Question:

  michael, i did not know that you could get a computer that cheap. i always thought they cost between 300 to 600 dollars. tells you how naive i am oh well.  if you move close to chesucat can you take me with you?:-)    later anita "gravity" <grav…@example.net> wrote in message

news:_F8rd.11019$Ua.8670@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:7a8rd.76482$7i4.32335@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >    michael, > > a computer is expensive or least i think they are. what kind are you going > > to get if you get one? you just moved why are you wanting to move again? > >  anita > i want to move into an apartment (within 100 miles of here).  later i may > move back to Atlanta (near Chesucat). > a computer is cheap or expensive, it depends.  my choices: > $40 shipped — Pentium II surplus > $100 shipped — Pentium III surplus > $230 + shipping — Walmart computer > $300 — computer with AOL contract > $350 + shipping — Dell computer (loan possible) > i don’t know which i will get.  i should buy a cheap one, then gradually add > peripherals and drives as money permits. > michael

Response:

pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:L49rd.76646$7i4.33529@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >   michael, > i did not know that you could get a computer that cheap. i always thought > they cost between 300 to 600 dollars. tells you how naive i am oh well. >  if you move close to chesucat can you take me with you?:-) >    later anita

yes, you can come live at my apartment.  the kitty can over anytime so long as he doesn’t claw my furniture. regards, michael

Response:

gravity wrote: > a computer is cheap or expensive, it depends.  my choices: > $40 shipped — Pentium II surplus > $100 shipped — Pentium III surplus > $230 + shipping — Walmart computer > $300 — computer with AOL contract > $350 + shipping — Dell computer (loan possible) > i don’t know which i will get.  i should buy a cheap one, then gradually add > peripherals and drives as money permits.

If you plan to upgrade at all, avoid Compaqs, because they can’t be upgraded with generic parts.  The parts have to be Compaq. -wl

Response:

"wiggly lumber" <d…@arithmetic.com> wrote in message

news:819rd.13823$kI6.900679@news20.bellglobal.com… > If you plan to upgrade at all, avoid Compaqs, because they can’t be > upgraded with generic parts.  The parts have to be Compaq.

All the same, what a fantastic machine Compaq is – I have never come across such a reliable machine as the Compaq.

Response:

pines wrote: >   have you done any christmas shopping yet? >   just curious. >   anita

I haven’t exchanged Christmas presents with anyone in years and years. My family always celebrated the Orthoxod Christmas (January 7th), so, after my brother got old enough to understand, we just treated December 25th like any other day off work or school. This Christmas it would be cool to drive a long distance somewhere, but I’m not sure where. -wl

Response:

   michael, thank you but i would be the one clawing the furniture so i guess it wouldn’t work out hey:-) hope you are having a good day michael.    later anita "gravity" <grav…@example.net> wrote in message

news:q79rd.11047$Ua.2139@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:L49rd.76646$7i4.33529@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >   michael, > > i did not know that you could get a computer that cheap. i always thought > > they cost between 300 to 600 dollars. tells you how naive i am oh well. > >  if you move close to chesucat can you take me with you?:-) > >    later anita > yes, you can come live at my apartment.  the kitty can over anytime so long > as he doesn’t claw my furniture. > regards, > michael

Response:

   well i hope you have a merry christmas. it would be fun to take a drive on christmas. i hope you do go somewhere just for the fun of it. why is the Orthoxod Christmas on a different date if i might ask?    anita "wiggly lumber" <d…@arithmetic.com> wrote in message

news:0%8rd.13822$kI6.900029@news20.bellglobal.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> pines wrote: > >   have you done any christmas shopping yet? > >   just curious. > >   anita > I haven’t exchanged Christmas presents with anyone in years and years. > My family always celebrated the Orthoxod Christmas (January 7th), so, > after my brother got old enough to understand, we just treated December > 25th like any other day off work or school. > This Christmas it would be cool to drive a long distance somewhere, but > I’m not sure where. > -wl

Response:

I am done. "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->   have you done any christmas shopping yet? >   just curious. >   anita

Response:

 wow good for you. most people wait till the last minute.    anita "Fred B." <spamf…@bellsouth.net> wrote in message

news:TF9rd.2939$Dm2.1757@bignews1.bellsouth.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I am done. > "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >   have you done any christmas shopping yet? > >   just curious. > >   anita

Response:

> "wiggly lumber" <d…@arithmetic.com> wrote in message > news:819rd.13823$kI6.900679@news20.bellglobal.com… > > If you plan to upgrade at all, avoid Compaqs, because they can’t be > > upgraded with generic parts.  The parts have to be Compaq. > All the same, what a fantastic machine Compaq is – I have never come across > such a reliable machine as the Compaq.

Compaq merged with or bought out HP (hewlett packard).  how times change cause Compaq started with PCs (as i recall) and HP has been around for ages. i have owned one HP workstation with SCSI disk and one Compaq laptop.  both did very well, although i hear the laptop died on my ex-girlfriend.  she may have clicked on something in my extensive malware collection. i have also owned 4 IBM PS/2, NEC laptop, 2 Emachines, 1 i forget, 1 Micron, 1 MicroSparc, 1 Gateway, and a lot of junk.  very little has broken on me unless it was a very old computer (e.g. 386 or 486). my current computer is the slowest i’ve had since 2001. michael

Response:

> If you plan to upgrade at all, avoid Compaqs, because they can’t be > upgraded with generic parts.  The parts have to be Compaq. > -wl

i’ve also heard Compaq’s (and HP’s) build quality is poor.  i probably just had good luck with the ones i owned.  Dell is sometimes ridiculed, and for a while had non-standard ATX power pinouts (think KA-BOOM). i trust Wiggly’s judgement on these non-standard issues though. i think a Dell would be a good tradeoff between performance, cost, and reliability.  did i mention i used to work at Dell?  several of the persons on the linux mailing list work there. i would like to avoid E-machines and Microtel and Northgate (sold at walmart, a big U.S. retailer).  but i’ll take what i can get. michael

Response:

"gravity" <grav…@example.net> wrote in message

news:Hmard.5080$6K5.3713@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Compaq merged with or bought out HP (hewlett packard).  how times change > cause Compaq started with PCs (as i recall) and HP has been around for ages. > i have owned one HP workstation with SCSI disk and one Compaq laptop. both > did very well, although i hear the laptop died on my ex-girlfriend.  she may > have clicked on something in my extensive malware collection. > i have also owned 4 IBM PS/2, NEC laptop, 2 Emachines, 1 i forget, 1 Micron, > 1 MicroSparc, 1 Gateway, and a lot of junk.  very little has broken on me > unless it was a very old computer (e.g. 386 or 486). > my current computer is the slowest i’ve had since 2001. > michael

As regards Hewlett Packard, I have heard you could chuck one their machines out of a 10th floor window and it would still work.

Response:

pines wrote: >    well i hope you have a merry christmas. it would be fun to take a drive > on christmas. i hope you do go somewhere just for the fun of it. why is the > Orthoxod Christmas on a different date if i might ask?

