Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE  http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm  HIPAA and the Criminalization of American Medicine  http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cj22n1/cj22n1-9.pdf   Have a healthy life   Bluerhymer

Response:

  And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE

     http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm I think you need a new doctor, Raymond. There may be many who fit your description but so far I haven’t met one.

   Dear "Lucky" Patricia,     Indeed you are lucky. I pray that your good fortune continues. And if you read my post thoroughly you should have noticed that I did not discuss any of my own personal experiences with doctors, although I could have.    You obviously have not been the fatal victim of a drunken driver either, yet over 15,000 persons each year die as a result of their reckless behavior. ( 16,652 in 2001 with 513,000 injured as the result of drinking ). And yet, this number is far lower than similar deaths of patients who succumbed to the reckless behavior of doctors. And of course, all drivers do not drive drunk just as all physicians do not make medical errors that result in the death of patients.   I suspect that you are very wealthy and have never been without good health care insurance, nor been the victim of the greedy HMO executive.   "If you’ve ever grumbled about how the press plays up one of tragedy while ignoring millions of successes, you won’t enjoy reading this. But you should. There’s a lesson here about managed care’s failure to tell its story effectively."   See: A News Reporter Explains His ‘Horror Stories’.   by Wm. Sherman, a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist and Emmy and Peabody award-winning television news correspondent and producer. He won the Pulitzer for an 18 part series on abuses of the national medicalprogram by providers who were delivering substandard care.   http://www.managedcaremag.com/archives/9709/0709.reporterview.shtml   More reading;   Incriminating Documents; Nurses vs. HMOs   http://www.anticorp.com/hardcorp/hmo.htm   http://www.boschs.org/articles/slim/er-horror.shtml   Bluerhymer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Neither my father (then) or my daughter (now) resemble the kind of physician you describe. My primary care doctor knows my name, my concerns and IF I do need some kind of test it’s arranged and he or his PA will call with the results. If the news is good..no problem if it isn’t … I have an appointment that day or the next to discuss the matter with him and make an informed decision on what to do about it. Lucky in Florida… Patricia

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment. <snip  If this worries you – just don’t go to doctors. And just maybe don’t get fat and idle. Still little old ladies seem to live a long time and go to doctors – or is it owning a poodle that keeps them alive.

   Dear Cramer:      Maybe you should stick with TV situation comedy where professional comedy writers provide the dialogue.      Please say "Hello" to Jerry Seinfeld next time you see him. And, will the two of you be working together again soon?     Although I am not an old lady, I will look into the evidence that owning a poodle will extend my life.      Thank you.      Shalom          Bluerhymer

Response:

Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE  http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm  HIPAA and the Criminalization of American Medicine  http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cj22n1/cj22n1-9.pdf   Have a healthy life   Bluerhymer

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My word! You are suffering an attack of common sense… take 2 aspirin and see a professional health care specialist as soon as possible. But joking aside, AMA Allopaths are a monopoly that should be broken apart. I think the biggest hurdle is the "license to practice medicine" that permits manslaughter without criminal consequences. There was a sound reason to hold a physician immune from "deliberate injury" claims, because the very ill or terminal patients would be ignored, for fear of liability. But the bureaucratic practice of medicine, rigidly controlled and confined, creates the protective umbrella for the medicrats to perform walletectomies and remove pursitis. Possible reforms: [] Eliminate licensing, and have patients sign waivers, not unlike hospitals (which are not licensed, but duck criminal culpability just the same). [] Establish state or national exams, for bestowing credentials, ending monopoly of medical schools. [] Eliminate the "controlled substance" laws, and have people sign waivers of liability to purchase harmful or narcotic substances for themselves. [] End abusive medical education and internships. [] Abolish "practicing medicine without license" laws. [] Open medical / health care education to everyone.

And just how will this improve medical care?      What would medicine look like without any ethical, professional, scientific or educational standards, and if in addition, any fear of litigation was removed?    (Which, incidentally, the signing of waivers doesn’t.) Or is this a joke — you are sending the previous correspondent up? Peter Moran

Response:

Is your doctor also your murderer?  Could be. There’s a saying:  "Trust but verify."   However, when dealing with doctors (many of whom seem to be trying to grab your wallet with both hands, as they’re kicking you into your grave), … it’s important to be a whole lot more careful than that. Don’t trust, & keep asking a lot of questions. Susan, Su_Texas  my opinions

Response:

My word! You are suffering an attack of common sense… take 2 aspirin and see a professional health care specialist as soon as possible. But joking aside, AMA Allopaths are a monopoly that should be broken apart. I think the biggest hurdle is the "license to practice medicine" that permits manslaughter without criminal consequences. There was a sound reason to hold a physician immune from "deliberate injury" claims, because the very ill or terminal patients would be ignored, for fear of liability. But the bureaucratic practice of medicine, rigidly controlled and confined, creates the protective umbrella for the medicrats to perform walletectomies and remove pursitis. Possible reforms: [] Eliminate licensing, and have patients sign waivers, not unlike hospitals (which are not licensed, but duck criminal culpability just the same). [] Establish state or national exams, for bestowing credentials, ending monopoly of medical schools. [] Eliminate the "controlled substance" laws, and have people sign waivers of liability to purchase harmful or narcotic substances for themselves. [] End abusive medical education and internships. [] Abolish "practicing medicine without license" laws. [] Open medical / health care education to everyone. Universal health care is a reality when anyone can provide care for his neighbor, without fear. No doctor/physician ever cures a patient… people cure themselves, with or without assistance. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment.  See GANGSTERS IN MEDICINE  http://www.rense.com/general33/gang.htm  HIPAA and the Criminalization of American Medicine  http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cj22n1/cj22n1-9.pdf   Have a healthy life   Bluerhymer

Response:

(Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.

WOW!  You mean to say that INTERNISTS actually prescribe more BLOOD PRESSURE drugs than PSYCHIATRISTS?  Psychiatry would be a far more profitable specialty if hypertension were considered a psychiatric diagnosis…

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Long ago, doctors may have had a noble purpose, but in the past fifty years they have become mere prostitutes, accepting money and performing as requested. Since the patient so seldom pays, the prostitutes do the bidding of the people  with the money, the insurance companies and the diabolic HMOs (Horrendous Medical Organizations).    Doctors have come a long way since the early days. Then they were our heros. Today, they are more often our villians than our heros and it is the general practioner who is the villian closest to sending you to your grave. Today, people suffer from the madness of doctors in the privacy of their funeral homes , while doctors try to escape their sins by spending more time with their accountants and bankers.   Long ago they realized they had no help to offer. Your doctor may want to help but he has been brought into a corrupt system that forces him to dance to the tune of the government and insurance company rules for payment.   And when the doctor loses a profitable patient, he tells the family that he did all he could. To his peers and to the employees in his office ( that probably knew more about the patient and his or her medical condition than our doctor ) that the patient died for lack of patient compliance. "The patient didn’t folllow the doctor’s orders."   Then, to overcome his grief, he has his office secretary call the Medical/Dental Bureau and request another ailing body (with insurance) to fill his already overbooked calendar..   Have you noticed? When you visit your GP, or in the case of HMOs, your Primary Care Physician (PCP), he has no idea what ails you and may have no intention, within you carefully controled twenty-mintues, to do anything other than to review your blood pressure result and your temperature, which the nurse was responsible for providing. If you have a temperature, he assures you that it is the result of "something that is going around." If you have a pain, he will either prescribe a pain medication , or have blood taken if the pain deceives him and appears internal rather than muscular. Then, he has you return to his office, no matter how bad you are feeling, to hear the results of the blood analysis. Then, if scary, you will be sent to someone who can really treat your condition properly; the specialist, who may or may not know his specialty as well as he knows his stock portfolio.   If you appear depressed, our GP will either prescribe medications that deal with depression or send you to a psychiatrist who may have more depression and personal problems than any of his patients. (Psychiatrists, more than any other profession commit suicide). The family physician now prescribes more antihypertensive drugs and anytidepressent drugs than psychiatrists. These drugs are to hide symptoms, or help us to cope without addressing the cause.   And after you are under the ground, who can prove, that the person you trusted the most when you were ill, that his observations were wrong as well as his treatment. <snip

 If this worries you – just don’t go to doctors. And just maybe don’t get fat and idle. Still little old ladies seem to live a long time and go to doctors – or is it owning a poodle that keeps them alive.

