Yes, you misread. He asked about the DEBTOR’s accounting.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unless I misread your post, to forgive a debtor, you would CREDIT the debtor’s account and DEBIT an expense account. — Ken Russell . I’ve googled this subject but didn’t come up with a relevant hit. My question is this: how do I book (for book purposes) forgiveness of debt on the debtor’s side. I know the tax treatment. Is it as simple as debiting the liability and crediting an (other) income account in the general ledger? Thanks, mc
I’ve googled this subject but didn’t come up with a relevant hit. My question is this: how do I book (for book purposes) forgiveness of debt on the debtor’s side. I know the tax treatment. Is it as simple as debiting the liability and crediting an (other) income account in the general ledger? Thanks, mc
I’ve googled this subject but didn’t come up with a relevant hit. My question is this: how do I book (for book purposes) forgiveness of debt on the debtor’s side. I know the tax treatment. Is it as simple as debiting the liability and crediting an (other) income account in the general ledger? Thanks, mc
it’s as simple as that
Unless I misread your post, to forgive a debtor, you would CREDIT the debtor’s account and DEBIT an expense account. — Ken Russell .
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve googled this subject but didn’t come up with a relevant hit. My question is this: how do I book (for book purposes) forgiveness of debt on the debtor’s side. I know the tax treatment. Is it as simple as debiting the liability and crediting an (other) income account in the general ledger? Thanks, mc
Hello everyone, I am currently taking a intermediate accounting I class , and have a few questions. 1) Expense vs. Loss ex: If a company owns a plant on a river that floods every few years. During the current year it flooded causing 90,000 of uninsured damage (which has been paid). the following entry is what given as a "possibly in-correct entry" by the textbook. Dr. Retained Earnings , Flood loss 90,000 Cr. Cash 90,000 My question is , would the flood damage be a loss or a expense. Would the fact that floods are expected and that they are part of the operating environment meet the criteria as a expense?? 2) If a company buy back some of its shares during the year and then pays out a dividend on outstanding shares , do the shares they bought back receive dividends?? Im thinking no but the text doesnt even cover this , but it does seem wrong to me that a public company would be able to allocate dividends to shares they bought back because it would decrease the retained earnings. Sorry for such a long post , i should have mentioned this is ALL in canadian GAAP , but any help is GREATLY appreciated. Thank You.
hello everyone, I am currently taking intermediate accounting 1 , and had a few questions about some technical stuff. 1) Expense vs. Loss example ; A company has a warehouse near a river , the river floods every few years . This year the river flooded and cause 90,000 in uninsured damage , which is what was paid to fix the damage. The book gives us a "possible incorrect entry" : dr. Retained Earning ,flood loss —-90,000 My question is , the fact that the river is expected to flood and it is part of the operating environment , would that be enough for it to be considered a expense?? I was thinking if this should be treated as a expense then the correct entry would be ; dr. Retained earnings , flood expense 90,000 cr. Cash 90,000 2) If a company buys back some of its shares during the current year and then declares dividends on the outstanding shares , is it correct for the company to allocate some of the dividends to the shares it bouht back?? Im thinking no because then the company would be debiting R.Earnings with a cash outflow to itself , seems kinda shady to me , but the book doesnt cover this topic.Any opinions? This Course is dealing with Canadian GAAP , which is suppose to be similiar to US GAAP i believe , anyway any help is greatly appreciated , Thank You. Eddie
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello everyone, I am currently taking a intermediate accounting I class , and have a few questions. 1) Expense vs. Loss ex: If a company owns a plant on a river that floods every few years. During the current year it flooded causing 90,000 of uninsured damage (which has been paid). the following entry is what given as a "possibly in-correct entry" by the textbook. Dr. Retained Earnings , Flood loss 90,000 Cr. Cash 90,000 My question is , would the flood damage be a loss or a expense. Would the fact that floods are expected and that they are part of the operating environment meet the criteria as a expense??
the flood damage could be both a loss and an expense but the problem ("in-correct entry") is the debit to retained earnings, 2) If a company buy back some of its shares during the year and then pays out a dividend on outstanding shares , do the shares they bought back receive dividends?? Im thinking no but the text doesnt even cover this , but it does seem wrong to me that a public company would be able to allocate dividends to shares they bought back because it would decrease the retained earnings.
your thinking is correct
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hello everyone, I am currently taking intermediate accounting 1 , and had a few questions about some technical stuff. 1) Expense vs. Loss example ; A company has a warehouse near a river , the river floods every few years . This year the river flooded and cause 90,000 in uninsured damage , which is what was paid to fix the damage. The book gives us a "possible incorrect entry" : dr. Retained Earning ,flood loss —-90,000 My question is , the fact that the river is expected to flood and it is part of the operating environment , would that be enough for it to be considered a expense?? I was thinking if this should be treated as a expense then the correct entry would be ; dr. Retained earnings , flood expense 90,000 cr. Cash 90,000
you thinking may be off, the debit to retained earnings is wrong
True enough. However, at $90K USD per incident (say every 3 years) I would seriously evaluate the cost benefit of staying versus moving… 
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hurricane Hazel is a completely different thing than the Don River or the Humber or Rouge flooding regularly… It was just a thought. Since flooding never happens in Toronto, Canada and I know auditors who would scratch their heads at experiencing tens of thousands of flood losses every few years. Not so quick with the "never". :) http://tinyurl.com/3puyu I was responding to your phrase "flooding never happens in Toronto" and not the "flooding regularly". In any case, I don’t mean to be argumentative. Perhaps the loss occurred by a flood every few years is much less than the cost of a one time plant move or rebuilding somewhere else. Who knows, this item (rebuilding somewhere else) may be in their long term plans.
It was just a thought. Since flooding never happens in Toronto, Canada and I know auditors who would scratch their heads at experiencing tens of thousands of flood losses every few years.
Not so quick with the "never". :) http://tinyurl.com/3puyu
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hurricane Hazel is a completely different thing than the Don River or the Humber or Rouge flooding regularly… It was just a thought. Since flooding never happens in Toronto, Canada and I know auditors who would scratch their heads at experiencing tens of thousands of flood losses every few years. Not so quick with the "never". :) http://tinyurl.com/3puyu
I was responding to your phrase "flooding never happens in Toronto" and not the "flooding regularly". In any case, I don’t mean to be argumentative. Perhaps the loss occurred by a flood every few years is much less than the cost of a one time plant move or rebuilding somewhere else. Who knows, this item (rebuilding somewhere else) may be in their long term plans.
Hurricane Hazel is a completely different thing than the Don River or the Humber or Rouge flooding regularly…
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It was just a thought. Since flooding never happens in Toronto, Canada and I know auditors who would scratch their heads at experiencing tens of thousands of flood losses every few years. Not so quick with the "never". :) http://tinyurl.com/3puyu
Thanks to everyone for the help , I am familiar with "extra-ordinary" events but we as a class have not yet covered this subject (it is part of the next chapter) . Thanks to those you pointed out that Debiting the RE was incorrect i had originally thought that with "Loss" was also debited from RE , such as a expense , but i take it im wrong right? , from reading the responses im beggining to think that they consider the flood damage a loss and that the mistake is in the debiting of the RE , just out of curiosty if it were a loss , what would be the journal entry ? Cash would be credited but what would the debit be?? Thanks again.
It was just a thought. Since flooding never happens in Toronto, Canada and I know auditors who would scratch their heads at experiencing tens of thousands of flood losses every few years. — Stephanie Serba, AICIA Partner, Durham Business Outsource Accounting & Technology smserba <at dbo <dot ca www.dbo.ca
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The correct entry would be to an Extraordinary Expense, Flood Loss and would be stated in the income statement as such. Personally, I’d recommend they MOVE. Might be hard to explain to the CCRA or the IRS why they stay somewhere that means losses of this nature every 3 to 4 years… It should be pointed out though there are people in California who got flooded recently, they were previously never in a flood area, the area was previously desert. Moving may not necessarily be an option. For example the entire state of Indiana is flooded right now. —-== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= East/West-Coast Server Farms – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello everyone, I am currently taking a intermediate accounting I class , and have a few questions. 1) Expense vs. Loss ex: If a company owns a plant on a river that floods every few years. During the current year it flooded causing 90,000 of uninsured damage (which has been paid). the following entry is what given as a "possibly in-correct entry" by the textbook. Dr. Retained Earnings , Flood loss 90,000 Cr. Cash 90,000 My question is , would the flood damage be a loss or a expense. Would the fact that floods are expected and that they are part of the operating environment meet the criteria as a expense?? the flood damage could be both a loss and an expense but the problem ("in-correct entry") is the debit to retained earnings,
The correct entry would be to an Extraordinary Expense, Flood Loss and would be stated in the income statement as such. Personally, I’d recommend they MOVE. Might be hard to explain to the CCRA or the IRS why they stay somewhere that means losses of this nature every 3 to 4 years… 2) If a company buy back some of its shares during the year and then pays out a dividend on outstanding shares , do the shares they bought back receive dividends?? Im thinking no but the text doesnt even cover this , but it does seem wrong to me that a public company would be able to allocate dividends to shares they bought back because it would decrease the retained earnings. your thinking is correct
Dividends are paid to owners of outstanding shares, not unissued or TREASURY stock. Shares which were owned by stockholders and bought back by the issuing company are TREASURY shares. They are otherwise treated the same as unissued stock. — Stephanie Serba, AICIA Partner, Durham Business Outsource Accounting & Technology smserba <at dbo <dot ca www.dbo.ca
The correct entry would be to an Extraordinary Expense, Flood Loss and would be stated in the income statement as such. Personally, I’d recommend they MOVE. Might be hard to explain to the CCRA or the IRS why they stay somewhere that means losses of this nature every 3 to 4 years…
It should be pointed out though there are people in California who got flooded recently, they were previously never in a flood area, the area was previously desert. Moving may not necessarily be an option. For example the entire state of Indiana is flooded right now. —-== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com – Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==—- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups —= East/West-Coast Server Farms – Total Privacy via Encryption =—
If so were you able to import all your data? thank you
I recently converted a company’s DacEasy customers, invoices, vendors and bills to QuickBooks US. We converted reports printed to text files to QB import files. — Karl E Irvin, CPA Arlington, Texas
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If so were you able to import all your data? thank you
Gree…@hotmail.com (Greg Hanson) wrote in message <news:35120b16.0207311541.79269f12@posting.google.com>… > Hey! Must be the money!