It’s based on the old Julian calendar, which was replaced by the Gregorian calendar (the one we now use) at some point.  On the Julian calendar, our January 7th really is December 25th. -wl

Response:

"wiggly lumber" <d…@arithmetic.com> wrote in message

news:mSard.18549$Ad3.1126079@news20.bellglobal.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> pines wrote: > >    well i hope you have a merry christmas. it would be fun to take a drive > > on christmas. i hope you do go somewhere just for the fun of it. why is the > > Orthoxod Christmas on a different date if i might ask? > It’s based on the old Julian calendar, which was replaced by the > Gregorian calendar (the one we now use) at some point.  On the Julian > calendar, our January 7th really is December 25th. > -wl

   thanks for the information    anita

Response:

Julian? Once upon a time during the reign of Rome it was discovered that the "days changed". The months did not match in a cycle with the seasons. And Julius Ceasar was pissed. So Julius had a son, Augustus. And he liked him. Juliuse decided to add a few months so that the seasons would have a balance on the calender, so summer would always happen in the summer instead of the winter? So Julius said, "let there be July! For me, because I am after a God". Did he stop there? Nope. "Let there be an August for my glorious spawn as well, AUGUST!" Of course being as everyone adored their God/King Julius this made all the people very happy. However there was one horrible glitch. December is so named because decem in latin means "ten". November is based on Nova meaning nine. October means "eighth month" Julius had forever altered the number system by creating July and August. Now October is the tenth month. Julius being a humble man chose the months nsmd asfter himself and his son to fall in the mid summer. Then there was a Pope named Gregory. (Drum roll) Julius ceasar failed to understand the 365 days and a quarter was the actual length of the year. So during the interveneing centuries the claender slipped across the face of the seasons until August was happening in the winter again. Very confusing state of affairs. Screwed up bird migration and farmers crops were devestated. When the calendar was corrected, it was called the Gregorian calender, which incidently carries a leap year concept to prevent August from happening in december. This was a wise move. Then..There was the advent of Damo on the earth plane. Among his various cosmos ordained missions was to correct the calender again. Consider: There are fifty two weeks in a year. Now four weeks in a month is what most people figger on, correct? The Damo will propose 13 months of exactly four weeks each. 4 times 13 is 52. 52 weeks in a year, four weeks in a month, equals 13 equal months. The month of Damo will begin on the third week of July, and extend for its fair share of weeks, up to the third week in August. Accountants and landlord tenent relations and various other confusions and uncertainties will be avoided by the inroduction of the month of DAMO!!!!! Of course the greenery present during the month of DAMO will signify Damo’s adorable green eyes looking out for the concerns of men. When the Grehorian calender was introduced the Church was divided between Constantinople and Rome. An eastern and western church. This made managerial concerns more managable. However there was also a small schism going on between Constantinople and Rome. The Eastern Church, facing barbarians on all sides, understood that to retain the attention of the barabarians who were greatly influenced by pomp and circumstance that elaborate rites were needed, if the church was to prolifigate (grow). The Roman Church was becoming more touchy feely and squishy at the time. The Church in Constantinople rejected the Gregorian correction. The gregorian correction made years and months simply, and suddenly dissappear with one swing of the Holy Fathers Staff sitting there on the "Throne of Saint Peter". POOF! The Julian folks said….that Pope Gregory has a slipped cog wheel. So………. Just wait for me to introduce the month of DAMO. That oughts cause a few schisms. http://community.webtv.net/damodara/MystoryasIseeit

Response:

> Julius ceasar failed to understand the 365 days and a quarter was the > actual length of the year. So during the interveneing centuries the > claender slipped across the face of the seasons until August was > happening in the winter again. Very confusing state of affairs. Screwed > up bird migration and farmers crops were devestated.

even with the Gregorian calendar, it will slip.  so there are times when leap year is skipped, every 400 years.  however 2000 A.D. was a special case since it was divisible by 2000.  i think the other slippage occurs at year 40,000 A.D., when we will have a leap year. interesting stuff. michael

Response:

pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:7a8rd.76482$7i4.32335@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >    michael, > a computer is expensive or least i think they are. what kind are you going > to get if you get one? you just moved why are you wanting to move again? >  anita

i want to move into an apartment (within 100 miles of here).  later i may move back to Atlanta (near Chesucat). a computer is cheap or expensive, it depends.  my choices: $40 shipped — Pentium II surplus $100 shipped — Pentium III surplus $230 + shipping — Walmart computer $300 — computer with AOL contract $350 + shipping — Dell computer (loan possible) i don’t know which i will get.  i should buy a cheap one, then gradually add peripherals and drives as money permits. michael

Response:

   michael, a computer is expensive or least i think they are. what kind are you going to get if you get one? you just moved why are you wanting to move again?  anita "gravity" <grav…@example.net> wrote in message

news:P38rd.4958$6K5.3764@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >   have you done any christmas shopping yet? > >   just curious. > >   anita > hi yawnball, > i have no money to speak of.  i can do after X-mas shopping with my tax > refund.  maybe i’ll treat myself to a computer or some CDs. > my X-mas present to myself will be an apartment. > i need to buy some gifts.  i do have some ideas, but haven’t pursued them > yet. > michael

Response:

pines <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >   have you done any christmas shopping yet? >   just curious. >   anita

hi yawnball, i have no money to speak of.  i can do after X-mas shopping with my tax refund.  maybe i’ll treat myself to a computer or some CDs. my X-mas present to myself will be an apartment. i need to buy some gifts.  i do have some ideas, but haven’t pursued them yet. michael

Response:

  well i am glad you are feeling better Just Me. that is a good thing. i never heard of email xmas cards before. sounds interesting.   anita "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:G08rd.4359$u81.1414@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> No, I’m not putting up a tree.  But I might send out some email xmas cards > at bluemountain.com.  I think it costs about $15 to join.  I’ve been feeling > pretty good since last Wednesday.  For a long time, I’ve been doing bad. > "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:MY7rd.76447$7i4.25365@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >  my family is thinking of getting a tree this year for the first time > > since > > i was a kid. my brother has a lot of lights to put on the tree if they get > > one. > >  are you putting up a tree? > >  anita > > "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:5T7rd.4348$u81.3546@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… > >> No shopping yet.  do you plan to put up a tree? > >> "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > >> news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >> >  have you done any christmas shopping yet? > >> >  just curious. > >> >  anita

Response:

www.bluemountain.com "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:I58rd.76467$7i4.37290@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->  well i am glad you are feeling better Just Me. that is a good thing. > i never heard of email xmas cards before. sounds interesting. >  anita > "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:G08rd.4359$u81.1414@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… >> No, I’m not putting up a tree.  But I might send out some email xmas >> cards >> at bluemountain.com.  I think it costs about $15 to join.  I’ve been > feeling >> pretty good since last Wednesday.  For a long time, I’ve been doing bad. >> "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message >> news:MY7rd.76447$7i4.25365@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >> >  my family is thinking of getting a tree this year for the first time >> > since >> > i was a kid. my brother has a lot of lights to put on the tree if they > get >> > one. >> >  are you putting up a tree? >> >  anita >> > "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message >> > news:5T7rd.4348$u81.3546@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… >> >> No shopping yet.  do you plan to put up a tree? >> >> "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message >> >> news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >> >> >  have you done any christmas shopping yet? >> >> >  just curious. >> >> >  anita

Response:

  have you done any christmas shopping yet?   just curious.   anita

Response:

No shopping yet.  do you plan to put up a tree? "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->  have you done any christmas shopping yet? >  just curious. >  anita

Response:

  my family is thinking of getting a tree this year for the first time since i was a kid. my brother has a lot of lights to put on the tree if they get one.   are you putting up a tree?   anita "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:5T7rd.4348$u81.3546@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> No shopping yet.  do you plan to put up a tree? > "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message > news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… > >  have you done any christmas shopping yet? > >  just curious. > >  anita

Response:

No, I’m not putting up a tree.  But I might send out some email xmas cards at bluemountain.com.  I think it costs about $15 to join.  I’ve been feeling pretty good since last Wednesday.  For a long time, I’ve been doing bad. "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message

news:MY7rd.76447$7i4.25365@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->  my family is thinking of getting a tree this year for the first time > since > i was a kid. my brother has a lot of lights to put on the tree if they get > one. >  are you putting up a tree? >  anita > "Just Me" <thecli…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:5T7rd.4348$u81.3546@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net… >> No shopping yet.  do you plan to put up a tree? >> "pines" <yawnball@scratching post.com> wrote in message >> news:ZQ7rd.76441$7i4.6154@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net… >> >  have you done any christmas shopping yet? >> >  just curious. >> >  anita

Response:

Question:

Thanks to everyone who responded. I’ll skip the large firm idea.  The idea of a sole practitioner or small firm always seemed better to me, but I thought I’d ask just in case.  I hadn’t thought about the fact that in a large firm, a different person might be doing my taxes every year.  And I have no plan or desire to go to a H&R-Block-type tax preparation company.