Response:

Question:

See below… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am teaching myself accounting procedures using various sites on the internet.  I think I have gotten the hang of the bookkeeping aspect and am using a small accounting program called GnuCash to keep a set of double-entry accounts.  I have run into a brick wall in my mind. In our business we provide memberships to people, I have that part figured out.  One of our advertizing techniques is to issue people a free week to check out the studio (Its a martial arts dojo).  It is my understanding that this is an advertizing expence, which I have set up an account for, but I am clueless as to what account this is comming out of.  I am starting to think it comes from revenue, but it is not actually money we ever earn; we never recover that money even if they enroll.  Also I wouldn’t think I would want it showing up on my income statement for tax purposes.  I can’t think of any asset it would come out of either, could it be a liability?  Or maybe it comes from owner equity somehow – BTW this is a partnership so I am wanting to avoid that mess

It’s a frebie to entice your potential customers to sign up… do nothing – there is no direct cost therefore no expense to record. While I am talking on owner equity I also have a second question set. Should the business be charged for time the owners spend working on it?  For instance when we are working as instructors should we track out time and charge something?  The business is not licenced to employ.  A related issue, should the owners charge the business for time spent on things not directly related to our normal operating times?  For instance time I spend as "bookkeeper" would normally be an expence and I have been programming software for the purposes of the business as well as working on website material, should I charge the business for these items as if I where an outside expense and then put the money back into the business as my own contribution?

If you book the expense to the company, you MUST record the income on YOUR personal tax return.  How would your partner feel about paying you twice? The decision to do this depends on your cashflow and how you’ve set up your partnership agreement. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -BTW, I did a web search and found no reference to a FAQ for this newsgroup and no FAQ where I would find answers to the above – is there one? Thank you for any and all help, NR

Response:

If you book the expense to the company, you MUST record the income on YOUR personal tax return.

It was my understanding that I would record it both as an income as well as a business expence.  Not until the company actually returned that investment later would it start to affect me monetarily and it would be recorded as return from an investment at that point.  Am I wrong here?    How would your partner feel about paying you twice?

I don’t figure how that would happen.  The way I thought it would work is that the business goes into debt to me for services, or purchases items from me or my partner and then I just pay that debt with capital.   Basically it would be a transfer from my capital to an expense account, with maybe some transitional accounts. Really though I am starting to think it a mistake to even worry about that kind of thing and just split the profit down the middle; that is what the origional plan has always been but if that plan sucks we want to change it  Right now the partnership is in the red so there is nothing in the way of profit to split.  We are pramarily conserned with staying within the boundaries of the law, letting our stupidity get in the way as little as possible, being able to take an audit and having as little pain at tax time as possible though we expect some. The decision to do this depends on your cashflow and how you’ve set up your partnership agreement.

There is no "partnership agreement" beyond us deciding to start the business and just split the profit down the middle.  This other stuff is all my ideas as I am running into things as we learn; before I started messing with the books "Owner Equity" was not in our vocabulary.  An oportunity presented itself and we jumped on it with little in regard to planning.  Time will tell if this was a mistake; there is certainly a lot of after work that could have been saved. What is going on right now is I am moving a system of reciepts and memberships from several piles into something manageable.  Its a nightmare, but we appear to have only lost (ie. I can’t account for where the hell it went) about 400 and now a system is growing that should be able to account for everything much more easily. NR

Response:

If you book the expense to the company, you MUST record the income on YOUR personal tax return. It was my understanding that I would record it both as an income as well as a business expence.  Not until the company actually returned that investment later would it start to affect me monetarily and it would be recorded as return from an investment at that point.  Am I wrong here? yes, you are wrong,  -   but you can avoid the income on your personal

return, to a point,  if you are an owner ) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –    How would your partner feel about paying you twice? I don’t figure how that would happen.  The way I thought it would work is that the business goes into debt to me for services, or purchases items from me or my partner and then I just pay that debt with capital.   Basically it would be a transfer from my capital to an expense account, with maybe some transitional accounts. yes, it could work in that way but you would still be getting additional compensation that may not have originally agreed upon and would affect the splitting of profits Really though I am starting to think it a mistake to even worry about that kind of thing and just split the profit down the middle; that is what the origional plan has always been but if that plan sucks we want to change it  Right now the partnership is in the red so there is nothing in the way of profit to split.  We are pramarily conserned with staying within the boundaries of the law, letting our stupidity get in the way as little as possible, being able to take an audit and having as little pain at tax time as possible though we expect some. you can avoid some financial "pain" by seeking professional help now! a little spent now will save you in the future,  e.g. there are tax consequences that you don’t know about also easier ways to do the bookkeeping ! The decision to do this depends on your cashflow and how you’ve set up your partnership agreement. There is no "partnership agreement" beyond us deciding to start the business and just split the profit down the middle.  This other stuff is all my ideas as I am running into things as we learn; before I started messing with the books "Owner Equity" was not in our vocabulary.  An oportunity presented itself and we jumped on it with little in regard to planning.  Time will tell if this was a mistake; there is certainly a lot of after work that could have been saved. typical for small businesses but you can correct some mistakes now,  other mistakes only become apparent long after the fact What is going on right now is I am moving a system of reciepts and memberships from several piles into something manageable.  Its a nightmare, but we appear to have only lost (ie. I can’t account for where the hell it went) about 400 and now a system is growing that should be able to account for everything much more easily. again, if you have another job / spouse with income there can be tax "savings" with this business start-up    - see a local accountant – the initial consultation is free —  Good luck !

Response:

If you book the expense to the company, you MUST record the income on YOUR personal tax return. It was my understanding that I would record it both as an income as well as a business expence.  Not until the company actually returned that investment later would it start to affect me monetarily and it would be recorded as return from an investment at that point.  Am I wrong here?

yes, you are wrong,    How would your partner feel about paying you twice? I don’t figure how that would happen.  The way I thought it would work is that the business goes into debt to me for services, or purchases items from me or my partner and then I just pay that debt with capital.   Basically it would be a transfer from my capital to an expense account, with maybe some transitional accounts.

yes, it could work in that way but you would still be getting additional compensation that may not have originally agreed upon and would affect the splitting of profits Really though I am starting to think it a mistake to even worry about that kind of thing and just split the profit down the middle; that is what the origional plan has always been but if that plan sucks we want to change it  Right now the partnership is in the red so there is nothing in the way of profit to split.  We are pramarily conserned with staying within the boundaries of the law, letting our stupidity get in the way as little as possible, being able to take an audit and having as little pain at tax time as possible though we expect some.

you can avoid some financial "pain" by seeking professional help now!     a little spent now will save you in the future,  e.g. there are tax consequences that you don’t know about also easier ways to do the bookkeeping ! The decision to do this depends on your cashflow and how you’ve set up your partnership agreement. There is no "partnership agreement" beyond us deciding to start the business and just split the profit down the middle.  This other stuff is all my ideas as I am running into things as we learn; before I started messing with the books "Owner Equity" was not in our vocabulary.  An oportunity presented itself and we jumped on it with little in regard to planning.  Time will tell if this was a mistake; there is certainly a lot of after work that could have been saved.

typical for small businesses but you can correct some mistakes now,  other mistakes only become apparent long after the fact What is going on right now is I am moving a system of reciepts and memberships from several piles into something manageable.  Its a nightmare, but we appear to have only lost (ie. I can’t account for where the hell it went) about 400 and now a system is growing that should be able to account for everything much more easily.

again, if you have another job / spouse with income there can be tax "savings" with this business start-up    - see a local accountant – the initial consultation is free —  Good luck !