the foster care who initially had my son,were approved for emergency funds-two days later-he was moved-my quiet,sad child was a "problem child" according to these people(which is such a false statement-as anyone who knows this child,he is a very kind,well behaved,helpful child who listens)the only reason they waited two days was because one of those days was a holiday-take the money and run-or just lie so it can keep that money flowing
Thank you. I shall fwd this to ascps, also. It appears that DCFS or ILDCFS has very poor fiscal controls. It seems as if at least half of the expenditures are not properly documented in proper fashion. Especially when *relative foster care* or kinship foster care is supposed to be favored over *stranger foster care.* Yet, Illinois DCFS takes children (sick teen) from home merely because the young lady has IBS. A physician concurred that the daughter had a documentable physical illness, yet DCFS placed the girl in a residential treatment center. Lots of opportunity for graft, corruption, kickbacks in the foster care system. Really lax accounting controls. Thank you. http://www.donttakeourkids.com (Midwest support group for DSS, DHR, FIA, etc families who have been subjected to illegalities by CPS) http://www.CPSWatch.com (Missouri DCS, SRS, DFS site for families to learn the law and network) DESCRIPTORS; FOSTER CARE, OIG, GAO, GA, ASFA,PSSF,CAPTA,WHITE COLLAR CRIME, CHILD PROTECTIVE SERVICES, CPS,DFS,CSB,DCS,DCYF,KICKBACK, ACCOUNTANCY, GRAS,FOURTH AMENDMENT, MILLER V YOUAKIM, (USSC decision on foster care, 1979)
Hey! Must be the money!
You requested this report card for double ought, don’t believe ‘one’ is out, but will relay, (it’s only what they want you to see though) REPORT DIGEST DEPARTMENT OF CHILDREN AND FAMILY SERVICES FINANCIAL AND COMPLIANCE AUDIT For the Year Ended: June 30, 2000 Summary of Findings: Total this audit 17 Total last audit 20 Repeated from last audit 8 Release Date: April 5, 2001 State of Illinois Office of the Auditor General WILLIAM G. HOLLAND AUDITOR GENERAL To obtain a copy of the Report contact: Office of the Auditor General Attn: Records Manager Iles Park Plaza 740 E Springfield, IL 62703 (217)782-6046 or TDD (217) 524-4646 This Report Digest is also available on the worldwide web at http://www.state.il.us/auditor <<http://www.state.il.us/auditor>> SYNOPSIS The Department received a qualified opinion on its financial statements for the year ended June 30, 2000 because of inadequate controls over certain areas, specifically: Annual physical inventory of property was not reliable and adequate property records were not maintained. Leases and installment purchases were not properly recorded or reported to the State Comptroller. Emergency purchase vouchers issued to foster parents for clothing and furniture were not adequately controlled. Inadequate oversight for expenditures made for children’s personal and physical maintenance resulted in a lack of adequate documentation and questionable expenditures. Child welfare and foster care files lacked required documentation as set by State law. Written procedures had not been developed to ensure that a foster family home that is the subject of an indicated report is scheduled for re-examination at least annually. Inadequate controls in a local office resulted in two employees being paid a total of $10,049 for unauthorized overtime. The Department did not perform sufficient monitoring of its contractors which provide services to children. We selected three such providers to review onsite and identified various weaknesses which led us to question 40 percent of the dollars tested. DEPARTMENT OF CHILDREN AND FAMILY SERVICES FINANCIAL AND COMPLIANCE AUDIT For The Year Ended June 30, 2000 EXPENDITURE STATISTICS FY 2000 FY 1999 Total Expenditures (All Funds) $1,358,691,603 $1,346,856,817 OPERATIONS TOTAL % of Total Expenditures $274,729,018 20% $262,415,540 20% Personal Services % of Operations Expenditures Average No. of Employees $176,551,809 64% 4,189 $169,989,246 65% 4,183 Other Payroll Costs (FICA, Retirement) % of Operations Expenditures $37,102,724 14% $35,383,355 13% Contractual Services % of Operations Expenditures $38,618,369 14% $34,630,250 13% All Other Operations Items % of Operations Expenditures $22,456,116 8% $22,412,689 9% LUMP SUM AND OTHER PURPOSES TOTAL % of Total Expenditures $47,543,195 4% $45,261,283 3% AWARDS AND GRANTS TOTAL % of Total Expenditures $1,036,419,390 76% $1,039,179,994 77% Cost of Property and Equipment (unaudited) $39,968,730 $34,025,242 SELECTED ACTIVITY MEASURES (unaudited) FY 2000 FY 1999 Hotline Calls 306,818 304,945 Children served in- Regular foster care Specialized foster care Relative care Residential placements Independent living 8,895 5,847 12,490 2,471 969 10,350 6,068 17,739 2,722 1,057 Finalized adoptions 6,281 7,275 AGENCY DIRECTOR During Audit Period: Mr. Jess McDonald Currently: Mr. Jess McDonald Auditors’ Opinion Qualified Physical inventory and property records not reliable Information on leases and installment purchases not adequate Emergency purchase vouchers are like "signed blank checks" and must be controlled Questionable expenditures made for children’s personal and physical maintenance Questionable purchases Lack of documentation Unauthorized purchaser Untimely approval Conflicts with Department policy No evidence of charge-backs to caregivers Child case files incomplete and not timely prepared Lack of written procedures to re-examine foster family homes Unauthorized overtime totaling $10,049 paid to two employees Insufficient monitoring of contractors providing services to children Contractor’s Executive Director received questionable payments Contractor had incomplete personnel files Contractor’s property records had weaknesses Contractor paid rent to a related party Contractor paid for non-client entertainment Contractor lacked documentation to support gas purchases Inspector General, created in 1993, lacks operational rules required by law FINDINGS, CONCLUSIONS, AND RECOMMENDATIONS QUALIFIED OPINION Our audit of the financial statements of the Department of Children and Family Services for the year ended June 30, 2000 resulted in a qualified opinion. The Department did not maintain adequate control over its property and equipment, and did not maintain adequate records of leases and installment purchases. As a result of these weaknesses, certain amounts reported in the financial statements and accompanying notes are management’s estimates and were not audited Property and Equipment Although the Department attempted a physical inventory of fixed assets for fiscal year 2000, it contained numerous errors and could not be relied upon. Our prior audit reported that annual inventories of fixed assets were not performed for fiscal years 1999 or 1998. The Department attempted to maintain a property control log and an Additions and Deletions Register for fiscal year 2000. However, equipment vouchers could not be traced to the inventory listing from CMS or any Department property control log. The prior audit reported these records were not maintained for fiscal year 1999. The Department’s financial statements reported approximately $40 million in property, plant and equipment at June 30, 2000, $11 million in property additions and $5 million in property deletions for fiscal year 2000. (Finding 1, pages 14-15) Leases and Installment Purchases Information concerning new leases and multi-year installment purchases and the related acquired equipment was not accumulated or reported properly. Original contracts were not properly processed within the Department making it impossible for the Department or the State Comptroller to timely record, report and classify the transactions. Due to the lack of sufficient evidence as to the existence or amounts of such transactions, the General Long-Term Debt Account Group (other than vested vacation and sick pay), the General Fixed Assets Account Group and the related notes were not audited. (Finding 2, pages 16-17) Department officials agreed with these findings and stated they have implemented new procedures and assigned specific responsibilities to staff to resolve the weaknesses noted CONTROLS OVER EMERGENCY PURCHASE VOUCHERS The Department did not have adequate control over emergency purchase vouchers called "932 Forms". These forms are issued to enable foster parents to purchase emergency items for their foster children, such as clothing and furniture. The forms may be taken to certain retail department stores, and used similar to a "signed blank check" within an authorized limit. The "932 Forms" are supposed to report the identification number of the foster child being provided for. We noted that in certain circumstances, the "932 Forms" were charged to a "dummy child identification number." In addition, the stores were not being required to obtain identification from the bearer of the fo rms upon use and the forms did not have an authorized limit pre-printed on the face of the form. Finally, the issuance of these forms was not adequately tracked by the caseworker who issued them; rather an attempt was made to track them after they had been processed. Failure to maintain good controls over the use of these forms could result in purchases of unsanctioned items. (Finding 5, page 20) Department officials agreed with our recommendation to improve controls over emergency purchase vouchers. They stated they implemented a revised "932 Form" as of July 1, 2000 and also enhanced controls over the use, approval and processing of the form. INADEQUATE OVERSIGHT OVER CHILD CARE EXPENDITURES The Department did not have adequate oversight for expenditures made for children’s personal and physical maintenance. This has resulted in several problems ranging from a lack of adequate documentation for expenditures to questionable expenditures due to case status and service code discrepancies. During Fiscal Year 2000, the Department expended $6.4 million from an appropriation for personal and physical maintenance for children. Department officials stated the majority of the initial and replacement clothing for children are paid from this appropriation. Additionally, expenditures include camp and educational fees, cultural enrichment, travel, graduation expenses, and tutoring. These payments are in addition to regular monthly payments to caregivers for the child’s room, board, clothing and allowance. We selected 100 vouchers paid from the children’s personal and physical maintenance appropriation to test for appropriateness and adequacy of support. Lack of oversight contributed to exceptions in 49 of the 100 vouchers tested and resulted in questioned expenditures of $43,695. Some cases had multiple exceptions. The exceptions are summarized as follows: We questioned 18 expenditures for reasons such as the child did not have an open case with the Department at the time of the purchase or the child was not eligible for the goods or services purchased because of the type of placement the child was in (such as foster home, home of parent, etc.). For some types of placements the payment items would be included in the contractual rate.