Response:

Do big accounting firms typically do individual tax returns? I am an individual who up until now did his own tax returns.  I am a single filer, own my own home, work a full-time and a part-time job, and in late 2003 I bought a second home that I am fixing up and plan to rent out soon. I also plan to buy more homes to rent out as an investment and to create a future retirement income stream. I filed for an automatic extension and I am now looking for an accountant to do my 2003 taxes and future year tax returns each year. My guess is that I will probably look for a sole practitioner or small tax accounting firm.  But there is also a huge accounting firm right near where I work and I am wondering about going there.  Is that overkill for such a small task? My only reason for thinking about using a big firm would be that if the person doing my taxes has any tax-related questions he/she would have others in the same firm to check with.  As an example, because I bought my rental property in 2003, but it will not be available for rent until next month, I think there are issues about how to treat the 2003 expenses.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why pay big bucks for a big firm to do individual tax returns.  Go to a small firm they still have CPAs doing the returns or at least reviewing them.  If your deductions are somewhat wierd and complicated stay away from H&R Block.  I worked at an accounting firm and lots of people switched to us cause H&R screwed there stuff up.  If you don’t feel comfortable doing your tax return go to someone with CPA after there last name but a smaller firm. Sorry to any1 working in a big firm:)  I’ve been there I don’t see the point in the price difference for a bigger name in a not so complicated tax return..  I felt like I was ripping clients off big time for something that took me a half hour and billed the client out for 300 bucks.. Oh yeah i got paid 10 bucks for a half hour work..  Guess I was manipulated myself. Hehe don’t want to offend any1 just stating my opinion. Do big accounting firms typically do individual tax returns? I am an individual who up until now did his own tax returns.  I am a single filer, own my own home, work a full-time and a part-time job, and in late 2003 I bought a second home that I am fixing up and plan to rent out soon. I also plan to buy more homes to rent out as an investment and to create a future retirement income stream. I filed for an automatic extension and I am now looking for an accountant to do my 2003 taxes and future year tax returns each year. My guess is that I will probably look for a sole practitioner or small tax accounting firm.  But there is also a huge accounting firm right near where I work and I am wondering about going there.  Is that overkill for such a small task? My only reason for thinking about using a big firm would be that if the person doing my taxes has any tax-related questions he/she would have others in the same firm to check with.  As an example, because I bought my rental property in 2003, but it will not be available for rent until next month, I think there are issues about how to treat the 2003 expenses.

Bryan, I agree 100%.  That’s why I left CPA firms and started my own practice.  I didn’t like seeing someone with a Form 1040EZ being charged $200 and it took maybe 2 minutes to input the information into the tax program. Wayne Brasch, CPA, M. S. Taxation

Response:

In your present circumstances, what are legitimate "issues" to you are well within the experience and knowledge of any competent professional.  Most large firms have strict procedures for quality control and supervision that will add significantly to your fees and are not necessary for YOUR work, so I would recommend a small firm or sole practitioner. Also – if you are satisfied with the work done, there is a reasonable possibility in a small firm that your return next year might be completed by the same person who will then have some familiarity with your situation; that’s highly unlikely in a large firm.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do big accounting firms typically do individual tax returns? I am an individual who up until now did his own tax returns.  I am a single filer, own my own home, work a full-time and a part-time job, and in late 2003 I bought a second home that I am fixing up and plan to rent out soon. I also plan to buy more homes to rent out as an investment and to create a future retirement income stream. I filed for an automatic extension and I am now looking for an accountant to do my 2003 taxes and future year tax returns each year. My guess is that I will probably look for a sole practitioner or small tax accounting firm.  But there is also a huge accounting firm right near where I work and I am wondering about going there.  Is that overkill for such a small task? My only reason for thinking about using a big firm would be that if the person doing my taxes has any tax-related questions he/she would have others in the same firm to check with.  As an example, because I bought my rental property in 2003, but it will not be available for rent until next month, I think there are issues about how to treat the 2003 expenses.

Response:

Why pay big bucks for a big firm to do individual tax returns.  Go to a small firm they still have CPAs doing the returns or at least reviewing them.  If your deductions are somewhat wierd and complicated stay away from H&R Block.  I worked at an accounting firm and lots of people switched to us cause H&R screwed there stuff up.  If you don’t feel comfortable doing your tax return go to someone with CPA after there last name but a smaller firm. Sorry to any1 working in a big firm:)  I’ve been there I don’t see the point in the price difference for a bigger name in a not so complicated tax return..  I felt like I was ripping clients off big time for something that took me a half hour and billed the client out for 300 bucks.. Oh yeah i got paid 10 bucks for a half hour work..  Guess I was manipulated myself.  Hehe don’t want to offend any1 just stating my opinion.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Do big accounting firms typically do individual tax returns? I am an individual who up until now did his own tax returns.  I am a single filer, own my own home, work a full-time and a part-time job, and in late 2003 I bought a second home that I am fixing up and plan to rent out soon. I also plan to buy more homes to rent out as an investment and to create a future retirement income stream. I filed for an automatic extension and I am now looking for an accountant to do my 2003 taxes and future year tax returns each year. My guess is that I will probably look for a sole practitioner or small tax accounting firm.  But there is also a huge accounting firm right near where I work and I am wondering about going there.  Is that overkill for such a small task? My only reason for thinking about using a big firm would be that if the person doing my taxes has any tax-related questions he/she would have others in the same firm to check with.  As an example, because I bought my rental property in 2003, but it will not be available for rent until next month, I think there are issues about how to treat the 2003 expenses.

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day. OK Dave, explain it one more time please.  I have noticed it is there when I fly the red-eye between Wellington & Auckland in the morning but not there on the afternoon return flight. IMOE it is "flat spots" in the tyres from standing and cooling down. The deformed shape "sets".   Once they get moving and warm up somewhat, the thumping disappears.

Yep, right answer. Dave ===== NSW Rural Fire Service – become a volunteer today. http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/

Response:

Happened back in the late 50s/early 60s too, cant remember what a/c type, Electra, or similar, in all likelihood.

I have a dim recollection  it was a DC-4 on that occasion. But the bottom line is that it *has* happened. At least twice. Cheers.

Response:

I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day. OK Dave, explain it one more time please.  I have noticed it is there when I fly the red-eye between Wellington & Auckland in the morning but not there on the afternoon return flight.