Response:

I am teaching myself accounting procedures using various sites on the internet.  I think I have gotten the hang of the bookkeeping aspect and am using a small accounting program called GnuCash to keep a set of double-entry accounts.  I have run into a brick wall in my mind. In our business we provide memberships to people, I have that part figured out.  One of our advertizing techniques is to issue people a free week to check out the studio (Its a martial arts dojo).  It is my understanding that this is an advertizing expence, which I have set up an account for, but I am clueless as to what account this is comming out of.  I am starting to think it comes from revenue, but it is not actually money we ever earn; we never recover that money even if they enroll.  Also I wouldn’t think I would want it showing up on my income statement for tax purposes.  I can’t think of any asset it would come out of either, could it be a liability?  Or maybe it comes from owner equity somehow – BTW this is a partnership so I am wanting to avoid that mess While I am talking on owner equity I also have a second question set. Should the business be charged for time the owners spend working on it?   For instance when we are working as instructors should we track out time and charge something?  The business is not licenced to employ.  A related issue, should the owners charge the business for time spent on things not directly related to our normal operating times?  For instance time I spend as "bookkeeper" would normally be an expence and I have been programming software for the purposes of the business as well as working on website material, should I charge the business for these items as if I where an outside expense and then put the money back into the business as my own contribution? BTW, I did a web search and found no reference to a FAQ for this newsgroup and no FAQ where I would find answers to the above – is there one? Thank you for any and all help, NR

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am teaching myself accounting procedures using various sites on the internet.  I think I have gotten the hang of the bookkeeping aspect and am using a small accounting program called GnuCash to keep a set of double-entry accounts.  I have run into a brick wall in my mind. In our business we provide memberships to people, I have that part figured out.  One of our advertizing techniques is to issue people a free week to check out the studio (Its a martial arts dojo).  It is my understanding that this is an advertizing expence, which I have set up an account for, but I am clueless as to what account this is comming out of.  I am starting to think it comes from revenue, but it is not actually money we ever earn; we never recover that money even if they enroll.  Also I wouldn’t think I would want it showing up on my income statement for tax purposes.  I can’t think of any asset it would come out of either, could it be a liability?  Or maybe it comes from owner equity somehow – BTW this is a partnership so I am wanting to avoid that mess

if you gave away free samples of a physical "thing" you bought there would be something to debit but in your case there is no entry in the books since you are the owner giving "free" labor however you should track this give-away separately as a memo item (most accounting software can handle this)  -  you don’t want this in the partnership’s income or expenses (or equity!) While I am talking on owner equity I also have a second question set. Should the business be charged for time the owners spend working on it?   For instance when we are working as instructors should we track out time and charge something?  The business is not licenced to employ.  A related issue, should the owners charge the business for time spent on things not directly related to our normal operating times?  For instance time I spend as "bookkeeper" would normally be an expence and I have been programming software for the purposes of the business as well as working on website material, should I charge the business for these items as if I where an outside expense and then put the money back into the business as my own contribution?

you have entered into the area of partnership allocation and compensation and these issues should have been worked out before you started the business.  Yes, you should definitely recognize the work that the partners do by splitting profits or re-imbursement by expense checks or some other arrangement but to avoid the inevitable disagreements about this you should seek a local accountant to set you up correctly – there are personal and business tax consequences to what you are doing !!!!! BTW, I did a web search and found no reference to a FAQ for this newsgroup and no FAQ where I would find answers to the above – is there

one? not really – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thank you for any and all help, NR

Response:

Question:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.

Hear hear <snip Presumably the new Blackhawks will be based at Holsworthy? So the story goes.  More likely, a Squadron of S70 Blackhawks will move to Holsworthy from Townsville and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers will go to Townsville.  I can’t see them creating an independent trooplift squadron, unless the new choppers are something on a par with MH60s etc, in which case, they would go to Sydney.

_If_ there aren’t dedicated choppers assigned, what units are likely to be involved that aren’t from the army? I can see the benefits for the US in having a separate SOC, given differing procurement needs, specialist units from all 3 ‘normal’ services working together constantly, and huge bureaucracies.What are the benefits for Oz? There looks to be a definite risk in creating more overhead for little gain (outside PR in The War Against Terror ™). Of course this _might_ not happen, and the AusSOC could lead to more appropriate procurement, training and deployment. Do the Brits have any standing HQ for their various SF (ISTR that SAS and SBS have combined selection now-days) and associated units (e.g. MH-47s, those wave-piercing boats) PS aus.services.defence isn’t on my newsserver or google, so anyone feel free to re-broadcast. — Errol Cavit to email, my middle initial is G | "Auchinleck…decided that Tobruk could not be relieved. [... Gen.] Blamey said ‘Australia is an independent nation. She came into the war under certain definite agreements. Now, gentlemen, in the name of my Government, I demand the relief of these troops.’"

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.  Nice for them to have their own Command with equivalence to Maritime, Land, and Air Commands though.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5711156… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 1,00.html Further/repeated report from www.strategypage.com/fyeo/howtomakewar/default.asp?target=HTINF.HTM (I’ll post in full as it will drop of the site soon) "December 26, 2002; Australia’s Defense Forces will finally follow their US and British counterparts, by separating their elite special forces from the Army and making them the fourth arm of the Australian Defense Forces. Prime Minister John Howard made the announcement at the Special Air Services’ Campbell Barracks in Perth on 19 December, while welcoming home special forces who had just spent four months fighting the war against terrorism in Afghanistan. This move is meant strengthen its fight against terrorism at home and abroad, although some critics claim that it’s merely a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" move. Opposition party defense spokesman and Senator Chris Evans was concerned that funding for other Australian units may be depleted to boost the special forces, and that standards may be dropped to fill the elite ranks. He claimed that it was likely to be some years before special forces numbers actually increased, although other special forces have been successfully expanded in short time. The Australians will also appoint a special forces commander to oversee counterterrorism operations. Major General Duncan Lewis, the 50-year-old former Special Air Services Commander, will now control 1,800 soldiers (including the SAS and navy clearance divers). The Holsworthy Army Base in Sydney will house most of Australia’s special operations soldiers. The new command will include the SAS Regiment in Perth, the Fourth RAR Commando Funding for another 12 Blackhawk helicopters will be fast-tracked, to join the three dozen already in service. In addition to Afghanistan, the Australian special operations folks will probably serve against Iraq. If so, Australian SAS troops will likely to be offered experimental vaccines against anthrax, mustard gas and bubonic plague. The Australian Defense Department (one of the BEST practitioners of OPSEC or "Operational Security") will not reveal which vaccines may be offered. Iraq is known to have had stocks of VX (a liquid nerve poison), sarin and tabun nerve gases, as well as anthrax (as well as other possible biological and chemical agents). Australia’s presence has also been expanded at the US Central Command, the military headquarters for the Afghanistan, Iraq and Middle East theaters. Australian officers are being given an unusual level of access to the Iraqi plans. Recently, Australian observers were in Qatar, for the US Central Command test of their command systems. However, anonymous senior Australian military officials think that the country’s role in both conflicts should be to provide specialist forces like the SAS, aerial surveillance and naval support – rather than post-conflict peace keeping – yet an unnamed senior Pentagon official told the Sydney Herald that Australia would almost certainly be asked to contribute to a post-war occupation force in Iraq. – Adam Geibel" Cheers Errol Cavit

One Question springs to mind. If the "special forces" are to expanded and retained. With current recruiting and retention rates where are the people to come from? Although from a command and control perspective think this is the obvious best move. Having their own core Aviation element is also an excellent and proper move. then there is that perennial; problem of—— funds . Sigh. Cheers p

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.  Nice for them to have their own Command with equivalence to Maritime, Land, and Air Commands though. http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5711156… 1,00.html