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I remember the Blue Oyster, that’s the best part of the movie. I love it. Not so much for the bikers, as the cops reaction. Baton Rouge has their own weather, I’m very close to Alexandria and whenever Mark says he’s got a storm in Dallas, we see it the next day. The last time we saw any hurricane aftermath was Andrew. It gave us a pretty good flood, but no more so than the last storm Mark and I shared a couple weeks ago. Grace
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m a Gold Wing rider, mostly. Wingers are more apt to be wearing suits and ties on the road. Either that or the very expensive leather. I was up at Lake Isabella a couple or three weeks ago when about 40 or 50 Harleys came roaring in. They sound great, don’t they? From the beards, tattoos, cutoffs, long hair, and leather you’d have thought it was time to evacuate the area before all hell broke loose. But the beards and hair were more gray than any other color and the bikes were top-of-the-line new bikes. Probably a bunch of accountants, insurance salesmen, Brando wannabees, and loan officers. Remember the Blue Oyster biker bar in Police Academy? The crotch rocket riders all seem to be high school or college kids. They’re more danger to themselves than anyone else, I think. I don’t know about the weather. I lived in Baton Rouge for three years and went through two hurricanes. I drove home from work through the side of the eye of Betsy in ‘63. 150 mph winds. Interesting ride. We didn’t get many of those in Dallas, although there was the remnant of one went through there in ‘81 or ‘82 that dumped 34" of rain in three days. Cheers, Dave It’s that way here too mostly. Our local average harley rider is mid 40’s and honestly employeed. A few of our local lawyers ride everyweekend. They wear leather, show off their tattoos and let their hair down, literally. You can’t tell them apart from the thugs. We have small chapter of a relatively small gang, Satan’s Tramps. I met a couple a few years ago when I was doing my bartending days and they all seemed very agreeable and nice. IIRC, the president owned or foreman’d a construction company. The crotch rocket (racing bumblebee honda types) people are disdained I believe for the most part. Central Louisiana is a very active american bike society. Dallas sounds similiar to ours, it’s close enough that we share the weather at least Overall, locally they’re really great guys, and women. They love their bikes dearly. I don’t know of any that drive ragtag bikes, they’re mostly all nice showroom floor beauties. And, you’re right, these people are in their late late thirties, forties None my age, their twenties. Although I’m looking awful hard at them. If you are under 30, you’d probably drive a relatively lowcost economy suzuki or honda thingie, definitely japanese. I went into our local Harley shop the other day to buy the baby a couple onesie outfits. I drooled over the bikes, was met with very nice staff but wasn’t asked if I needed help until I got into the clothing. — Life has been depicted as a tree, the tree of life, and Man is the sap running through it.
It was a dark and stormy night. Well, dark at least. Because it was night. And nights are, of course, dark. Yowie —
This is indeed a masterpiece. Annie
You know, you should really be getting paid for this stuff instead of so freely sharing it with us!!! Gad your a stitch. Karen
Karen wrote You know, you should really be getting paid for this stuff instead of so freely sharing it with us!!! Gad your a stitch.
Hey, shush there. Naughty Karen. Are you trying to spoil my Storypage? I have 41 Yowie articles there, plus another 29 [erk!] still to put on. So don’t go giving her ideas. I bet Flippy would prefer you didn’t as well!! — David Stevenson Storypage: http://blakjak.com/sty_menu.htm Nanki Poo: SI Bp+W B 9 Y L+ W+ C+ I T+ A- E H++ V- F Q B+ PA+ PL+ SC
It’s that way here too mostly. Our local average harley rider is mid 40’s and honestly employeed. A few of our local lawyers ride everyweekend. They wear leather, show off their tattoos and let their hair down, literally. You can’t tell them apart from the thugs.
Here, too. You never see anyone on a Harley here under the age of 50. (probably they can’t afford them!!) They’re all businessmen from all walks. Sherry
I’m a Gold Wing rider, mostly. Wingers are more apt to be wearing suits and ties on the road. Either that or the very expensive leather. I was up at Lake Isabella a couple or three weeks ago when about 40 or 50 Harleys came roaring in. They sound great, don’t they? From the beards, tattoos, cutoffs, long hair, and leather you’d have thought it was time to evacuate the area before all hell broke loose. But the beards and hair were more gray than any other color and the bikes were top-of-the-line new bikes. Probably a bunch of accountants, insurance salesmen, Brando wannabees, and loan officers. Remember the Blue Oyster biker bar in Police Academy? The crotch rocket riders all seem to be high school or college kids. They’re more danger to themselves than anyone else, I think. I don’t know about the weather. I lived in Baton Rouge for three years and went through two hurricanes. I drove home from work through the side of the eye of Betsy in ‘63. 150 mph winds. Interesting ride. We didn’t get many of those in Dallas, although there was the remnant of one went through there in ‘81 or ‘82 that dumped 34" of rain in three days. Cheers, Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s that way here too mostly. Our local average harley rider is mid 40’s and honestly employeed. A few of our local lawyers ride everyweekend. They wear leather, show off their tattoos and let their hair down, literally. You can’t tell them apart from the thugs. We have small chapter of a relatively small gang, Satan’s Tramps. I met a couple a few years ago when I was doing my bartending days and they all seemed very agreeable and nice. IIRC, the president owned or foreman’d a construction company. The crotch rocket (racing bumblebee honda types) people are disdained I believe for the most part. Central Louisiana is a very active american bike society. Dallas sounds similiar to ours, it’s close enough that we share the weather at least Overall, locally they’re really great guys, and women. They love their bikes dearly. I don’t know of any that drive ragtag bikes, they’re mostly all nice showroom floor beauties. And, you’re right, these people are in their late late thirties, forties None my age, their twenties. Although I’m looking awful hard at them. If you are under 30, you’d probably drive a relatively lowcost economy suzuki or honda thingie, definitely japanese. I went into our local Harley shop the other day to buy the baby a couple onesie outfits. I drooled over the bikes, was met with very nice staff but wasn’t asked if I needed help until I got into the clothing.
– Life has been depicted as a tree, the tree of life, and Man is the sap running through it.