Tyre develops a flat spot if you leave it parked long enough The thumping is the flat spot on the tyre thumping the tarmac. Once the tyre warms up a little, and spins around a few hundred times, the tyre is again round, and the noise disappears

Response:

I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day. OK Dave, explain it one more time please.  I have noticed it is there when I fly the red-eye between Wellington & Auckland in the morning but not there on the afternoon return flight.

IMOE it is "flat spots" in the tyres from standing and cooling down. The deformed shape "sets".   Once they get moving and warm up somewhat, the thumping disappears. Used to be a problem with cross-ply car tyres and the nylon in the sidewalls.  In fact, it should still be a problem with those tyres …

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Trev, Nice to hear from the ex "local". You are right of course but it doesn’t seem to stop them lining up on the Hwy. Up past Morphettville the Hwy does veer left and run parallel to RWY 05 but I doubt if the PICs could have seen that far up the Hwy. How long since you’ve been back to AD Trev, you probably wouldn’t recognise the beach front south of the "Pat". Beach front multi story buildings down to Magic Mountain with further buildings planned down to the Town Hall. Just as an aside, had an early morning Qantas B767 from Darwin arriving before first light a few years ago. CAVOK, PIC said he had the aerodrome in sight at about 15 miles NW and was given a vector to intercept final from the NW. Aircraft merrily sailed through final and continued to the SE. I asked the PIC if there was a problem at about the same time as the a/c banked sharply to the left to regain final. He had mistaken the Marino Light House for the ABN. I’ll leave you to draw your own conclusions from that one.

Hello Stephen, yes that Marino lighthouse is a trap for the  unwary, coming in from the west at night (as I have done on many occasions after working for my ride loading/unloading newspapers at PLC & KSC), the Marino lighthouse is much more visible than the beacon at YPAD. And the fact that the Marino lighthouse is surrounded by an area that has no other lights it looks pretty much like an airport from a distance. One day, an aircraft was having trouble identifying the airport visually, and the controller said to him something alongs the lines of "its the big dark bit with the beacon in the middle" That describes Marino better than YPAD! But what about having some lead in strobes with HIAL for the 05 approach? what a nice addition that would be:-) All those (construction) cranes at Glenelg have enough strobes on them:-) Ben Matthes. Canberra, Australia. Aircraft Manager, Canberra Aero Club. http://www.canberra-aeroclub.com.au/

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No problems with any of what you have said, as I have mentioned before, I used to have a PPL (no longer do, mainly due to cost constraints) Mr Proctor if you once held an Australian Pilot’s licence then I can assure you that, regardless of what you think, you actually still hold a licence. They have been permanent for more than 5 years now.

This was back in the late 80’s. Dave ===== NSW Rural Fire Service – become a volunteer today. http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/

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    Dave The fact remains that not everyone on board is a seasoned     Dave traveller, and this needs to be borne in mind by those     Dave operating the aircraft.  Someone in a window seat who sees     Dave the earth rapidly approaching, and then all of a sudden     Dave experiencing a dramatic increase in power and the aircraft     Dave climbing, may regard this as a scary experience. I have had conversations with people along the lines of: Them: "we almost crashed, we were about to land, but then the aircraft started climbing again…" Me: "…no, it is unlikely you were about to crash… go arounds are a normal safety procedure." Them: "this wasn’t normal, we were climbing so steeply (almost straight up), and besides I heard we were only xx seconds away from colliding with an aircraft on the runway." (I can’t remember the times given, 20 seconds?, but wouldn’t trust it in any case). Nothing I can say will change their opinion that a "steep climb" and "xx seconds" doesn’t mean a "near crash." Also the perception that the aircraft was flying "straight up" (vertical?) is almost certainly incorrect (it wasn’t a space shuttle was it?) . This also highlights that for some passengers, the more information the pilots give can be reassuring, but for other passengers it could potentially make them even more nervous. —

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve also heard of pilots aborting approaches because: – they lined up on the highway instead of the runway (Darwin NT, back in the early 90’s – involved a Garuda 767 IIRC) I saw that last year at YBMC in a rainstorm around dusk. <TED HARRISON Maroochydore </TED HARRISON It has happened at least twice in Adelaide when RWY 05 was in use for arrivals. The last was only a few years ago, an Ansett 737 as I recall. The a/c was conducting a RWY 05 VOR approach, in near minimum conditions, and caught sight of Anzac Highway, presumed it was the runway and lined up on the highway. Anzac Highway runs in approx the same direction as RWY 05 and is approx 1nm to the south of RWY 05. Actually there’s around 45 degrees difference between Rwy 05 and the Anzac highway where it reaches the coast. For it’s last three miles or so the highway runs east west down to the coast.

Hi Trev, Nice to hear from the ex "local". You are right of course but it doesn’t seem to stop them lining up on the Hwy. Up past Morphettville the Hwy does veer left and run parallel to RWY 05 but I doubt if the PICs could have seen that far up the Hwy. How long since you’ve been back to AD Trev, you probably wouldn’t recognise the beach front south of the "Pat". Beach front multi story buildings down to Magic Mountain with further buildings planned down to the Town Hall. Just as an aside, had an early morning Qantas B767 from Darwin arriving before first light a few years ago. CAVOK, PIC said he had the aerodrome in sight at about 15 miles NW and was given a vector to intercept final from the NW. Aircraft merrily sailed through final and continued to the SE. I asked the PIC if there was a problem at about the same time as the a/c banked sharply to the left to regain final. He had mistaken the Marino Light House for the ABN. I’ll leave you to draw your own conclusions from that one.

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Stealth ( it all seems so hard when you no longer do it ) Pilot

You can’t help commenting on stuff outside your experience, can ya? <g,d,r

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I’ve also heard of pilots aborting approaches because: – they lined up on the highway instead of the runway (Darwin NT, back in the early 90’s – involved a Garuda 767 IIRC)

Many years ago some poor bastard landed at the worng runway at Alice Springs. Must have burnt the brakes stopping.. counld get out due to the lack of runway lenght. They trucked the aircraft to the correct runway for the departure.. It was a Canberra!!! (Bet that f**ked  his career!!

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  I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those   seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start   taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day.   OK Dave, explain it one more time please.  I have noticed it is there when I fly the red-eye between Wellington & Auckland in the morning but not there on the afternoon return flight. — If you’re under control you’re not going fast enough Mike Butler                  Wellington NZ Ella ADX Kelpie              New Zealand Dog Agility on the Web                               http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~mbutler/nala/ Ben BC X Doing agility where there are no contacts

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve also heard of pilots aborting approaches because: – they lined up on the highway instead of the runway (Darwin NT, back in the early 90’s – involved a Garuda 767 IIRC) I saw that last year at YBMC in a rainstorm around dusk. <TED HARRISON Maroochydore </TED HARRISON It has happened at least twice in Adelaide when RWY 05 was in use for arrivals. The last was only a few years ago, an Ansett 737 as I recall. The a/c was conducting a RWY 05 VOR approach, in near minimum conditions, and caught sight of Anzac Highway, presumed it was the runway and lined up on the highway. Anzac Highway runs in approx the same direction as RWY 05 and is approx 1nm to the south of RWY 05.