Further/repeated report from www.strategypage.com/fyeo/howtomakewar/default.asp?target=HTINF.HTM (I’ll post in full as it will drop of the site soon) "December 26, 2002; Australia’s Defense Forces will finally follow their US and British counterparts, by separating their elite special forces from the Army and making them the fourth arm of the Australian Defense Forces. Prime Minister John Howard made the announcement at the Special Air Services’ Campbell Barracks in Perth on 19 December, while welcoming home special forces who had just spent four months fighting the war against terrorism in Afghanistan. This move is meant strengthen its fight against terrorism at home and abroad, although some critics claim that it’s merely a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" move. Opposition party defense spokesman and Senator Chris Evans was concerned that funding for other Australian units may be depleted to boost the special forces, and that standards may be dropped to fill the elite ranks. He claimed that it was likely to be some years before special forces numbers actually increased, although other special forces have been successfully expanded in short time. The Australians will also appoint a special forces commander to oversee counterterrorism operations. Major General Duncan Lewis, the 50-year-old former Special Air Services Commander, will now control 1,800 soldiers (including the SAS and navy clearance divers). The Holsworthy Army Base in Sydney will house most of Australia’s special operations soldiers. The new command will include the SAS Regiment in Perth, the Fourth RAR Commando Funding for another 12 Blackhawk helicopters will be fast-tracked, to join the three dozen already in service. In addition to Afghanistan, the Australian special operations folks will probably serve against Iraq. If so, Australian SAS troops will likely to be offered experimental vaccines against anthrax, mustard gas and bubonic plague. The Australian Defense Department (one of the BEST practitioners of OPSEC or "Operational Security") will not reveal which vaccines may be offered. Iraq is known to have had stocks of VX (a liquid nerve poison), sarin and tabun nerve gases, as well as anthrax (as well as other possible biological and chemical agents). Australia’s presence has also been expanded at the US Central Command, the military headquarters for the Afghanistan, Iraq and Middle East theaters. Australian officers are being given an unusual level of access to the Iraqi plans. Recently, Australian observers were in Qatar, for the US Central Command test of their command systems. However, anonymous senior Australian military officials think that the country’s role in both conflicts should be to provide specialist forces like the SAS, aerial surveillance and naval support – rather than post-conflict peace keeping – yet an unnamed senior Pentagon official told the Sydney Herald that Australia would almost certainly be asked to contribute to a post-war occupation force in Iraq. – Adam Geibel" Cheers Errol Cavit

Response:

A new special forces command, comprising around 1800 crack troops, will boost Australia’s defence forces as the federal Government strengthens the military’s capability to fight terrorism in the wake of the Bali bombings. The Special Operations Command aligns Australia’s military structure more closely with that of the US. It will operate under the command of newly promoted Major-General Duncan Lewis, currently commander of special forces. As well, the Government will fast-track the purchase of a new squadron of Black Hawk-type helicopters capable of operating both from navy ships and from land. http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5711156…

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.  Nice for them to have their own Command with equivalence to Maritime, Land, and Air Commands though. — Bring on the herbivores, I’m hungry.

A new special forces command, comprising around 1800 crack troops, will boost Australia’s defence forces as the federal Government strengthens the military’s capability to fight terrorism in the wake of the Bali bombings. The Special Operations Command aligns Australia’s military structure more closely with that of the US. It will operate under the command of newly promoted Major-General Duncan Lewis, currently commander of special forces. As well, the Government will fast-track the purchase of a new squadron of Black Hawk-type helicopters capable of operating both from navy ships and from land.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5711156… 1,00.html

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.

According to most reports it’s about 300 new people and about 1500 existing. Plus SOC will have its own reserves. Presumably the new Blackhawks will be based at Holsworthy? Cheers David

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers. According to most reports it’s about 300 new people and about 1500 existing. Plus SOC will have its own reserves.

ADF is currently over CE anyway, so I think it will just be a bit of creative accounting to move numbers into the new AusSOC.  As for Reserves, they already exist.  1st Commando Regiment consisting of Regt HQ, 1 & 2 Cdo Coys, and 126 Signals Squadron.  SASR have their own "internal" reserve elements. Presumably the new Blackhawks will be based at Holsworthy?

So the story goes.  More likely, a Squadron of S70 Blackhawks will move to Holsworthy from Townsville and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers will go to Townsville.  I can’t see them creating an independent trooplift squadron, unless the new choppers are something on a par with MH60s etc, in which case, they would go to Sydney. — Bring on the herbivores, I’m hungry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Cheers David

Response:

I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers.

Ahh, I didn’t think the SED review had actually died.

Response:

Will probably mean 145 and 110 sig squadrons will get the boot

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d like to see the detail.  I don’t think this will come out as a true "increase", merely a re-distribution of existing numbers. According to most reports it’s about 300 new people and about 1500 existing. Plus SOC will have its own reserves. the ADF is currently over CE anyway, so I think it will just be a bit of creative accounting to move numbers into the new AusSOC.  As for Reserves, they already exist.  1st Commando Regiment consisting of Regt HQ, 1 & 2 Cdo Coys, and 126 Signals Squadron.  SASR have their own "internal" reserve elements. Presumably the new Blackhawks will be based at Holsworthy? So the story goes.  More likely, a Squadron of S70 Blackhawks will move to Holsworthy from Townsville and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers will go to Townsville.  I can’t see them creating an independent trooplift squadron, unless the new choppers are something on a par with MH60s etc, in which case, they would go to Sydney. — Bring on the herbivores, I’m hungry. Cheers David

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Which is also why the Yanks really wanted more MH-47s, and are hoping for a dozen more. I’m not sure if the recently announced extra funding for USSOC will translate to this. I’ve also seen talk of ‘taking back’ the Brit MH-47s. Yeah, seen the same stuff. A truly "dedicated" aviation squadron for the AusSOC might have a Flight each of S70 Blackhawks and Sea Kings.  CH47s would be tasked as required, and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers would probably form up as another Squadron of 5 Aviation in Townsville for amphibious work. What are the issues in using the S70s at sea? An obvious one is size of landing area due to position of tailwheel. Anything else? Corrosion? Nav gear? Corrosion is the killer.  Even having them on the tarmac at RAAF Townsville has created corrosion problems.  That get a bird bath on a regular basis now.

Don’t forget the landing gear – particularly when landing on ships when they are moving around a bit (and that they certainly do when the weather gets a bit lively) the pilots supposedly have had to be gentle about putting them down on the deck.  Seem to remember hearing this a couple of years ago, but not sure about the veracity of it – apparently the seahawks set down pretty heavily – when the ship is flopping around, so is the landing pad! – in an attempt to make sure that they don’t slide off the side – have only rarely seen the RAST system in use. Matt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I can see the benefits for the US in having a separate SOC, given differing procurement needs, specialist units from all 3 ‘normal’ services 4, actually.  Don’t overlook the Marines. I _had_ overlooked them, I admit, but I don’t think that they have anything in USSOC. They have however just made an announcement regarding forming "the Marine Corps Special Operations Command Detachment … as a two-year pilot project to test the concept of Marines serving with units under the U.S. Special Operations Command in Tampa, Fla." sci.military.naval Note that SEALS are Navy, and Force Recon are firmly part of the regular marine units. Correct.  The USMC jumped on the "special" bandwagon with their MEU (SOC) concept.  *Marine Expeditionary Unit (Special Operations Capable).

Response:

Which is also why the Yanks really wanted more MH-47s, and are hoping for a dozen more. I’m not sure if the recently announced extra funding for USSOC will translate to this. I’ve also seen talk of ‘taking back’ the Brit MH-47s.

Yeah, seen the same stuff. A truly "dedicated" aviation squadron for the AusSOC might have a Flight each of S70 Blackhawks and Sea Kings.  CH47s would be tasked as required, and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers would probably form up as another Squadron of 5 Aviation in Townsville for amphibious work. What are the issues in using the S70s at sea? An obvious one is size of landing area due to position of tailwheel. Anything else? Corrosion? Nav gear?

Corrosion is the killer.  Even having them on the tarmac at RAAF Townsville has created corrosion problems.  That get a bird bath on a regular basis now. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I can see the benefits for the US in having a separate SOC, given differing procurement needs, specialist units from all 3 ‘normal’ services 4, actually.  Don’t overlook the Marines. I _had_ overlooked them, I admit, but I don’t think that they have anything in USSOC. They have however just made an announcement regarding forming "the Marine Corps Special Operations Command Detachment … as a two-year pilot project to test the concept of Marines serving with units under the U.S. Special Operations Command in Tampa, Fla." Note that SEALS are Navy, and Force Recon are firmly part of the regular marine units.

Correct.  The USMC jumped on the "special" bandwagon with their MEU (SOC) concept.  *Marine Expeditionary Unit (Special Operations Capable).

Response:

_If_ there aren’t dedicated choppers assigned, what units are likely to be involved that aren’t from the army? Not sure I understand the question Errol, but I’ll have a bash.  Army owns all the Blackhawks (RAAF has no rotary assets these days).

My bad. You answered question that I should of asked, thanks. Having said that, the chook stranglers make frequent use of the Navy’s Sea Kings due to their capacious interiors and lifting capacity (translates to ability to hover "at altitude" while fast-roping troops on to sky-scraper tops).