Hi, Yowie LOL! Sounds like quite a night. Your effect on the guys reminds me of my ex-wife. She was, and probably still is, a nice lady. About six feet tall, built like an amazon, but with a rather school-marmish demeanor. Think Miss Hathaway on the "Beverly Hillbillies" but prettier. She had a Master’s in Psychology and taught foreign languages at the local high school. Anywho, motorcycles have been my preferred mode of transportation since I was eleven, but I never bought into the biker culture. Just plain vanilla, that’s me. For some reason, there for a while she and I wound up riding with the Bandidos (think Hell’s Angels) for about a year. It still amazes me to think of my riding with that bunch, maybe a hundred or so of some of the baddest dudes I’ve ever met, in person or on the tellie or anywhere else. Them with their cut-offs and tattoos, beards and choppers, and old ladies that could and would outcuss, outdrink, outfight, and out ‘mean’ any females I’ve ever been around. I’ll never forget the time we were cruising down the highway in Texas and the Highway Patrol, about ten carloads of them, pulled us all over. They told me to stand to one side, then tumbled the other bikers for drugs, warrants, and weapons. Several of them got hauled off to the pokey and almost all got citations for traffic violations. The police never said a word to me. Brenda had the same effect on those bikers you did on Joel and his buddies. When she appeared they cleaned up their language and their manners to an astonishing degree. They would sit and chat politely with her like a lot of unruly children suddenly invited into the teach’s parlor. Cheers, Dave
my presence seem to turn them all into polite gentlemen. Magazines featuring excess silicon in bizarre and painful looking shapes are shuffled quietly under the table and the creative and colourful language being sqawked at the top of their lungs suddenly drops to the rigid politeness of a business meeting. I admit, its rather charming that they all turn into gentlemen when I am around,
– Life has been depicted as a tree, the tree of life, and Man is the sap running through it.
The Bandidos Dave??? You never fail to amaze a few of us I’m sure. ROFL. Do you have any pictures of you on a motorcycle surrounded by the "criminal elements"? Going off topic, that’s a bee in my bonnet truth be told. Many of my friends own Harley Davidsons. Those things don’t come cheap. To afford one of the nicer ones, you really have to have a decent job, steady income etc etc. It’s like owning a 20+K vehicle. Oh, I’m sure you can get them cheaper, probably by a good bit. But those dedicated to the bike aren’t your normal criminal element. Grrrrrrr, I hate, hate, hate when people assume a bike rally is one big drug induced alcoholic orgy. What they may look like on the weekend, you can bet your riding boots there are a few prominant citizens in the bunch. The only big rally we have here is the yearly PokerRun. Area bikeriders gather together and do a marathon type run. They draw a hand of cards and based on what they drew, is how much money goes to charity. Or something like that. I’ve never participated but it’s huge (whatever they do) and it all goes to the kidlets. However, unfortunately, there’s been entirely too many instances involving gangs lately. It’s sad how quickly they can smear most any leather wearing biker’s reputation. Grace whose dream is Sterlington one day
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Yowie LOL! Sounds like quite a night.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It was a dark and stormy night. Well, dark at least. Because it was night. And nights are, of course, dark. If it wasn’t dark it would be light,and therefore it would be day. And it wasn’t day. It was night. And it was dark. And lets just agree it could have been stormy as well, because if we don’t I’ll never start the story. (fabulous story!!!) B*st*rd C*t Yowie — RPCA FAQ: http://www.angelfire.com/mt/yowie/catfaq.htm
Yowie, you had me rolling on the floor this a.m. reading this! Can I assume you do know of the Dark and Stormy Night contest that takes place yearly in California? If you ever decide to give up your day job you’d make a fantastic writer as you’re as close as it comes to a natural born storyteller. More, more, please! Christine
Hi, Grace I don’t know about there, but here the Harley riders are generally geezers or close to it. The younger guys can’t afford the Harleys. It’s mostly older men trying to recapture their youth. The biker thugs generally ride old, beat-up bikes they buy cheap. Few of them ride Harleys and none except the drug dealers ride new ones. In Dallas the older guys hold big rallies at Christmas to gather toys for kids who might not get presents from home. They also raise money for charity, etc. However, there are still a few of the wild ones out there, and they are not to be trifled with. Witness what happened at Las Vegas the other night. Mostly, when they do fight, they fight among themselves. Bothering ordinary people is a good way to bring the wrath of the law down on them. When I lived in Mexico back in the early 70’s, hippies and other undesirables were not allowed to cross the bridge into Mexico; they were turned back at the border. Then the Hell’s Angels came through on their yearly cross-country trip. One couple decided they wanted to get married in Ciudad Juarez, across from El Paso, Texas. Six hundred bikers crossed the bridge. Not one stopped or even slowed down for Mexican Customs and Immigration. The Mexicans would have had to call out the Army to stop them. For days the Angels roamed the streets, getting into fights with the law and raising hell in general. After they left, the Mexicans just threw up their hands and let anybody in. Ah, for the good old days <sniff. Cheers, Dave Going off topic, that’s a bee in my bonnet truth be told. Many of my friends own Harley Davidsons. Those things don’t come cheap.
– Life has been depicted as a tree, the tree of life, and Man is the sap running through it.
It’s that way here too mostly. Our local average harley rider is mid 40’s and honestly employeed. A few of our local lawyers ride everyweekend. They wear leather, show off their tattoos and let their hair down, literally. You can’t tell them apart from the thugs. We have small chapter of a relatively small gang, Satan’s Tramps. I met a couple a few years ago when I was doing my bartending days and they all seemed very agreeable and nice. IIRC, the president owned or foreman’d a construction company. The crotch rocket (racing bumblebee honda types) people are disdained I believe for the most part. Central Louisiana is a very active american bike society. Dallas sounds similiar to ours, it’s close enough that we share the weather at least Overall, locally they’re really great guys, and women. They love their bikes dearly. I don’t know of any that drive ragtag bikes, they’re mostly all nice showroom floor beauties. And, you’re right, these people are in their late late thirties, forties None my age, their twenties. Although I’m looking awful hard at them. If you are under 30, you’d probably drive a relatively lowcost economy suzuki or honda thingie, definitely japanese. I went into our local Harley shop the other day to buy the baby a couple onesie outfits. I drooled over the bikes, was met with very nice staff but wasn’t asked if I needed help until I got into the clothing. I hear you about the wild ones. I was think about the Vegas incident when I was speaking of that barrel of bad apples. I know where’re you at, or close to in (San Fran) the local Hells Angels chapter lost their president a few years ago due to drugs etc. Maybe it’s location. Here in the south, I rarely hear anything horrible come from our rallies. The last few occurances I’ve read about happened in the southwest and out your way. And yes, it was among themselves. A few local small various chapters were wanting to get together just thirty minutes away in a place called Marksville. They wanted it to be a big popular place and our locals had nine different fits. They shut down the rally by effectively asking other regional state trooper HQ’s by giving up a few of their men for the weekend, for sheriff’s departments to lend a few of their own etc etc etc. They, local law and citizens, really panicked and so far the riders were found to be generally great lawabiding people. They made proper reservations in their rightful names at nice hotels, they secured whatever permits they needed to secure, they were going about it correctly and safely. In the end, it was cancelled because it was apparent that south-central Louisiana was not interested. After it was all said and done, a few lawyers made front page expressing their displeasure and disappointment. I think one even showed off his tattoo ROFL, you don’t mess with six hundred Hells Angels. All in all, I’ve never read anything in the tri-state area that caused a big rucus within the bikers. You have your occassional knifing or shooting between disagreeing riders, but it just seems that the drug dealing days among the Harley crowd is fast disappearing… at least here.. I take leather bikers like I do most people. I assume you’re a good person until proven otherwise. I assume all bikers are like most. Even the medical profession has a few loose nuts and murderers. We get them will all kinds. Grace
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, Grace I don’t know about there, but here the Harley riders are generally geezers or close to it. The younger guys can’t afford the Harleys. It’s mostly older men trying to recapture their youth. The biker thugs generally ride old, beat-up bikes they buy cheap. Few of them ride Harleys and none except the drug dealers ride new ones. In Dallas the older guys hold big rallies at Christmas to gather toys for kids who might not get presents from home. They also raise money for charity, etc. However, there are still a few of the wild ones out there, and they are not to be trifled with. Witness what happened at Las Vegas the other night. Mostly, when they do fight, they fight among themselves. Bothering ordinary people is a good way to bring the wrath of the law down on them. When I lived in Mexico back in the early 70’s, hippies and other undesirables were not allowed to cross the bridge into Mexico; they were turned back at the border. Then the Hell’s Angels came through on their yearly cross-country trip. One couple decided they wanted to get married in Ciudad Juarez, across from El Paso, Texas. Six hundred bikers crossed the bridge. Not one stopped or even slowed down for Mexican Customs and Immigration. The Mexicans would have had to call out the Army to stop them. For days the Angels roamed the streets, getting into fights with the law and raising hell in general. After they left, the Mexicans just threw up their hands and let anybody in. Ah, for the good old days <sniff. Cheers, Dave Going off topic, that’s a bee in my bonnet truth be told. Many of my friends own Harley Davidsons. Those things don’t come cheap. — Life has been depicted as a tree, the tree of life, and Man is the sap running through it.
Whenever I go after axe murderers in the middle of the night I always make certain to throw on a robe. It wouldn’t be easy to explain to the police why my finger prints were all over a knife but the axe murderer had died of laughter.