Actually there’s around 45 degrees difference between Rwy 05 and the Anzac highway where it reaches the coast. For it’s last three miles or so the highway runs east west down to the coast. — Trevor Fenn There are too many zz’s in my email address above. Take two zz’s and email me in the morning. "Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just"                           The Star Spangled Banner                             Francis Scott Key                    

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No problems with any of what you have said, as I have mentioned before, I used to have a PPL (no longer do, mainly due to cost constraints)

Mr Proctor if you once held an Australian Pilot’s licence then I can assure you that, regardless of what you think, you actually still hold a licence. They have been permanent for more than 5 years now. If you are at all interested then apply to CASA for a reissue.(it is free, the ICAO format plastic book to hold them costs $10) the licence attests for ever of your competent knowledge. if you wish to exercise that knowledge then all you require is a current BFR and a medical. it has never been easier to exercise the priveleges of a pilot’s licence ….regardless of the bullshit published on aus.avaition. ..of course getting to know the homebuilt end of the environment can put you back in the air for life for less than the cost of a new car. But it is still nice to have some information from the flight crew *when they get the chance* if for no other reason than to reassure those once-a-decade passengers who do not realise such things. I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day.

forgotten to undo the tiedowns? the concrete one on the tail does make a frightening noise as it drags across the sprinklers luckily the pegs used on the wings just drag out quietly until you hit the taxiway I always find that hard to explain with a straight face. The fact remains that not everyone on board is a seasoned traveller, and this needs to be borne in mind by those operating the aircraft.

I can sympathise. I had to do a go around myself today. 15 knot gusting headwind and it just wouldnt three point nicely, even decided to float despite me being on the back side of the power curve. I was beside myself but strangely we were communicating telepathically really well. "oh thats a bloody awful approach" "well bloody well power on and go around" "yeah thats not a bad idea, make it so mr sulu" I wasnt happy so an hour or so later I went out again. I was circling over freo watching the stars and stripes flying from a departing frigate and just beside it the sail training ship leeuwin decided to set sail and cruise out as well. very picturesque. must have been what I needed because I didnt need a go around on the final flight. Stealth ( it all seems so hard when you no longer do it ) Pilot

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Actually, this thread has the wrong title. You may need to explain why you carried out a go around, but you’ll only need an excuse if you continue an approach from which you should have gone around. Some more basic rules of aviation:    if you think you’re high, then you’re probably very high,    if you think you’re low, then you’re probably very low,    if the thought ’speedbrake’ crosses your mind, then you need all of it, and 10 seconds ago and,    if ‘go around’ starts to creep into the head, then do it, ‘cos you should. Passengers don’t thank you for saving an approach. They expect to get from a to b safely, and if a go around becomes part of that equation then so be it. Company accountants don’t come out and berate you going around (though I’m sure some would like to). It’s rather a pity that the media have beaten go arounds up as a dangerous event, when they are almost certainly removing you from the scene of something that is actually dangerous. I have fond memories of my first ever solo approach in a Skyhawk…it was a go around when the sink rate got out of hand.

No problems with any of what you have said, as I have mentioned before, I used to have a PPL (no longer do, mainly due to cost constraints) so *I* understand where you are coming from as far as the go-around being the safest option. But it is still nice to have some information from the flight crew *when they get the chance* if for no other reason than to reassure those once-a-decade passengers who do not realise such things. I have lost track of the times where I have explained to those seating next to me why we get a thumping noise when we start taxiing on the first flight that aircraft has operated that day. The fact remains that not everyone on board is a seasoned traveller, and this needs to be borne in mind by those operating the aircraft. Someone in a window seat who sees the earth rapidly approaching, and then all of a sudden experiencing a dramatic increase in power and the aircraft climbing, may regard this as a scary experience. Dave ===== NSW Rural Fire Service – become a volunteer today. http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/

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Actually, this thread has the wrong title. You may need to explain why you carried out a go around, but you’ll only need an excuse if you continue an approach from which you should have gone around. Some more basic rules of aviation:     if you think you’re high, then you’re probably very high,     if you think you’re low, then you’re probably very low,     if the thought ’speedbrake’ crosses your mind, then you need all of it, and 10 seconds ago and,     if ‘go around’ starts to creep into the head, then do it, ‘cos you should. Passengers don’t thank you for saving an approach. They expect to get from a to b safely, and if a go around becomes part of that equation then so be it. Company accountants don’t come out and berate you going around (though I’m sure some would like to). It’s rather a pity that the media have beaten go arounds up as a dangerous event, when they are almost certainly removing you from the scene of something that is actually dangerous. I have fond memories of my first ever solo approach in a Skyhawk…it was a go around when the sink rate got out of hand. JB

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And as far as telling pax – that’s REAL good news.   Not enuff of that from most flight decks. Many years ago, while flying from Amsterdam to Jo’burg (SAA), first stop was Paris where half-a-dozen people suddenly swarmed over one of the outer engines. Cowlings off, heads down, bums up – not a peep from up-front. If you happened to be a nervous pax it would have been very worrying. Back in 1999, flying from BNE to PER, had an aborted T/O due to a faulty hydraulic valve. We were talked through the problem from start to finish. Something I really appreciated..

Several years ago, I was a passenger in a 727*  departing Sydney to Brisbane with very strong winds and a big crosswind component.  A fair way into the take-off roll, there were three very big bangs that shook the aircraft, about one second apart.  Lots of passengers looking around at each other with big rabbit eyes.  About five minutes later (I guess the captain had been busy checking things out) he came on and told us it was a compressor stall and relatively common in high cross-wind situations. Nick * (gee, can that be right?  When did 727s last fly in Aust?  Maybe it was a DC-10. I clearly remember it had a central engine.)

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Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot?

Couple of weeks ago an Australian 767 went round due incapacitation of the pilot. He was OK again by the time the second approach was set up. Alan

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Last time I had a go around, that’s almost verbatim what I told the passengers. It was a really windy, rough, day, and I simply said that I wasn’t happy with the approach. Thinking back a year or two, we’ve had:    lightning strike and all of the runway lights went out    not visual at minima (during the typhoon in HK)    previous aircraft aborted (767 in Mel)    previous aircraft too slow to get going (VB in Sydney) Just tell the passengers what happened. JB

Sounds reasonable.   A lot of the stuff I did was into 1-way strips.  No go-around possible.   However, if a go-around was possible and things had gone pear shaped well, why not?   A bit more experience…… accompanied by And as far as telling pax – that’s REAL good news.   Not enuff of that from most flight decks.

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And as far as telling pax – that’s REAL good news.   Not enuff of that from most flight decks.

Many years ago, while flying from Amsterdam to Jo’burg (SAA), first stop was Paris where half-a-dozen people suddenly swarmed over one of the outer engines. Cowlings off, heads down, bums up – not a peep from up-front. If you happened to be a nervous pax it would have been very worrying. Back in 1999, flying from BNE to PER, had an aborted T/O due to a faulty hydraulic valve. We were talked through the problem from start to finish. Something I really appreciated..

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Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot? Couple of weeks ago an Australian 767 went round due incapacitation of the pilot. He was OK again by the time the second approach was set up. Alan

Probably just having a good sneezing fit Stephen

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I’ve also heard of pilots aborting approaches because: – they lined up on the highway instead of the runway (Darwin NT, back in the early 90’s – involved a Garuda 767 IIRC) I saw that last year at YBMC in a rainstorm around dusk. <TED HARRISON Maroochydore </TED HARRISON

It has happened at least twice in Adelaide when RWY 05 was in use for arrivals. The last was only a few years ago, an Ansett 737 as I recall. The a/c was conducting a RWY 05 VOR approach, in near minimum conditions, and caught sight of Anzac Highway, presumed it was the runway and lined up on the highway. Anzac Highway runs in approx the same direction as RWY 05 and is approx 1nm to the south of RWY 05. Happened back in the late 50s/early 60s too, cant remember what a/c type, Electra, or similar, in all likelihood. In Adelaide it seems the most common reason for making a missed approach is because of an "unstable approach" condition. A couple of years ago I had six missed approaches by B737s in 20 minutes due to a front passing through the aerodrome and the associated wind sheer. Most of the time it seems to be because the approach becomes unstable because of Wx conditions. Very very occasionally the approach is mishandled by the pilot/ ATC or a preceding landing or departing aircraft takes an unusually long time to leave the runway. Animals, birds, trespassers, unintentional runway incursions by vehicles, personnel and aircraft have all caused missed approaches or "go rounds". Even had an instructor once tell me that he was going around because of a flock of penguins on final, I think he meant pelicans. Anyway we had a good look for the penguins anyway. Now that would have made the newspapers. Cheers Stephen

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Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot?