Which is also why the Yanks really wanted more MH-47s, and are hoping for a dozen more. I’m not sure if the recently announced extra funding for USSOC will translate to this. I’ve also seen talk of ‘taking back’ the Brit MH-47s. A truly "dedicated" aviation squadron for the AusSOC might have a Flight each of S70 Blackhawks and Sea Kings.  CH47s would be tasked as required, and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers would probably form up as another Squadron of 5 Aviation in Townsville for amphibious work.

What are the issues in using the S70s at sea? An obvious one is size of landing area due to position of tailwheel. Anything else? Corrosion? Nav gear? I can see the benefits for the US in having a separate SOC, given differing procurement needs, specialist units from all 3 ‘normal’ services 4, actually.  Don’t overlook the Marines.

I _had_ overlooked them, I admit, but I don’t think that they have anything in USSOC. They have however just made an announcement regarding forming "the Marine Corps Special Operations Command Detachment … as a two-year pilot project to test the concept of Marines serving with units under the U.S. Special Operations Command in Tampa, Fla." Note that SEALS are Navy, and Force Recon are firmly part of the regular marine units. <Snip — Errol Cavit to email, my middle initial is G | "Auchinleck…decided that Tobruk could not be relieved. [... Gen.] Blamey said ‘Australia is an independent nation. She came into the war under certain definite agreements. Now, gentlemen, in the name of my Government, I demand the relief of these troops.’"

Response:

Presumably the new Blackhawks will be based at Holsworthy? So the story goes.  More likely, a Squadron of S70 Blackhawks will move to Holsworthy from Townsville and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers will go to Townsville.  I can’t see them creating an independent trooplift squadron, unless the new choppers are something on a par with MH60s etc, in which case, they would go to Sydney. _If_ there aren’t dedicated choppers assigned, what units are likely to be involved that aren’t from the army?

Not sure I understand the question Errol, but I’ll have a bash.  Army owns all the Blackhawks (RAAF has no rotary assets these days).  Having said that, the chook stranglers make frequent use of the Navy’s Sea Kings due to their capacious interiors and lifting capacity (translates to ability to hover "at altitude" while fast-roping troops on to sky-scraper tops).  A truly "dedicated" aviation squadron for the AusSOC might have a Flight each of S70 Blackhawks and Sea Kings.  CH47s would be tasked as required, and the new (marinised) trooplift choppers would probably form up as another Squadron of 5 Aviation in Townsville for amphibious work.  All this is speculation, of course.  No details have been made public yet. I can see the benefits for the US in having a separate SOC, given differing procurement needs, specialist units from all 3 ‘normal’ services

4, actually.  Don’t overlook the Marines. working together constantly, and huge bureaucracies.What are the benefits for Oz?

Yet to be seen.  Seeing as the Army owns just about all the shit anyway.  I was surprised by the creation of AusSOC.  If I was cynical, I’d say it’s trying to "template" the ADF so that it’s more recognisable to our allies (who have all adopted independent Spec Ops Commands instead having SF units with no over-arching HQ). There looks to be a definite risk in creating more overhead for little gain (outside PR in The War Against Terror ™).

True. Of course this _might_ not happen, and the AusSOC could lead to more appropriate procurement, training and deployment.

Possible.  They were heading in that direction anyway with the creation of the SF Training Centre and the single "SF barrier test". Do the Brits have any standing HQ for their various SF

Unknown. (ISTR that SAS and SBS have combined selection now-days)

Which is what we’ve done.  Window breaker and chook strangler wanna-bes all go through a single "barrier test" these days. — Bring on the herbivores, I’m hungry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -and associated units (e.g. MH-47s, those wave-piercing boats) PS aus.services.defence isn’t on my newsserver or google, so anyone feel free to re-broadcast. — Errol Cavit to email, my middle initial is G | "Auchinleck…decided that Tobruk could not be relieved. [... Gen.] Blamey said ‘Australia is an independent nation. She came into the war under certain definite agreements. Now, gentlemen, in the name of my Government, I demand the relief of these troops.’"

Response:

Question:

 Can any one tell me where or send to me the official accounting  pronouncements of the AICPA and FASB. I appreciate any and all help.  Thank you, Woody (student)

Is there a college in your area with accounting courses?  A good college library should have AICPA and FASB publications. —

Response:

 Can any one tell me where or send to me the official accounting  pronouncements of the AICPA and FASB. I appreciate any and all help.  Thank you, Woody (student)

1.800.862.4272 AICPA, 201 Plaza Three, Jersey City, NJ 07311-3881

Response:

These pronouncements are fairly substantial in size and can get expensive; many are available on CD-ROM. For AICPA publications, call 800-862-4272. For FASB, call 203-847-0700.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody know of a good newsgroup or Internet site for discssion of FASB positions and/or issues? For discussion of GAAP issues (of which the FASB’s activities are only a sideshow), go to the AICPA’s forums, alt.accounting, biz.comp.accounting, Electronic Accountant, and other discussion forums. I have been trying to collect links to all these open discussion forums on my website, at http://www.gldialtone.com/forums.htm  This page is dedicated to the long western tradition of mutual self-help and sharing of knowledge. You are welcome to copy this list of forums and disseminate it any way you like. Note: there are also MANY tax and auditing forums. None are listed here. Admittedly, the list is incomplete with respect to mailing lists, which are among the most influential forums in any professional domain these days. But I have the webforums pretty well covered, I think, with 50 forums or so. Try http://www.fasb.org/ That’s ridiculous.  There is no opportunity to discuss anything there. FASB.org is a top-down broadcast station, operated by the For-Profit companies who are members of FASB, for the single purpose of enforcing their crafty accounting rules and transferring wealth to themselves.  Beginning with charging you $20 for each FASB pronouncement, so that you can read them in order to obey them, before your State Board jerks your license or arrests you. You don’t expect to find open discussion there, do you?   Hummphh.

The best accounting related discussion site I’m aware of is right here – alt.accounting. Most accounting related sites are about as stimulating as watching paint dry, except a lot slower.  We have actually had real discussion about real issues here, and it has moved along at a vigorous pace. There is no reason why we can’t discuss FASB positions right here. — Jim Hudspeth, CPA – http://jim.hudspeth.com – Washington, USA

Response:

Does anybody know of a good newsgroup or Internet site for discssion of FASB positions and/or issues?

Try net.alt.accounting.  Just start a discussion. How about: is it true that the FASB is bent on destroying international accounting standards? — David York

Response:

Does anybody know of a good newsgroup or Internet site for discssion of FASB positions and/or issues?

For discussion of GAAP issues (of which the FASB’s activities are only a sideshow), go to the AICPA’s forums, alt.accounting, biz.comp.accounting, Electronic Accountant, and other discussion forums.   I have been trying to collect links to all these open discussion forums on my website, at http://www.gldialtone.com/forums.htm  This page is dedicated to the long western tradition of mutual self-help and sharing of knowledge. You are welcome to copy this list of forums and disseminate it any way you like. Note: there are also MANY tax and auditing forums. None are listed here. Admittedly, the list is incomplete with respect to mailing lists, which are among the most influential forums in any professional domain these days.   But I have the webforums pretty well covered, I think, with 50 forums or so.   Try http://www.fasb.org/

That’s ridiculous.  There is no opportunity to discuss anything there. FASB.org is a top-down broadcast station, operated by the For-Profit companies who are members of FASB, for the single purpose of enforcing their crafty accounting rules and transferring wealth to themselves.  Beginning with charging you $20 for each FASB pronouncement, so that you can read them in order to obey them, before your State Board jerks your license or arrests you. You don’t expect to find open discussion there, do you?   Hummphh. and  http://www.computercpa.com/  …the Accountants Home Page with links to hundreds of sites for accountants including the FASB site above.

While I don’t minimize Eric Cohen’s contributions, active participation or support of online discussions is not among them.  The ComputerCPA website also has *no* discussion board.  It does have an incomplete list of some discussion websites and news groups such as biz.comp.accounting, is that what you mean?   ComputerCPA website doesn’t even include alt.accounting.  It only has half a dozen web discussion boards. Here’s a list of around 50, http://www.gldialtone.com/forums.htm The best discussion of GAAP and FASB is face to face with other CPAs at your local society, in CPE classes and committees.   Todd * Todd F. Boyle CPA    http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033       (425) 827-3107 * WebLedgers, accounting ASPs, XML accounting, e-commerce * sending/receiving invoices, orders and payments over the internet

Response:

Does anybody know of a good newsgroup or Internet site for discssion of FASB positions and/or issues?