It was a dark and stormy night. Well, dark at least. Because it was night. And nights are, of course, dark. If it wasn’t dark it would be light,and therefore it would be day. And it wasn’t day. It was night. And it was dark. And lets just agree it could have been stormy as well, because if we don’t I’ll never start the story. It was a dark and potentially stormy night, and Joel was out with his friends getting up to secret men’s business. Generally, he claims that he was either roleplaying with his mates or playing network games where the main point seems, not to be solve all the puzzles as the advertising on the box lamely proclaims, but rather to be the player that gets to make the most red pixels to splatter across the screen. But I suspect his nights out tend to involve a fair amount of adolescent fart humour and junk food and the gaming is just the auspice that they gather together under. I have been politely invited to these nights, but dispite the huge amount raucaus laughing I hear as I walk up to the place, my presence seem to turn them all into polite gentlemen. Magazines featuring excess silicon in bizarre and painful looking shapes are shuffled quietly under the table and the creative and colourful language being sqawked at the top of their lungs suddenly drops to the rigid politeness of a business meeting. I admit, its rather charming that they all turn into gentlemen when I am around, but I can appreciate it isn’t all *fun*. So I let them do secret men’s business on a Friday night on the understanding Joel won’t complain when I use the whole of friday night to discuss with people who I have never met and live half way across the world the intricate details of our sex life. Chat rooms are secret women’s business, stupid fart jokes are secret men’s business and as long as ne’er the twain shall meet, our non-marital bliss continues. So it was a dark and stormy night and there was no Joel in the house. Why I do it I don’t know, but I take my Joelessness to not only chat with you folk but to watch really stupid horror movies. Allegedly I have at least rudimentary intellegence, although my schlock-horror fondness would suggest otherwise. And watching them all alone in the house on a dark and stormy friday night when I *know* Joel won’t come home until its time for breakfast still doesn’t hint at my otherwise adequate IQ. Still, I do it to myself – it must be a form of do-it-yourself mental torture. You know, I can watch the scariest of scary horror movies with Joel and laugh all the way through it, but even the shlockiest of B-grade horror movies can leave me curled up in a terrified little ball when he’s out. And it being a dark & stormy friday night when none of you sods are in chat to distract me from my strange, masochistic addiction (well, not until Lena wakes up – you should ring her in her morning some time, I got to learn some very intersting Swedish words!) , I took the oppurtunity to allow Mr Hammer Horror to give me the heeby jeebies. And to pig out on popcorn and soda that I don’t have to share with anyone other than Fluff. After the second movie has finished, I am suitably terrified of my own shadow. I keep Fluffy very near me, hoping that her presence will stave off the axe murderers and that perhaps Shmogg will, if not defend me directly, enjoy the novelty of drawing blood from a different set of ankles. After triple checking all the doors and locks, I cowardly leave the kitchen light on and take myself to bed, with faith in the arcane knowledge that the half inch layer of goose feathers in my doona will protect me from every weapon weilded by every demon maniac ever known to mankind. And although I don’t do it too often, instead of putting Fluffy to bed in the garage, I allow her the priveledge of sleeping on my bed with me. WOOOF WOOOF WOOOF! I spring awake, not so from the woofing so much as Fluffy’s back paws having used my stomach as a launch pad. The sleep induced confusion is quickly erased by the jolt of adrenaline as I realise Fluffy’s warning barks have dropped to a low, menacing growl. I whimper pathetic girly wimpers, and wish my strong, brave, sacrificial (did I really say that?) Joel was here. Being a post-horror movie dark and stormy night I am just a tad perturbed at the sight of my lovable doofus of a dog baring her disturbingly large canines at the back of the front door. I go to kitchen and grab the biggest knife available and hold tightly with both hands as I stand at the front door, Fluffy now "uffing" and growling. I can see her teeth. Her hackles are up. She clearly means business. I gather up all my courage and simulataneously open the door and aim the knife at … Nothing. Absolutley frigging nothing. There’s no-one there. The most threatening thing outside is the weather. I laugh at my little self induced predicament to settle down the adrenaline, having worked myself up into a terribly nervous state by watching all those stupid horror movies and drinking too much black coffee to help me stay awake. Clearly, I am *wired* and just letting my admittedly over active imagination get the better of me. Fluff was probably just barking at the neighbours coming home later, as the are often want to do. And I go back to bed, I laugh self conciously a bit harder at the scene I just made – standing at the front door in all my naked white wobbly glory trying to look all threatening with my big huge carving knife and a large, vicious looking black dog who was growling and bearing her teeth most satisfactorily, all the while knowing deep down that we are both utter wimps. I close the front door, all fear vanished by my giggles. "What a classic" I think. I laugh again, and continue giggle myself into a happy slumber, all fear vanquished. WOOF WOOOF WOOOF WOOOOOF grrrr! WOOOF! Grrrrrrr. The scene is repeated several times during the Dark And Stormy Night of Joels Unnecessary and Increasingly Selfish Absence. Each time my slumber is broken by a saber of adrenalin peircing my heart, each time I leap out of bed, automatically grabbing for carving knife via a deep seated instinct that overrides even the deepest sleep-haze. And each time I am forced, by a brainless’s dog’s warning barks, to open the door to an increasing *cold* and dark and stormy night, only to see yet more of the same nothing that was there last time. Its 5am. After the 4th time, I hold not the big knife, although that could come in handy to remove Joel’s increasingly unnecessary – he wouldn’t be needing them any time soon – parts of his anatomy, but rather the marble rolling pin. I’ve had a lot of time to think since the last burst of adrenalin has prevented me from getting back to sleep, and I have decided that whether its Joel coming home far too late or the maniacal axe murderer, a thorough clubbing with the closest thing I have to baseball bat will be infinitately more satisfying way to teach them a lesson than just wiggling a knife in their general direction. I lay in bed, quietly plotting my beloved – and anybody else’s – death. I am *not* a morning person, in fact, its been said I look like death warmed up if I’m up too early., and that is at 9:15 am when I can manage to drag my sorry carcas into work on a monday morning. It was now some mortifying time of the morning, and I was *awake*. As far as I’m concerned, the only time 5am has a right to exist on a cold and dark and stormy Saturday morning is when you’ve partied through a dark & stormy Friday night. Oh yes, I thought, unconciously checking the balance and weight of the rolling pin, oh yes, I’ll show *them* what death looks like, oh yes sir indeedie… It was a quiet sound at first, so quiet I didn’t recognise it, but Fluffy immediatly snapped out of her doze (how come she managed to sleep after barking her head of at invisible axe-weilding maniacs?), pricked her ears and looked alert. I listened more intently, waiting to see whether it was a key in the door so I could club Joel to death, or the sound of the invisible axe weliding maniac, who I would club to death. At 5am, I don’t discriminate against anyone. And then -scritch- it was a little louder. And just before we got to WOOOF WOOOF WOOOF grrr WOOOF WOOOF yet again, the last scratch on the door happened, and a grey furry streak of utter malevolence streaked down the hallway and past my bedroom door. Shmogg was using Fluffy’s trick of scratching at the door to go out. But going out, interesting as it is, is not half as much fun as truly terrifying the can-opener blob on legs. I mean, just ask him, she likes being scared – otherwise why on earth would she watch those stupid horror movies all by herself. He was keeping me entertained he was, you honour, as all good sweet little kitty cats should. besides, our honour, I plead extenuating circumstances: after all, it was raining ot there. Joel had no idea, when he finally came home a few minutes later, why I was a blubbering and hysterical mess, or even why I even happened to be awake at that hideous time of the morning. I still had the rolling pin in my hand and I was muttering incoherantly about vicious dogs, horror movies, invisible axe weilding maniacs and bastard cats. I was shaking, crying and buck naked. And no, my being awake and upset was *not* to his advantage at all. But his coming home at just the right time probably single handedly saved Shmogg from being made into feline pastry. And do you think B*st*rd C*t was grateful for this last minute reprieve? Hell no, he wizzed in on Joel’s D&D books for being out so late. B*st*rd C*t Yowie — RPCA FAQ: http://www.angelfire.com/mt/yowie/catfaq.htm
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Options premium or discount Well what I am saying first is that I have never seen any empirical research to support views expressed by the likes of Bill Parish who is highly critical of Microsoft Fin a/cs to support the adjustments he wants to make.. ie he wants to adjust the revenue statements for he reckons the way they are expressed currently is misleading. (And he may well be right ) If someone can point to the reasoned research to support what he says I may agree. I merely point out to the good folks that if you are going to manipulate the revenue statement, then by definition you are going to manipulate the balance sheet. I havent seen any research to support abandoning double entry book-keeping, and I probably think that would be a very bold move. Its been around since sometime in the 1400’s So what I am saying is, if the research shows the use of options in place of salary remuneration is bad, then the process needs to be stopped. A start on reducing the excesses could be to no longer allow a corporate a tax deduction, for tax that is actually paid by an employee. This is probably unique to USA in corporate tax law. If this is not enough to stop the use. then apply some kind of Penal tax to them an expesive option or for the control freaks make it illegal for corporates to issue shares in lieu of salary. But the effects of even wiping the corporate tax deduction in USA is probably enormous. Just go and look at the figures for Microsoft alone. summary : I am sticking to double entry book=keeping. I am not adjusting the revenue statement with a single entry accounting entry because I dont want to distort my balance sheet. But if the research shows the use of options is bad, then the method to arrive at cessation lies elsewhere. The premium/ discount cant be handled by double entry because it is never going into a corporate bank a/c Jim Black
Other than a few Egyptians whose names I’ll leave unspoken, no one here wants to abandon double entry bookkeeping. If there are any Bill Parish fans here I’m not aware of it. — Jim Hudspeth, CFE, CPA http://survivalworks.com
Hello My name is Jim Black and I live in Auckland New Zealand I have been following the debate re Options accounting, or lack of it. This is primarily as a result of receiving info ex Bill parish whom you have probably heard of.