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Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot?

There are all sorts of reasons, but the most common is that the pilot ?PIC is not satisfied that the approach is stable and correct in all respects. No other excuse/reason is needed. JD

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Last time I had a go around, that’s almost verbatim what I told the passengers. It was a really windy, rough, day, and I simply said that I wasn’t happy with the approach. Thinking back a year or two, we’ve had:     lightning strike and all of the runway lights went out     not visual at minima (during the typhoon in HK)     previous aircraft aborted (767 in Mel)     previous aircraft too slow to get going (VB in Sydney) Just tell the passengers what happened. JB

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot? There are all sorts of reasons, but the most common is that the pilot ?PIC is not satisfied that the approach is stable and correct in all respects. No other excuse/reason is needed. JD

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Just reading on a.net about some go around experience and was wondering what type of excuses/reasons pilots have given for the go-around. Animals on the runway, wind change etc etc… bored pilot?

Bored?  Heheh – if a pilot started doing go-arounds just because of boredom they’d be looking for a new job pretty soon.  I flew RPT and general charter at one stage in my life and the schedule is "God" as far as the pilot is concerned – and you’d want to have a pretty good excuse for aborting anything (take off, landing, your shout at the bar…) if you want to keep your career and promotion path alive But as JD said, in a perfect world the only reason needed would be the PIC wasn’t satisfied (for whatever reason) with the approach and decided to have another crack at it.  In my experience that can be any (or all) of the following; – runway infringement (car/plane/animal/person/drunk local on motor bike) – just plain screwed up the approach (too fast/slow/high/low, mis-judged the crosswind when turning final and finding yourself pointing at the control tower…during the inital onslaught of a cyclone tho – honest!) – ATC instruction – out of tolerance on an instrument approach (one that springs to mind: ILS into Alice Springs one night -5am in winter- in heavy cloud after a 10hr duty and 6 hr flight….ugh!) – forgot to put the gear down (I was doing training and had <1hr on retractables…oops! Glad I had an instructor on board.) I’ve also heard of pilots aborting approaches because: – they lined up on the highway instead of the runway (Darwin NT, back in the early 90’s – involved a Garuda 767 IIRC) – they realised the were about to land at the wrong homestead (RFDS pilots – c’mon speak up! You know who you are!! ) Does that satisfy your curiosity? Take care. James — Fortune cookies says: In every hierarchy the cream rises until it sours.                 — Dr. Laurence J. Peter

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Question:

Need message deleted

not sure how to do that on usenet but you can go to google.com and request a specific message id of yours be deleted.

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Need message deleted

There is no moderator for any of the newsgroup, and there is no way to guarantee that a NNTP cancel would necessarily cancel the message anyways. — http://cbbrowne.com/info/emacs.html Een schip op het strand is een baken in zee.

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would write: Need message deleted There is no moderator for any of the newsgroup, and there is no way to guarantee that a NNTP cancel would necessarily cancel the message anyways.

I also noticed the OP wanted to know who was in charge of "this" NG, and posted to quite a few of them. — Todd Stephens

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Need message deleted not sure how to do that on usenet but you can go to google.com and request a specific message id of yours be deleted.

It also depends on what software options you have. Sometimes, all you need to do is use the proper delete sequence, and that will cause the message to be deleted from your news server and eventually, through quantum propagation, all other news servers across the Internet. But in some cases, there is nothing you can do. Your embarassing usenet post will be around forever. Hi alt.accounting! Long time no see! — Phil nolemurz-at-earthlink-dot-net http://www.acmeforces.com <=== chronically incomplete Given enough heat, everything is flammable.

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Did you note that the original posing was cross-posted to about ten different groups, all alt.a… something in alphabetic order.  Someone is just playing games. — Don in Upstate NY

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Question:

Regardless, I won’t be in a position to take the CPA until at least 2004 anyway. My guess is that Becker’s interest in having you take the exam ASAP is because they want to get as much mileage as possible out of their current materials–plus it helps to get paid in 2003 rather than 2004 if you are in business <grin.  So their marketing materials may not be a totally unbiased source of advice about whether it makes more sense to take the exam before or after such a change takes place.

True, I also worry that for at least the first year or two after the change the study materials will not be of the quality that they are today.  I figure it will take a while before the various review companies get their new material down. — Todd Stephens

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True, I also worry that for at least the first year or two after the change the study materials will not be of the quality that they are today.

Of course, though, since the exam is generally handled on a curve that may not matter quite as much, at least unless your supplier is well behind the others <grin.  Now, how that "adjustment" is handled on the computerized exam is another issue entirely, but I suspect there will be some "fine tuning" to bring the pass level into line generally with the prior exams.  

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just got a mailer from Becker Conviser urging me to take the CPA before 2004 when the new computer based format goes into effect.  They say the CPA is not only changing format, but content as well with the new sections being: Auditing and attestation Financial accounting and reporting Regulation Business environment and concepts They also say that the test will put greater emphasis on research and communication skills, IT, general business knowledge, and have a MUCH broader coverage of auditing.  Is it just me, or does the AICPA seem like they are trying to muscle-out the other credentials (CMA and CIA come to mind).

… I find that very interesting. I wonder what the profession, the schools, and the AICPA’s motives are behind the change.  I can hardly wait until that time, when the inevitable exam question leak occurs, to find out how they "…emphasis on research and communication skills, IT, general business knowledge, and have a MUCH broader coverage of auditing…" — *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *  Unemployed for six years, mistake of being an accountant.  * *   Students, when someone tells you of your great future as  * *       an accountant, ask him to show you the job.           *

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I just got a mailer from Becker Conviser urging me to take the CPA before 2004 when the new computer based format goes into effect.  They say the CPA is not only changing format, but content as well with the new sections being: Auditing and attestation Financial accounting and reporting Regulation Business environment and concepts They also say that the test will put greater emphasis on research and communication skills, IT, general business knowledge, and have a MUCH broader coverage of auditing.  Is it just me, or does the AICPA seem like they are trying to muscle-out the other credentials (CMA and CIA come to mind). Regardless, I won’t be in a position to take the CPA until at least 2004 anyway. — Todd Stephens

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Is it just me, or does the AICPA seem like they are trying to muscle-out the other credentials (CMA and CIA come to mind).

I doubt that is the motivation, since those credentials generally "work best" in the marketplace alongside a CPA designation.  So, in some ways, having the exams have more overlap may help, rather then hurt, the organizations pushing those credentials (that is, prepping for one helps you prep for the other). In any event, the new titles for the sections look much like the sections that I took many years ago <grin, with "business environments and concepts" being the new kid on the block.  Back when I took it, the sections were Accounting Practice, Accounting Theory, Auditing and Business Law. Regardless, I won’t be in a position to take the CPA until at least 2004 anyway.