Response:

Try http://www.fasb.org/ and http://www.computercpa.com/ This is the Accountants Home Page with links to hundreds of sites for accountants including the FASB site above. HTH Don   Regards,   Donald A Haney, MBA   Emergency Care Specialists, PC   "Learning occurs in the mind, independent of time and place." – Plato   Does anybody know of a good newsgroup or Internet site for discssion of   FASB positions and/or issues?

Response:

Question:

obl…@my-deja.com wrote: > As everyone knows, all the different European currencies will soon be > replaced by a single currency, the Euro.

    This post too, has been "liberated, saved, furloughed".  <laugh>  Thank you for sharing it.  I haven’t seen this before.  Is it an "original"?  Jae —    "Tenderness and kindness are not signs of weakness and despair…….                  But manifestations of strength and resolution."                                          Kahlil Gibran

Response:

Oh GED, Eurekillin me! Hey, maybe they can buy the rights to the song titled "Eurine The Money"! Maria – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -obl…@my-deja.com wrote: > As everyone knows, all the different European currencies will soon be > replaced by a single currency, the Euro. It is now fairly common > knowledge also, that following a recent meeting of Eurocrats in > Brussels, it has been decided that the smallest unit of this new > currency, equivalent to the US cent, will be called a Eurine. The > process is now quite advanced, since while politicians still quarrel > over the final details, first issues of the new coin (known as Eurine > Samples) are already being minted as future collectors’ items, so it > might not be amiss to introduce readers to some likely additions to > English vocabulary necessitated by the new currency. > First of all, it is obvious that certain idiomatic expressions will have > to be changed. British people accustomed to using phrases like "in for > a penny, in for a pound", will now have to get used to saying "in for a > Eurine, in for a Euro", to take one random example; just as French > tourists who might previously have said "I will be frank with you, > monsieur" will have to adjust to "I will be forty Eurines with you, > monsieur". These changes are unlikely to cause any great difficulty. > Slightly more problematic is the future fate of that great British > institution, the Bureau de Change, which previously made its money > changing the pounds of summer holidaymakers into pesetas: this will now > become the Bureau d’Euros, or possibly the Euro de No Change, depending > on the final decision of Thomas Cook management. Here are a few more > examples of likely additions to the British lexicon over the next few > years: > Eurinal: a financial institution, formerly known as a "bank". > EXAMPLE: I’m just popping to the eurinal – I got no money. > Eurocrat: a high-ranking person within European finance. Synonym: a > complete Banker. > to Eurinate (verb): to earn lots of Euros. > EXAMPLE: My boss is an inspiration to us all. I always want to eurinate > when I see him. > Eurigella: a bent Euro coin. > EXAMPLE: This coin won’t go into the machine. Looks like a Eurigella to > me. > Euro-surgeon: a very well-paid medical specialist. > Eur-eker: a person who is very careful about spending his/her Euros. > EXAMPLE: She never goes out anywhere. It’s not that she’s poor – she’s > just a eur-eker. > Europeein’ : pissing your Euros up the wall, like there was no tomorrow. > EXAMPLE: Sorry, he’s not in. He’s gone Europeein’ at the local pub. > Euripides: something to say to a person who habitually overcharges > people in Euros. > EXAMPLE: Euripides people off, didn’t you? > Eurov Euroka: phrase (in Russian) used by politicians when > questioned about the possible inclusion of the rouble in the single > European currency in the medium term. > (Translation not available) > Eurine for it now! : phrase used by company accountants to explain > the apparent loss of spending power following conversion of people’s > salaries into the new currency. > And finally… > Peurile: adjective used to refer to NG posts about Euros. > EXAMPLE: This is the most peurile post I’ve seen here for a long time. > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

>Hey, maybe they can buy the rights to the song titled "Eurine The Money"! >Maria

Ohhhhh….good one, Maria !!!  LOL Hugs and Smiles, Gina "I sailed the ship all alone….. I never think I’ll make it home….."                         Kingsmen (Louie, Louie)                                

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As everyone knows, all the different European currencies will soon be replaced by a single currency, the Euro. It is now fairly common knowledge also, that following a recent meeting of Eurocrats in Brussels, it has been decided that the smallest unit of this new currency, equivalent to the US cent, will be called a Eurine. The process is now quite advanced, since while politicians still quarrel over the final details, first issues of the new coin (known as Eurine Samples) are already being minted as future collectors’ items, so it might not be amiss to introduce readers to some likely additions to English vocabulary necessitated by the new currency. First of all, it is obvious that certain idiomatic expressions will have to be changed. British people accustomed to using phrases like "in for a penny, in for a pound", will now have to get used to saying "in for a Eurine, in for a Euro", to take one random example; just as French tourists who might previously have said "I will be frank with you, monsieur" will have to adjust to "I will be forty Eurines with you, monsieur". These changes are unlikely to cause any great difficulty. Slightly more problematic is the future fate of that great British institution, the Bureau de Change, which previously made its money changing the pounds of summer holidaymakers into pesetas: this will now become the Bureau d’Euros, or possibly the Euro de No Change, depending on the final decision of Thomas Cook management. Here are a few more examples of likely additions to the British lexicon over the next few years: Eurinal: a financial institution, formerly known as a "bank". EXAMPLE: I’m just popping to the eurinal – I got no money. Eurocrat: a high-ranking person within European finance. Synonym: a complete Banker. to Eurinate (verb): to earn lots of Euros. EXAMPLE: My boss is an inspiration to us all. I always want to eurinate when I see him. Eurigella: a bent Euro coin. EXAMPLE: This coin won’t go into the machine. Looks like a Eurigella to me. Euro-surgeon: a very well-paid medical specialist. Eur-eker: a person who is very careful about spending his/her Euros. EXAMPLE: She never goes out anywhere. It’s not that she’s poor – she’s just a eur-eker. Europeein’ : pissing your Euros up the wall, like there was no tomorrow. EXAMPLE: Sorry, he’s not in. He’s gone Europeein’ at the local pub. Euripides: something to say to a person who habitually overcharges people in Euros. EXAMPLE: Euripides people off, didn’t you? Eurov Euroka: phrase (in Russian) used by politicians when questioned about the possible inclusion of the rouble in the single European currency in the medium term. (Translation not available) Eurine for it now! : phrase used by company accountants to explain the apparent loss of spending power following conversion of people’s salaries into the new currency. And finally… Peurile: adjective used to refer to NG posts about Euros. EXAMPLE: This is the most peurile post I’ve seen here for a long time. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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I’m working on a project for a highschool accounting class.  I need to know the difference between the daily workings of a chartered accountant, a certified general accountant and a certified management accountant.  It would be great to get a job description for each. thanks

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Hayley, In Canada the CA, CMA, and CGA accounting designations are somewhat similar but have different focuses in their training.  In practise each of these accountants can work in pretty much any area of accounting (public practise, industry, or government).  In a "perfect" world here is how the designations would differ in the workplace: CA – The focus here would be on the high-end accounting functions such as audits, Corporate tax planning, Chief Financial Officer’s for Public corporations.  The CA designation is the oldest designation and has more prestige attached to it in the eyes of the general public (not necessarily in the eyes of the CGA’s or CMA’s though.  Please note that the CGA and CMA had made great strides to balance this perception in the last decade) CMA – The key focus in the area would be on management accounting in industry.  You would see a CMA as a Controller of a large private corporation providing guidance through financial analysis and costing procedures.  (nowadays you see a great many CMA’s in Public practise) CGA – the is the "generalist" designation. the training has three major areas of concentration in the final stages of obtaining your designation – Government, Industry and public practise.  You could say that the CGA is the Jack/Jane of all trades and master of most.  CGA’s can be found in almost all areas of the accounting world. For all other readers – I have made broad sweeping generalisations here so I will make this comment in order that I don’t get flamed too badly.  All of the accounting designations are overseen by professional organizations that ensure the standards of accounting excellence are maintained.  Each of the designations provide the necessary training and experience for qualified individuals to work in any area of the accounting industry with the utmost of efficiency, integrity and professionalism. Good luck with your project Hayley! Regards, David Spence – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m working on a project for a highschool accounting class.  I need to know the difference between the daily workings of a chartered accountant, a certified general accountant and a certified management accountant.  It would be great to get a job description for each. thanks