<snip Hi Jim, I’ve read your post several times and quite honestly I do not understand where you are trying to go. If you are trying to say that GAAP provisions regarding option accounting are grossly deficient, I would agree with you. If you are trying to propose a solution, I was not able to understand what it was. — Jim Hudspeth, CFE, CPA http://survivalworks.com
Options premium or discount Well what I am saying first is that I have never seen any empirical research to support views expressed by the likes of Bill Parish who is highly critical of Microsoft Fin a/cs to support the adjustments he wants to make.. ie he wants to adjust the revenue statements for he reckons the way they are expressed currently is misleading. (And he may well be right ) If someone can point to the reasoned research to support what he says I may agree. I merely point out to the good folks that if you are going to manipulate the revenue statement, then by definition you are going to manipulate the balance sheet. I havent seen any research to support abandoning double entry book-keeping, and I probably think that would be a very bold move. Its been around since sometime in the 1400’s So what I am saying is, if the research shows the use of options in place of salary remuneration is bad, then the process needs to be stopped. A start on reducing the excesses could be to no longer allow a corporate a tax deduction, for tax that is actually paid by an employee. This is probably unique to USA in corporate tax law. If this is not enough to stop the use. then apply some kind of Penal tax to them an expesive option or for the control freaks make it illegal for corporates to issue shares in lieu of salary. But the effects of even wiping the corporate tax deduction in USA is probably enormous. Just go and look at the figures for Microsoft alone. summary : I am sticking to double entry book=keeping. I am not adjusting the revenue statement with a single entry accounting entry because I dont want to distort my balance sheet. But if the research shows the use of options is bad, then the method to arrive at cessation lies elsewhere. The premium/ discount cant be handled by double entry because it is never going into a corporate bank a/c Jim Black
Hello My name is Jim Black and I live in Auckland New Zealand I have been following the debate re Options accounting, or lack of it. This is primarily as a result of receiving info ex Bill parish whom you have probably heard of. I commenced communicating with him , but he either is having doubts, or he maybe considers me to be a nutter. Basically I have pointed out to him that in essence double entry book-keeping contemplates a few fundamentals. 1 That everything at some point in time will flow through a bank account 2 That for every debit there is an equal credit. 3 That when considering a debit going into an account then the credit is by definition either Revenue income or Sale of Asset or A liability or Forms part of shareholders equity. And that there are probably such things as zero realisations/ transactions, even although our adding machines or fingers cant count them. Now it is fundamental that the issue price is recorded by the corporation. because essentially at some point it is going to flow into a bank account. So it is perfectly logical to credit this to some portion of shareholders equity. It exists , until collected it is an asset. It is an asset that a liquidator can call on. (normally unless the entity called upon is itself bust ) Immediately after the entry the shareholders equity has increased, (on a liquidation basis anyway) The problem arises with the premium or the discount. Because this amount will never, and is never intended to flow through the coy bank account. As soon as you start to deem a debit to the Revenue account for notional wages, you have to contemplate what you do with the credit. It is on this issue that I cannot get a response from Bill Parish. Proponents of debiting an entry to the revenue statemen are invariably also saying they are quite happy to distort the balance sheet. I have said to him, by all means you may as an analyst adjust the earnings for your own analytical purposes, but by definition when you do so you are really resorting to single entry book-keeping ( if there is such a thing ? ). The problem with the credit: We haven’t sold an asset so we cant credit that. We do not actually have any more liabilities, so we can’t credit that If we credit it to revenue. we now simply have a contra, and so we have actually done nothing. That only leaves shareholders equity. And I can’t see how or why these figures should be distorted, because on a liquidation it simply does not exist. What I have suggested is that of course allowing the US corp to claim a tax crerit, equal to the tax paid by the employee is a nice americanism. It certainly is not claimable in NZ or Australia or in the UK. Presuming the research is available to support the claim that "options are bad " or at such and such a level "options become bad " then there are ways to fix the problem outside going away from double entry accounting. a No longer allow the corporation to claim any tax credit. b If this is not enough, then for tax purposes only "deem" that the realised premium on options is taxable to the corporation. Then rate the tax on the option at such a level that it would be un-economic to issue options as a means of remuneration. entry Dr Tax on Options income (revenue) Cr Provision for Tax (bal sheet ) Now having done all that, sit down and try and work out if you can the following economic effects a What should be done with the extra tax earned by Uncle sam b What will the effect be on the values of portfolios held by investors from lil old Mrs Joe Brown with her 2000 Utah steel Shares her grand dad left her, to Barclays Bank Massive Fund. etc c What will the effect be on the dividend payouts from the companies d Will the effect or effects be such that you plunge the whole world economics into chaos, and a worse depression than the 1930’s. kindest regards Jim Black would be intrested in your comments
We use BusinessWorks 11.0. Our company factors its accounts receivable. I am wondering how to book the factoring transactions within BusinessWorks so that the specific receivable is relieved from our balance sheet at the time it is factored, but can be recovered in the event that the customer does not pay the factor in a timely fashion and we are forced to buy back the given receivable. Your help would be very much appreciated. Thanks. Anita
Here’s what is suggested for QuickBooks, maybe it will be helpful: http://www.quickbooks.com/support/faqs/win2/1620.html
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We use BusinessWorks 11.0. Our company factors its accounts receivable. I am wondering how to book the factoring transactions within BusinessWorks so that the specific receivable is relieved from our balance sheet at the time it is factored, but can be recovered in the event that the customer does not pay the factor in a timely fashion and we are forced to buy back the given receivable. Your help would be very much appreciated. Thanks. Anita
Cash method or accrual method? Generally, the factoring transaction will require a debit to cash for receipts, a debit to factoring fee and a credit to accounts receivable. In a "buy back" situation, that’s a factoring "with recourse", which you may later have to write off as uncollectible. Most companies would use the accrual method for their allowance for uncollectible accounts by debiting the expense, frequently also referred to as "bad debt" and crediting the allowance. This method requires an estimate of the uncollectible accounts such that the expected expense is written off rather evenly over time. Notes to the financial statements would need to explain that allowance accounting policy and the contractual requirement of recourse for the factored accounts. At the time of factoring the account, the accounts receivable was credited and both the factor fee expense account and cash account were debited (Accounts Receivable factored less the factor fee equaled the cash received from the factor). At the time of return of the account, I’m sure an additional fee would be due to the factor for their efforts, as well as the original amount the factor paid to take over the accounts receivable. The original account receivable amount being returned must be debited to accounts receivable, and fees paid for the return may be debited to the factor fee expense account or just include them with the accounts receivable debit to collect them from the customer. You would probably also want to charge them for the original discount fee to factor so credit the factor fee expense account and debit accounts receivable. When you decide the entire account, including the fees, cannot be recovered, debit the allowance for uncollectible accounts and credit the accounts receivable for the entire account balance involved. If you are using the cash accounting method, originally you debited the factor fee expense, debited the cash and credited the accounts receivable. Upon return, you’d have to debit the accounts receivable for the original amount plus any factoring fees you want to collect back from the customer, credit the cash for the entire payment to the factor, which would be for their fees plus what they had already given you to buy the account. The difference, if any, is debited to the factoring fees expense. If you are using the direct charge-off method, rather than the uncollectible allowance method described above, at some point you may decide collection is impossible, causing you to debit Uncollectible Accounts expense, or Bad Debts expense, and credit the accounts receivable. If you should have any other questions regarding this situation, please feel Jaycee M. Rice
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We use BusinessWorks 11.0. Our company factors its accounts receivable. I am wondering how to book the factoring transactions within BusinessWorks so that the specific receivable is relieved from our balance sheet at the time it is factored, but can be recovered in the event that the customer does not pay the factor in a timely fashion and we are forced to buy back the given receivable. Your help would be very much appreciated. Thanks. Anita
Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2000 4:21 PM To: some infoworld editors Thank you for your report on UDDI in infoworld. http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/00/10/13/001013hnuddi.xml?sp… Please consider the commercial implications which will result, if this new UDDI consortium ends up being the single global directory for decades to come. (yeah, I know, this is not a "directory". its a "registry"…) Directory services are wellknown as being extraordinarily sticky, and for the characteristic of being like operating systems–there are inexorable economic reasons why the market can really only support one standard. I find no comfort in the fact that UDDI registries will be "operated" by more than one company. Note: these are all IT companies. What measures exist that this is anything but a a collective action, to sack the users? If it were anything else, then, why didn’t they conduct their design discussions openly? Where is the customer side represented? Why didn’t they work with ebXML? Why did they cherrypick some parts of ebXML and ignore others? Who will own company information in the registries? Is legislation needed, before portal operators honor the interests and the wishes of the users? Lock-in practices are perfectly legal: What if the UDDI registry operators impose costs on interfaces to other types of registries? There are so many ways to do this, it’s whack-a-mole trying to prevent them. The UDDI directory already has built-in impedance mismatches with other directories. This is a chess game. Two of the founders of UDDI are notoriously sharp chessplayers: IBM and Microsoft. Should vendors be allowed to block interfaces to competing products, forcing their users to an all-or-none decision regarding platform choice? We have not yet seen the light of dawn, on lock-in protections and accordingly, members of the press have an obligation to advocate for the side of users, especially small business users. Todd * Todd F. Boyle CPA http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * XML accounting, webledgers, BSPs, ASPs, whatever it takes
The technologies of ebXML are being torn away from the carcass and carried away by the dingoes of the software industry. ebXML is a very civilized group of course, or they would never have formed a standards body in the first place. They think it’s fine to see software companies compete on fundamental platform issues like registries and business process modeling. Frinstance, Ed Julson said Thursday, September 07, 2000 ebxml-awareness list, First of all, I believe the UDDI spec in its current incarnation provides a repository for business information that is complementary [..] The ebXML Reg/Rep focus is to build a container for the XML vocabularies, core components, and business process that are needed for the programmatic support of a business transaction or document exchange. [..] It’s conceivable that UDDI could evolve to a point of overlap
ebXML workgroups, gird your loins, and prepare to embrace and extend the work of commercial competitors. This means adopting everything which is good and not proprietary, and willfully breaking whatever they build which is proprietary. It would be lunacy for the scale of effort that has gone into ebXML to be cherrypicked by commercial competitors, without compensation. They will inevitably differentiate their technologies, breaking key parts of ebXML work. I call on UDDI to contribute all of their work to ebXML, and accommodate the requests of non-UDDI consortium participants in ebXML. Especially ebXML participants from the software buyers rather than vendors side, and small business segment rather than EDI segment…. (if you can find any… ) Is that naive? Yes of course it is. If UDDI wanted to participate in a standards process, they would be sitting at the ebXML table, instead of their corp. HQs designing UDDI. It is hard to escape the conclusion that ebXML is the same as a software company. It must compete, with its strengths, and play good poker. Software design is predominantly about securing niches and customers— more than 50% of the budget or resources of ebXML needs to be devoted to analysis of competing commercial registries, and competing commercial middleware, competing commercial repositories and modelling standards. More than 50% of commercial software developers’ budget is certainly devoted to structures necessary to secure and retain a grip on customers, in ways that cannot be immediately commoditized. BPMI somehow bothers me as well. They were formed what, August 2000? http://www.bpmi.org/faq.html –innocently they say "BPMI.org and ebXML are addressing complementary aspects of e-Business process integration. While ebXML provides a standard way to manage Collaborative Business Processes (CBP), BPMI.org focuses on the modeling, deployment, and management of Enterprise Business Processes (EBP). " Yeah right. Obviously, Business Processes extend across enterprise lines. Splitting the internal BP modelling and development from inter-entity is an unfortunate step that will setback the integration efforts by years, harming both the internal and external parties. BPML and UDDI are birds of a feather, if you ask me. Let’s get their authors integrated into ebXML, or impose consequences. The individuals who are selling this to IT are not invincible. Their story does not hang together and should be challenged. ebXML’s architecture must become a more dynamic thing, capable of willful and measured changes, TO DEFEAT COMPETITORS. You have to move up the food chain, and become the lion of the savannahs instead of the antelope. Todd * Todd F. Boyle CPA http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * XML accounting, web ledgers, BSPs, ASPs, whatever it takes
Plan Aims to Foster Electronic Commerce Between Businesses By JOHN MARKOFF N Y t i mm es SAN FRANCISCO, Sept. 4 — Seeking to promote the rapid development of electronic commerce between businesses, I.B.M., Microsoft and Ariba plan to announce a proposal on Wednesday to create a huge set of online registries of products and services to help automate business transactions.
Translation: Noticing that 200 million individuals and 28 million small businesses in the US are in serious danger of being able to conduct business between each other without paying rents to any gateways or banks or software companies, the usual monopolists have taken matters into their own hands, to get control of the reference lists of Parties, Customers, Suppliers, Items, Accounts, and the XML vocabularies for naming things, to make sure that they are all screwed up for another few years. Twenty-nine companies, including American Express, CommerceOne, Compaq, Merrill Lynch and Sun Microsystems, will initially endorse the proposal, to be named the Universal Description, Discovery and Integration project, or UDDI. The backers said they planned to turn the idea over eventually to one of several Internet standards bodies to make it a broadly backed initiative.
… but only after they dictate all the architecture decisions, and their programmers have a 12-18 month head start over competitors… "We are intent on making the Web an easier way to handle business-to-business transactions…." [snip] said Marie Weik,
I.B.M.’s director of electronic markets infrastructure … in EDI format, for America’s leading Corporations." The initiative comes at a time when companies have begun to grapple with the intricacies of electronic commerce, hoping to achieve the original promise of a new Internet publishing standard known as Extensible Markup Language, or XML.
… "XML Tags will be wrapped around EDI elements. Establishing Registries and Repositories for automation of EDI configurations will provide a breakthru in productivity for EDI specialists. " Hypertext Markup Language, or HTML, led to the current World Wide Web as a vast publishing medium. Many hope XML will permit direct computer-to-computer transactions in the next generation of the Web. Until recently, the UDDI project was a closely held secret among the three companies. While I.B.M. and Microsoft are dominant players in Internet commerce, Ariba is a smaller electronic commerce company, based in Mountain View, Calif.
Actually they hadn’t thought of it until the August ebXML meeting, which provided a number of free whitepapers and presentations from the brightest and most forward looking ecommerce engineers on earth. Noticing that ebXML was an open technology requiring no royalties or licensing, execs. from the business side of these three companies decided to break ranks and build the shit first. "By bringing this shit to the customer FIRST, we can cement our lead in the race, and control the architectural decisions of ebXML workgroups," said an unnamed executive of the company…. "Our registries will be built in 60 days. We have assigned 22,600 microserfs around the globe. We’re gonna restrict their options until this thing works…" Although the initiative is being portrayed as an effort to create an "open" standard, the UDDI project offers some insight into the bruising behind-the-scenes competition taking place in the world of Internet standards as companies seek proprietary advantage for new technologies.
"We take a lickin, and keep on tickin’" said the exec, in his Texas drawl. Several executives at competing electronic commerce companies said the UDDI standard initiative parallels but ignores an earlier effort led by Commercenet, a competing Silicon Valley electronic commerce initiative. Known as the eCo Framework Project, that system also focused on creating public electronic registries and automated electronic commerce.. But the Commercenet effort has lost momentum, and Microsoft has moved quickly to take over the effort to set standards for electronic commerce.
The exec said, "The eCo Framework could have established a monopoly! What the hell was wrong with those people? Bunch of idiots. The stuff isnt’ patented yet, so we’re going to differentiate it and add value, and patent the ideas ourselves. " said the exec. "Commercenet. What a bunch of losers." said the exec. Making analogies to telephone directory yellow and white pages, executives said their proposed UDDI standard would permit companies to publish descriptive information about their organization and their products in a way that could easily be located by electronic commerce software programs used in business transactions. The group said the proposed standard would go a step beyond being a static "telephone directory" style look-up service. An additional component of the registry was described as a "green pages," which would allow companies to publish information about their business practices.
The UDDI Directory will actually have 16 independent dimensions, with keys varying from 3 to 8 layers deep in hierarchy. IBM, Microsoft and ARiba agreed on specifications of software objects to reach this directory, which will provide crucial functionality in integrating the software of SAP, Peoplesoft, and the National Laboratories of Livermore, Sandia and MIT. "Small business will not in any way be restricted from accessing this directory" said the exec, "Our independent developers throughout the software industries are anyways, the ones who have always brought the benefits of modern software to Small Business. The UDDI directories will empower them with unheard of levels of control over their customers… er, I mean, business processes…." This is intended to make it possible for electronic commerce programs based on the XML standard to locate business partners automatically and buy and sell products and services.