My guess is that Becker’s interest in having you take the exam ASAP is because they want to get as much mileage as possible out of their current materials–plus it helps to get paid in 2003 rather than 2004 if you are in business <grin.  So their marketing materials may not be a totally unbiased source of advice about whether it makes more sense to take the exam before or after such a change takes place.

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Question:

You don’t say whether you want to use the software as a ‘Front End’ system to record sales and produce  receipts for customers or simply as a ‘Back End’ system to do ‘after the fact’ bookkeeping.  Unless you want to spend more money for a specialised salon system, I would recommend you look at any or all of the ‘Big Three’ entry level systems – Quick Books, MYOB and Simply. They are inexpensive, proven, reliable systems and most accounting people are familiar with one or more of them.  Depending on how much spare time you have, you might want to consider talking to an Accounting Software Consultant who is familiar with the software and can show you how it can be adapted to handle your requirements and then pay them to install and setup the software up for you.  Saves a lot of time and frustration in the long run. FWIW,   Peter

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IMHO  Using QuickBooks is not accounting.  It is collecting data.  If you have Bookkeeping skills you will "probably" collect the data correctly and be able to produce simple, reasonably useable P&L statements. If you don’t have enough skill you "may", and I emphases "may", kill your business. Bookkeeping skills are not enough to perform accounting.  The journey from bookkeeping to accounting is like a pleasant stroll down a garden path that abruptly ends at a cliff. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you figured out what an LLC is, knew how or why to choose that form of company, and were able to figure out how to create and file the correct forms, — then you will probably be able to figure out QuickBooks and learn how to set up the right chart of accounts, etc. You are obviously smart enough to find the right books on the subject, read the right newsgroups, etc., so you can probably do it on your own. In that case, I think QuickBooks is what you want.  On the other hand, there might still be someone in your area who can show you how to use QuickBooks and get you started, for a price that you are willing to pay. The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes.

– *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *                                                             * *   Unemployed six years, and really beginning to enjoy it.   * *    From the Socialist People’s Republic of Kalifornia       * *                   Ayn Rand was right                        *

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I’d like to say thanks to everyone for responding. This is a genuine question, I do not own, operate or in anyway benefit from an Accounting or Accounting Software business. I do believe professional advice has a value, and you get what you pay for, generally.  $1000 just seems too much for what I want/need.  That fee did not include ongoing support — just the initial setup to get a business started.  I’d estimate if I ever had to do it again, it would take less than an hour and  cost $300 in fees. Most comments I’ve received have directed me to Quickbooks — but I’ve also noticed that the QB newsgroup has many more software-related problem than Peachtree’s.  Peachtree’s newsgroup seems to be filled with more accounting-oriented questions than software "gotcha’s".  The one MYOB recommendation I received has had an impact (thanks to jdo in alt.biz.accounting ) and I will investigate it.  So, I’m still undecided, but feel a little more educated.  I expect that whatever choice I come to initially, I’ll grow to be satisfied with the second ( or third or fourth ) package I acquire. And it won’t be because of the software, but rather because of the knowledge I’ll gain along the way. Now for my soapbox: I have been able to successfully complete all the forms necessary — forming the LLC, FEID, state registration,  Sales Tax, and several other state/local requirements like fire, professional licensing, etc.  I know I’m not a genius.  I am persistent.  The biggest difficulty I’ve come up against is the language/jargon used in the forms.  It’s often daunting and can make one feel like giving in and paying to just get it over — afterall, no one wants to run afoul of the government.  For example, try finding a definition of "fiscal month" (I know now).  Similarly, when asked whether 1065 or 1120, it would be good if forms included the explanations, rather than assuming one knows or making one search elsewhere.  Once the information is available, the determination is simple.  I’m not the first person to walk the path, and I won’t be the last.  It can be made much simpler and more understandable. Look at what it took to use a computer 15 years ago and compare it to today. While exacting language is necessary, the language is foreign to most outside the professions.  With deference to the ethical lawyers and accountants, and I truly believe the majority are ethical, the unscrupulous individuals gather much of the limelight and generate a great deal of fear, uncertainty and doubt in the general public.  That "FUD" is how they make their income — i.e. charging $1000 for what might be $500 of value. Soapbox done. So thanks again to everyone.  I truly appreciate the time time folks have taken. Les Wichtel

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

Response:

It sounds like you have done just fine and will do fine in the future. I have used QuickBooks, MYOB,  Peachtree (DOS) version and Simply Accounting, which is my choice. They are similar in many ways but I find the AccPac SA the easiest to use. MYOB and QuickBooks operate "in the box" (recent versions but not the last) When you start the program it creates a "program window" and all the windows open for that program must be in that program box. SA operates "out of the box" the "program window" and each window open stands alone and can be placed anywhere on the Widows desktop. When you are working in Purchases and want to see the chart of accounts the floating windows are a great help. The Purchase Module in SA is the most flexible you can use it for inventory and non-inventory items at the same time. QuickBooks works much the same but while MYOB has some great inventory features you must use a different purchase form for inventory and non-inventory items. This can be a hassle. The big point for QuickBooks is the so-called ease of use by non-accountants. You can force it to place account numbers in the chart of accounts but it still uses the Quicken system to sort and display the accounts. Master Account:subaccount:subaccount. All programs have good reporting and can export reports to text or spreadsheet format. I like the general journal and ledger display system used in SA also. I still think the best thing to do is see which programs have courses taught in you local tech schools. Take the course and use that program. Re-inventing the wheel is time consuming and costly.

I’d like to say thanks to everyone for responding. Most comments I’ve received have directed me to Quickbooks — but I’ve also noticed that the QB newsgroup has many more software-related problem than Peachtree’s.  Peachtree’s newsgroup seems to be filled with more accounting-oriented questions than software "gotcha’s".  The one MYOB recommendation I received has had an impact (thanks to jdo in alt.biz.accounting ) and I will investigate it.  So, I’m still

undecided, SNIP

Response:

Value for Services Rendered can be stretched to the unbearable point, and usually is by most attorneys and CPA’s as well. I am primarily in real estate investing and own several rental properties besides.  Plus I have income from a small chemical company. My real estate tax attorney charges what I consider a very fair price. My CPA who handles all the corporate taxes, charges a very fair price, considering the complexity of my returns. But he makes up for it in side charges, for eg.  I asked him to run my personal taxes this year, all the numbers were provided in the order they appear in his software.  Charge, just under what my corporate was.  I also asked him to run my daughters 1040EZ, again the numbers were supplied in the order his software wants them.  Cost, about 5 times what any other CPA in the whole state would have charged. Who knows, he may have been giving me a good break on my corporate returns, but by charging so much for my personal and so exhorbitant for my daughters EZ.  He will never get those two orders again. TTUL Gary

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Value for Services Rendered can be stretched to the unbearable point, and usually is by most attorneys and CPA’s as well. I am primarily in real estate investing and own several rental properties besides.  Plus I have income from a small chemical company. My real estate tax attorney charges what I consider a very fair price. My CPA who handles all the corporate taxes, charges a very fair price, considering the complexity of my returns. But he makes up for it in side charges, for eg.  I asked him to run my personal taxes this year, all the numbers were provided in the order they appear in his software.  Charge, just under what my corporate was.  I also asked him to run my daughters 1040EZ, again the numbers were supplied in the order his software wants them.  Cost, about 5 times what any other CPA in the whole state would have charged. Who knows, he may have been giving me a good break on my corporate returns, but by charging so much for my personal and so exhorbitant for my daughters EZ.  He will never get those two orders again. TTUL Gary

Have you asked your CPA to explain the charges?