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If you are in the process or will be soon of making a software switch or consultant switch I would recommend visiting CPA Online.  You will find it at http://www.cpaonline.com .  This site not only is useful in determining what accounting packages and consultants are out there but it will also, free of charge, match you up with a system that best suits your company needs.  There are several ways to find accounting systems that might work for you but I would suggest filling out what is called a

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Chromium Use in Diabetes – Recent Notoriety Tim Sawyers, RPh,MBA,CDE We believe the information presented to be accurate and current at the time of publication. We would remind the  reader, however, that he or she is responsible for utilizing professional judgement and for confirming or interpreting the findings presented here before utilizing the information. National media reports of new findings regarding the use of chromium supplements in diabetes are incomplete and may mislead persons with diabetes into inappropriate therapy. Recent reports allege that chromium supplements help just about everyone and target the diabetic patient. Industry advertising makes claims that chromium will conquer obesity, sensitize cells to insulin action, help avoid hypoglycemia and reduce sugar cravings. It has been suggested by the media that regular chromium use may allow a person with diabetes to increase sugar ("sweets") intake without accounting for the increase in carbohydrates and calories. In other words, eat as much as you want and let the chromium control the excesses. Seems too good to be true, because it is. This is not a quick fix for diabetics with uncontrolled blood sugar and who are nutritionally challenged. Our bodies require chromium for metabolism of protein, carbohydrates and lipids. Chromium is also necessary for the production of glucose tolerance factor (GTF) which facilitates the action of insulin. Studies have shown that chromium can improve glucose tolerance and carbohydrate metabolism in specific groups of chromium-deficient patients: long-term I.V. nutritional therapy; malnutrition, especially in the elderly. Results of chromium supplementation in otherwise healthy diabetics are  inconclusive. It is difficult to draw conclusions from these studies,  because it is likely that those who benefitted from chromium supplements  also had a chromium deficiency. Such deficiencies are uncommon among most  people with diabetes.  Although chromium is an important element in the human body, there is no way  to measure exactly how much we need, how much we have, how much we get from  our meals, whether the body actually uses chromium ingested in the form of  supplements, and whether an otherwise healthy person is chromium deficient. The American Diabetes Association’s Clinical Practice Recommendations (1996) states: "…. it appears that most people with diabetes are not chromium deficient and, therefore, chromium supplementation has no known benefit." If patients insist on chromium supplementation, recommend the biologically active form of trivalent chromium (GTF) which has absorption of approximately 10-25% compared to inorganic chromium (1% absorption). As an alternative suggest brewers’ yeast, which is the richest dietary source of chromium. "Brenda" *** You mean the waistband on these pants "isn’t" supposed to ride right below the boobs? ***   COOL! "One of the new "druggies" and lovin’ it!" "Let your jeans be the judge!"

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writes: Chromium Use in Diabetes – Recent Notoriety Tim Sawyers, RPh,MBA,CDE We believe the information presented to be accurate and current at the time of publication. We would remind the  reader, however, that he or

she is responsible for utilizing professional judgement and for confirming or interpreting the findings presented here before utilizing the information. GOOD ADVICE FOR ANY LITERATURE! National media reports of new findings regarding the use of chromium supplements in diabetes are incomplete and may mislead persons with diabetes into inappropriate therapy.

ANYONE WHO SETS THEIR OWN REGIMEN WITHOUT MEDICAL ADVICE IS A PIONEER! Recent reports allege that chromium supplements help just about everyone and target the diabetic patient. Industry advertising makes claims that chromium will conquer obesity, sensitize cells to insulin action, help avoid hypoglycemia and reduce sugar cravings. It has been suggested by the media that regular chromium use may allow a person with diabetes to increase sugar ("sweets") intake without accounting for the increase in carbohydrates and calories. In other words, eat as much as you want and let the chromium control the excesses. THAT’S A DUMB IDEA! Seems too good to be true, because it is. This is not a quick fix for diabetics with uncontrolled blood sugar and who are nutritionally challenged. Our bodies require chromium for metabolism of protein, carbohydrates and lipids. Chromium is also necessary for the

production of glucose tolerance factor (GTF) which facilitates the action of insulin. A GTF IS A "HOLY GRAIL" LONG-SOUGHT BUT NEVER PROVEN TO EVEN EXIST.  Studies have shown that chromium can improve glucose tolerance and carbohydrate metabolism in specific groups of chromium-deficient patients: long-term I.V. nutritional therapy; CLINICALLY, BIOAVAILABLE CHROMIUM IS NOT NORMALLY ADMINISTERED BY IV FOR THESE PURPOSES. IT IS AN ORALLY INGESTED "MAJOR METAL" NUTRIENT (AS CONTRASTED WITH A "TRACE MINERAL"). RDI IS 150 MIKES A DAY. malnutrition, especially in the elderly. "INSULIN RESISTANCE", UPON WHICH CHROMIUM ACTS, TENDS TO INCREASE WITH THE AGING OF THE BODY. Results of chromium supplementation in otherwise healthy

SPECIFICALLY WHAT DOES "OTHERWISE HEALTHY" MEAN AS USED HERE? diabetics are inconclusive. It is difficult to draw conclusions from these studies, because it is likely that those who benefitted from chromium supplements also had a chromium deficiency. ACCORDING TO THE USDA, MOST OF US HAVE SUCH A DEFICIENCY, WHETHER DIABETIC OR NOT. CERTAINLY MORE TESTING IS NEEDED BEFORE FULL MEDICAL ACCEPTANCE WOULD BE EVEN REASONABLE. Such deficiencies are uncommon among most people with diabetes. EXISTING DATA FROM USDA AND _SOME_ TESTING INDICATES OTHERWISE. (SEE ABOVE). Although chromium is an important element in the human body, there is no way to measure exactly how much we need, how much we have, how much we get from our meals, whether the body actually uses chromium ingested in the form of supplements, and whether an otherwise healthy person is chromium deficient. FLAT OUT UNTRUE. SUCH TESTING CAN AND HAS BEEN DONE, BUT INFREQUENTLY AS IT’S EXPENSIVE AND DIFFICULT TO PERFORM. USEAGE OF DIETARY CHROMIUM SUPPLEMENTS HAS BEEN THOROUGHLY PROVEN EFFICACIOUS IN MANY CASES; NOT SO CERTAINLY IN OTHERS. THIS IS TOO EXTREME A STATEMENT.   The American Diabetes Association’s Clinical Practice Recommendations (1996) states: "…. it appears that most people with diabetes are not

chromium deficient and, therefore, chromium supplementation has no known benefit." THIS IS SIMPLE CONJECTURE. THE ONLY EXTRAPOLATIVE TESTING I HAVE SEEN IS THE USDA HUMAN NUTRITION DEPT’S WORK WHICH LED TO A "90% OF THE US POPULATION BEING DEFICIENT" PROJECTION. THE REMAINDER OF THE STATEMENT FLIES IN THE FACE OF EXPERIMENTAL PROOF KNOWN TO THE ADA. If patients insist on chromium supplementation, recommend the biologically active form of trivalent chromium (GTF) AGAIN, THE "GTF" IS A CONJECTURAL COMPOSITION — THOUGHT TO EXIST BUT NEVER PROVEN TO EXIST. IT’S JUST A MARKETING TERM AT PRESENT. which has absorption of approximately 10-25% compared to inorganic chromium (1% absorption). ABSORPTION OF CHROMIUM PARTLY DEPENDS ON NEED AND PARTLY BEING IN A CHELATED/COLLOIDAL FORM. METALS IN GENERAL AREN’T ABSORBED WELL INLESS WRAPPED IN AN L-AMINO (CHELATED) OR IN THE PROPER COLLOIDAL FORM, NEGATIVELY IONIZED. As an alternative suggest brewers’ yeast, which is the richest dietary source of chromium. TOTALLY TRUE, IF YOU CAN GAG ENOUGH DOWN. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"Brenda", with comments by Ralph *** You mean the waistband on these pants "isn’t" supposed to ride right below the boobs? ***   COOL! "One of the new "druggies" and lovin’ it!" "Let your jeans be the judge!"