"Small business is eager to kick back and allow this registry system to feed customers to their systems, to execute POs" said the exec. "The first stage, during 2000-2010, however, it will only execute purchases of products and services on their computers, from selected suppliers." "The benefits of a registry system include nonrepudiability." said the exec. "Small business is screamin’ for nonrepudiability." "Perhaps a better analogy would be to the signaling system used by the telephone network to automatically set up telephone calls," said James Utzschneider, Microsoft’s director of Web services for the company’s business applications division. The three companies plan to create a prototype within a month.
…it will sport all the user interface innovations we have come to apperciate from the phone company: all commands willbe entered with 9 digits, and the pound key… and the area codes will be churned semiannually. * Todd F. Boyle CPA http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * XML accounting, web ledgers, BSPs, ASPs, whatever it takes
Is anyone able to assist in pointing me in the right direction with accounting software selection. I am seeking a product which: Generates profit and loss accounts for a business from the general ledger, with all categories displayed as a % of sales or revenue, with comparison to same year of the previous month and comparison to previous year to date figures. Must be Windows based software able to run on SQL server and NT server. Has payroll incorporated. Has multiple site reporting capabilities which can be rolled into a consolidated report. Allows for reporting of multiple profit centres within each individual site. Records sales activities and their origins and allows linkages to individuals and records commissions directly into payroll. — Gerry Mabarrack
Gerry, Most all accounting programs can generate statements like that from their general ledgers. Most of the higher end PC programs can handle your other issues. These are likely; Macola, Solomon, Great Plains, and more. Most of these run on a btrieve engine and will soon or are making or have made a switch to SQL server. Since you are not US based, checking for handling your currency is also a major issue and should be confirmed from any product in writing. Dana
An LLC IS a corporation, albeit a "Limited Liability Corporation". The fact that it is not taxed like a corporation in inconsequential, as is possesses the important attribute of limited liability.
An LLC *IS NOT* a corporation. An LLC is a Limited Liability Company. It is not an S-Corp or a C-Corp, the only two types of corporations. It is not an LLP (a Limited Liability Partnership) or any other type of partnership (although it is usually taxed in a similar manner). It is not a sole proprietorship (although it can be owned by only one person in some states). It is a Limited Liability Company, which has many characteristics that make it distinctive, one of which is that it is registered with the state as an LLC. It doesn’t have an articles of incorporation, a board of directors, shares of stock, and other characteristics that make corporations distinctive. There are other reasons an S-Corp may be preferable; but this is a different, unrelated issue. David Ray CPA
To anyone considering setting up an LLC, please get help from someone who really understands this form of business. Remember that accounting is a *very* broad field, and even CPA’s aren’t experts in all areas. No offense intended to you, Mr. Ray. "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." – Albert Einstein
IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility?
While LLC’s are probably most often treated as partnerships they can be treated as sole proprietorships or corporations. It depends on the actual circumstances and the laws of your state.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – An LLC IS a corporation, albeit a "Limited Liability Corporation". The fact that it is not taxed like a corporation in inconsequential, as is possesses the important attribute of limited liability. An LLC *IS NOT* a corporation. An LLC is a Limited Liability Company. It is not an S-Corp or a C-Corp, the only two types of corporations. It is not an LLP (a Limited Liability Partnership) or any other type of partnership (although it is usually taxed in a similar manner). It is not a sole proprietorship (although it can be owned by only one person in some states). It is a Limited Liability Company, which has many characteristics that make it distinctive, one of which is that it is registered with the state as an LLC. It doesn’t have an articles of incorporation, a board of directors, shares of stock, and other characteristics that make corporations distinctive. There are other reasons an S-Corp may be preferable; but this is a different, unrelated issue. David Ray CPA To anyone considering setting up an LLC, please get help from someone who really understands this form of business. Remember that accounting is a *very* broad field, and even CPA’s aren’t experts in all areas. No offense intended to you, Mr. Ray. "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." – Albert Einstein
An LLC allows the entity to be taxed as a partnership or as a corporation. This election is made on the tax return. It is referred to as the "check the box election"
IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility? What I mean by this is that contract shops (who place consultants) want to pay consultants as W2 employees unless they have a S or C corp. They are concerned about the IRS coming down on them if the consultant forgets to file taxes. If I create my own LLC can I tell the agencies that they are free from tax responsibilities just as if I were a C or S corp? Regards, David
There is a code section under title 26 which lists the type of professions that can not be treated as corporations for employment tax purposes. (I don’t have the code in front of me) So it would all depend on what type of consultants you have. The real issue is whether you want to have employees or independent contractors. The factors that are considered in this are contained in the 20 common law factors in IRC section 3121. The major point is who has control over the worker. With an employee, the employer will have the right to tell the worker how to do the job and when to do the job. Having an independent contractor the employer can not do this. With independent contractors the employer is only concerned with the end product. The employer can not tell the worker how to do the job. It would seem these other aspects would be a major factor in making this determination instead of only considering the tax aspect.
An LLC allows the entity to be taxed as a partnership or as a corporation. This election is made on the tax return. It is referred to as the "check the box election"
It’s not quite that easy. If the LLC has certain characteristics, it can’t be taxed as a partnership, and it must be taxed like a corporation. It sure keeps us CPA’s in business! "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." – Albert Einstein
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I respectfully disagree. Being an LLC most certainly DOES relieve those you deal with from "employer" responsibilities. A corporation "hiring" an LLC cannot put the LLC on the "payroll" even if they want to. I’d say this "relieves" them. Of course, there are other issues — most notably that the LLC’s owner/employee will then have to deal with the "employer responsibilities". But from the perspective of the entity that "hires" the subcontractor, there is no payroll tax, unemployment insurance, etc. Workers comp may be a different matter. An LLC IS a corporation, albeit a "Limited Liability Corporation". The fact that it is not taxed like a corporation in inconsequential, as is possesses the important attribute of limited liability. There are other reasons an S-Corp may be preferable; but this is a different, unrelated issue. David Ray CPA IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility? What I mean by this is that contract shops (who place consultants) want to pay consultants as W2 employees unless they have a S or C corp. They are concerned about the IRS coming down on them if the consultant forgets to file taxes. If I create my own LLC can I tell the agencies that they are free from tax responsibilities just as if I were a C or S corp? but you’re not "free" from responsibilities! True, employers don’t have to issue 1099’s to corporations (not LLC/LLP). There is a "20 point" IRS test to determine the nature of employee/contractor status. calling yourself or being an LLC (which NOT a corporation) does not relieve them of employer responsibilities. If you are an S/C corp, then they don’t issue 1099s or put you on the payroll.
true, (except in this state LLC is a "company") but I have seen where a business "discharges" employees and then subcontracts LLC and they’re all the same people!
IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility? What I mean by this is that contract shops (who place consultants) want to pay consultants as W2 employees unless they have a S or C corp. They are concerned about the IRS coming down on them if the consultant forgets to file taxes. If I create my own LLC can I tell the agencies that they are free from tax responsibilities just as if I were a C or S corp?
but you’re not "free" from responsibilities! True, employers don’t have to issue 1099’s to corporations (not LLC/LLP). There is a "20 point" IRS test to determine the nature of employee/contractor status. calling yourself or being an LLC (which NOT a corporation) does not relieve them of employer responsibilities. If you are an S/C corp, then they don’t issue 1099s or put you on the payroll.
I respectfully disagree. Being an LLC most certainly DOES relieve those you deal with from "employer" responsibilities. A corporation "hiring" an LLC cannot put the LLC on the "payroll" even if they want to. I’d say this "relieves" them. Of course, there are other issues — most notably that the LLC’s owner/employee will then have to deal with the "employer responsibilities". But from the perspective of the entity that "hires" the subcontractor, there is no payroll tax, unemployment insurance, etc. Workers comp may be a different matter. An LLC IS a corporation, albeit a "Limited Liability Corporation". The fact that it is not taxed like a corporation in inconsequential, as is possesses the important attribute of limited liability. There are other reasons an S-Corp may be preferable; but this is a different, unrelated issue. David Ray CPA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility? What I mean by this is that contract shops (who place consultants) want to pay consultants as W2 employees unless they have a S or C corp. They are concerned about the IRS coming down on them if the consultant forgets to file taxes. If I create my own LLC can I tell the agencies that they are free from tax responsibilities just as if I were a C or S corp? but you’re not "free" from responsibilities! True, employers don’t have to issue 1099’s to corporations (not LLC/LLP). There is a "20 point" IRS test to determine the nature of employee/contractor status. calling yourself or being an LLC (which NOT a corporation) does not relieve them of employer responsibilities. If you are an S/C corp, then they don’t issue 1099s or put you on the payroll.
IS an LLC viewed as being equal to a C or S corp from the standpoint of tax responsibility? What I mean by this is that contract shops (who place consultants) want to pay consultants as W2 employees unless they have a S or C corp. They are concerned about the IRS coming down on them if the consultant forgets to file taxes. If I create my own LLC can I tell the agencies that they are free from tax responsibilities just as if I were a C or S corp? Regards, David