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1. Ratio of the amount the independent counsel’s office spent on    Whitewater to the amount it spent on Watergate:     6.5    source: Congressional Research Service

Pat interrupts: Does that factor in inflation and the 13.5 million Hillary spent on her secret socialized medicine project? 2. Fine levied on a Swedish couple in March for naming a son    Brfxxxcccxxmnnpcccclllmmnprxxvvclmnckssqlbb 1 1 1 1 16:                                                                               $746.00    source: Hallands Nyheter (South Gothenberg, Sweden)

Pat interrupts: ‘See what living in a liberal country gets you! 3. Average number of hours per week Bob Dole spends tanning: 3.5    source: Dole for President (Washington)

Pat asks: Does that include his time in rehabilitation from his war wounds? Now those are FACTS! HR  

–Pat

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1. Ratio of the amount the independent counsel’s office spent on    Whitewater to the amount it spent on Watergate:     6.5    source: Congressional Research Service

        Ratio of the amount the independent counsel’s office spent on Whitewater to the amount spent on Iran/Contra:    1 to 30         Whitewater $1.3 million         Iran/Contra $40 million \/ayne //ann    "Just the mere _appearance_ of inpropriety demands     that we investigate."         — Rep. Tom Foley (D-WA), justifying hearings            into October Surprise.

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Child Homicide Victims, 1980-1994 Fifteen Children Every Day?  Or One Child Every Other Day? Activists tiring of claims that gun violence kills 15 children each day may be interested in a different accounting, from a more neutral source.  These figures indicate that about 905 children are murdered each year.  Of those, 184 are murdered with firearms, an average of one child every other day.  The "weapons of choice" for killing children are bare hands, fists, and feet. FBI Uniform Crime Reports, Crime in the United States, 1994   released November 19, 1995 Topical Study, "Child Homicide Victims, 1980-1994"   pages 287-288 —– Table 5.21  Age and Sex of Child Homicide Victims,             Percent Distribution, United States, 1980-1994 Age           Male      Female     Total 1 and under   24.3%     20.7%      45.0% 2 to 4        15.1      12.0       27.1 5 to 8         7.0       6.9       13.9 9 to 12        7.4       6.6       14.0 Total         53.8      46.2      100.0 —– Table 5.22  Relationship of Child Homicide Victims to Offenders,             Percent Distribution, United States, 1980-1994 Victim to Offender Relationship         Percent Within Family                              54.2   Bother                                     .7   Sister                                     .6   Daughter                                 20.7   Son                                      24.4   Step-Daughter                             1.5   Step-Son                                  1.9   In-Law                                     .1   Other Family                              4.3 Outside Family But Known to Victim         25.3   Acquaintance                             12.3   Friend                                    2.3   Neighbor                                  1.3   Other Known                               9.4 Stranger                                    6.0 Unknown                                    14.5 —– Table 5.23  Weapons Used Against Child Homicide Victims,             Percent Distribution, United States, 1980-1994             [line order changed from original FBI table] Weapon Type                               Percent Personal Weapons (hands, feet, etc.)         47.0 Firearms                                     20.3 Strangulation/Asphyxiation/Drowning          10.8 Blunt Objects                                 8.2 Knives or Cutting Instruments                 7.2 Explosives / Fire                             5.2 Poison / Narcotics                             .8 Other                                          .5 —– Notes gleaned from the accompanying text: For the purposes of this study, children are considered to be aged 12 and under.  Nearly 13,600 children were victims over the fifteen years of this study, 950 of them in the final year of 1994. Children comprised just over 4 percent of all homicide victims over this period.  While the overall homicide rate fell 12 percent over this period, the homicide rate of children rose 6 percent. Male children were at only slightly greater risk than females, comprising 54 percent of the victims.  This contrasts against the all-ages figure, in which males comprise 76 percent of victims. 56 percent of the child victims were white, 41 percent black, and 3 percent of other races. 3 percent of children were killed by babysitters. A sex offense occurred simultaneously with or preceding 3 percent of the murders of children.  Of the sex-related murders, 23 percent were by acquaintances, 20 percent by strangers, and 10 percent by neighbors. Victimization by strangers increased steadily with age to a peak at age 9, decreasing slightly after that.  Children victimized by strangers were evenly split by gender.  Stranger offenders are 95 percent male. [No gender is mentioned for any other offenders.] Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.) were used in 47 percent of all child murders, with firearms trailing at 20 percent.  Firearms were the weapon of choice for strangers, used in 57 percent of such cases. The likelihood of being murdered with a firearm increased with age. Most newborns and infants (under 1 year of age) were killed by personal weapons, with only 5 percent killed with firearms.  In contrast, at age 12, 60 percent were killed with firearms, and only 8 percent with personal weapons.  This is similar to the all-ages (adults included) figure for the same period, 62 percent were are killed with firearms, and 6 percent with personal weapons. Additional notes, beyond the items explicitly printed by the FBI: A quick calculation shows that the average number of child murders each year was 904 to 906.  Of these, 183 or 184 were committed with firearms. The uncertainty is from rounding in the FBI article. These FBI figures include only murders.  The anti-gun extremists’ claims of 15 children killed by gun violence every day include accidents and suicides.  A quick check of some copies of the National Safety Council’s "Accident Facts" suggests that fatal gun accidents run at about 60 to 90 percent of the gun homicide rate for the nearest listed age group, and suicides add about 40 to 50 percent.  However, because "Accident Facts" uses different and more course age groupings, and accidents and suicides have different age distributions than homicides, a meaningful estimate of accidents and suicides for the FBI age groupings is not possible from this source. The anti-gun extremists also use a much different concept of "child." Their counts are always heavily end-loaded with "children" who have all the legal rights, responsibilities, and privileges of adults, except for alcohol and handguns.  Too often, they also include "children" who can legally buy alcohol in all 50 states. Activists who refuse to count as a "child" anyone who should be registered to vote, registered for the military draft, can legally purchase alcohol, and who cannot be prosecuted in juvenile court, may find this FBI article useful. Dean Payne ===== == All Disclaimers Apply (so as to protect my employer) == The SBAY-TALK mailing list is provided as an open forum for communication among South Bay RKBA and Constitutional rights activists, and law-abiding gun owners, and is provided as a free service to those individuals.  The owner of this list has no control over, and accepts no responsibility for, the content of any messages that may be posted to it.

: Well, dang it! I’m convinced! With facts like these, WHO NEEDS AN : INDEPENDENT COUNSEL INVESTIGATING THE WHITEWATER/CATTLEGATE/TRAVELGATE/ : FOSTERGATE/FILEGATE/ET-AL-AD-INFINITUM-GATE SCANDALS AT THE WHITE HOUSE? : Dan Ford : —– : You might want to consider breaking those Prozacs in half… — When they took the fourth amendment, I was quiet because I didn’t deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I was quiet because I was innocent. When they took the second amendment, I was quiet because I didn’t own a gun. Now they’ve taken the first amendment, and I can say nothing about it.

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Well, dang it! I’m convinced! With facts like these, WHO NEEDS AN INDEPENDENT COUNSEL INVESTIGATING THE WHITEWATER/CATTLEGATE/TRAVELGATE/ FOSTERGATE/FILEGATE/ET-AL-AD-INFINITUM-GATE SCANDALS AT THE WHITE HOUSE? Dan Ford —– You might want to consider breaking those Prozacs in half…

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 1. Ratio of the amount the independent counsel’s office spent on     Whitewater to the amount it spent on Watergate:     6.5         source: Congressional Research Service 2. Fine levied on a Swedish couple in March for naming a son     Brfxxxcccxxmnnpcccclllmmnprxxvvclmnckssqlbb 1 1 1 1 16:                                                                            $746.00         source: Hallands Nyheter (South Gothenberg, Sweden) 3. Average number of hours per week     Bob Dole spends tanning: 3.5         source: Dole for President (Washington) Now those are FACTS! HR

Let’s have a better comparison……let’s divide the number of convictions in Iran-Contra by the cost of the investigation….then do the same with Whitewater (that is..at the END of all the convictions)

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