Response:

Have you asked your CPA to explain the charges?

I asked his secretary since he wasn’t in. But your right, I should ask him! Thanks Gary

Response:

All most anyone can post to any book keeping program.  "Accounting program" is a misnomer IMHO, sitting on a tall oak stool with a green visor hand posting bills to ledgers is not accounting it is book keeping and that is what you do when you enter data into a book keeping program. Accounting is the knowledge used to create a chart of accounts that is suitable to the entity. Accounting is the knowledge used to ascertain an asset from an expense and the knowledge to garner some information from the data for decision making. How on earth can you justify the cost of book keep / accounting if you only use the data to pay taxes?

If you’re only using the data to pay taxes then you’re not using a lot of information that is available to you.  It’s kind of like using a scimitar to shave with.  Sure it’ll do the job, but it’s capable of so much more… — Brandon Sommerville Sommerville Consulting Taking care of your Caseview needs caseview at consultant dot com toll free voice message/fax: 1-877-271-9800  ext 9789053

Response:

All most anyone can post to any book keeping program.  "Accounting program" is a misnomer IMHO, sitting on a tall oak stool with a green visor hand posting bills to ledgers is not accounting it is book keeping and that is what you do when you enter data into a book keeping program. Accounting is the knowledge used to create a chart of accounts that is suitable to the entity. Accounting is the knowledge used to ascertain an asset from an expense and the knowledge to garner some information from the data for decision making. How on earth can you justify the cost of book keep / accounting if you only use the data to pay taxes?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you figured out what an LLC is, knew how or why to choose that form of company, and were able to figure out how to create and file the correct forms, — then you will probably be able to figure out QuickBooks and learn how to set up the right chart of accounts, etc. You are obviously smart enough to find the right books on the subject, read the right newsgroups, etc., so you can probably do it on your own. In that case, I think QuickBooks is what you want.  On the other hand, there might still be someone in your area who can show you how to use QuickBooks and get you started, for a price that you are willing to pay. The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes.

Response:

As a business person some of my best producing assets are the persons who help to service my legal and accounting needs. My problem was in learning how to choose those who had the skills.  As my skills improved I made better choices. If you have a business you have a businnes plan, in writing or some where in your dreams. Interview professionals and make them explain what they can do for you.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I, for one, totally agree with this guy [the original poster].  It doesn’t matter how much education an attorney or CPA has, if the services are not of sufficient value, the client won’t pay for them. Snip The problem is that the original poster assumed that all his future accounting, tax and legal needs will be a simple as filling out a form and sending in a check for 250.00. Okay.  Here is my two cents. It takes seven years of formal education to become a lawyer, it takes four or five years to become an accountant.  In addition to the direct cost of going to school there is the opportunity cost of the lost years of earning power while attending school.  If you can do it yourself, fine.  For those who can’t, those seeking our services, we expect to be compensated at the market rate. Snip The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes. …

Snip

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I, for one, totally agree with this guy [the original poster].  It doesn’t matter how much education an attorney or CPA has, if the services are not of sufficient value, the client won’t pay for them.  As a [non-practicing] CPA I continue to believe that 95% of the work I was trained to do can now be done just effectively by the taxpayer on his own (the other 5% being selected accounting and tax related matters).   Similarly, I simply do not believe that the $1,000 you pay an attorney for word processing services is a sensible expenditure.  I’ve done my own incorporations for years, had my clients do the same, and NOT ONCE in my career have I seen any adverse consequence of it (I must add, I have also seen situations where it made sense to hire an attorney for the incorporation, and in those instances I’ve recommended the client do so — but these are rare). The best solution is for those destined to be CPAs or attorneys to look to the future and recognize that there is going to be VERY limited demand for these kinds of services 10 years from now, and even moreso in 20 years.

The problem is that the original poster assumed that all his future accounting, tax and legal needs will be a simple as filling out a form and sending in a check for 250.00. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Okay.  Here is my two cents. It takes seven years of formal education to become a lawyer, it takes four or five years to become an accountant.  In addition to the direct cost of going to school there is the opportunity cost of the lost years of earning power while attending school.  If you can do it yourself, fine.  For those who can’t, those seeking our services, we expect to be compensated at the market rate. No one deserves or is entitled to a free lunch.  If I wish to donate my services, that is my decision.  No one has a right to them. The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes. … — *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *                                                             * *   Unemployed six years, and really beginning to enjoy it.   * *    From the Socialist People’s Republic of Kalifornia       * *                   Ayn Rand was right                        *

Response:

If you figured out what an LLC is, knew how or why to choose that form of company, and were able to figure out how to create and file the correct forms, — then you will probably be able to figure out QuickBooks and learn how to set up the right chart of accounts, etc. You are obviously smart enough to find the right books on the subject, read the right newsgroups, etc., so you can probably do it on your own. In that case, I think QuickBooks is what you want.  On the other hand, there might still be someone in your area who can show you how to use QuickBooks and get you started, for a price that you are willing to pay.     – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes.

Response:

I, for one, totally agree with this guy [the original poster].  It doesn’t matter how much education an attorney or CPA has, if the services are not of sufficient value, the client won’t pay for them.  As a [non-practicing] CPA I continue to believe that 95% of the work I was trained to do can now be done just effectively by the taxpayer on his own (the other 5% being selected accounting and tax related matters).   Similarly, I simply do not believe that the $1,000 you pay an attorney for word processing services is a sensible expenditure.  I’ve done my own incorporations for years, had my clients do the same, and NOT ONCE in my career have I seen any adverse consequence of it (I must add, I have also seen situations where it made sense to hire an attorney for the incorporation, and in those instances I’ve recommended the client do so — but these are rare). The best solution is for those destined to be CPAs or attorneys to look to the future and recognize that there is going to be VERY limited demand for these kinds of services 10 years from now, and even moreso in 20 years.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Okay.  Here is my two cents. It takes seven years of formal education to become a lawyer, it takes four or five years to become an accountant.  In addition to the direct cost of going to school there is the opportunity cost of the lost years of earning power while attending school.  If you can do it yourself, fine.  For those who can’t, those seeking our services, we expect to be compensated at the market rate. No one deserves or is entitled to a free lunch.  If I wish to donate my services, that is my decision.  No one has a right to them. The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes. … — *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *                                                             * *   Unemployed six years, and really beginning to enjoy it.   * *    From the Socialist People’s Republic of Kalifornia       * *                   Ayn Rand was right                        *

Response:

Okay.  Here is my two cents. It takes seven years of formal education to become a lawyer, it takes four or five years to become an accountant.  In addition to the direct cost of going to school there is the opportunity cost of the lost years of earning power while attending school.  If you can do it yourself, fine.  For those who can’t, those seeking our services, we expect to be compensated at the market rate. No one deserves or is entitled to a free lunch.  If I wish to donate my services, that is my decision.  No one has a right to them. The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes.

… — *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *                                                             * *   Unemployed six years, and really beginning to enjoy it.   * *    From the Socialist People’s Republic of Kalifornia       * *                   Ayn Rand was right                        *

Response:

The "local, friendly accountant" and his "local, friendly lawyer" buddy suggested their services to set up an LLC & do the initial paperwork for $1000-1200.  (All the startup filings cost me under $250).  I didn’t even go further to inquire about on-going fees.  Nice guys, but they must have chanpagne tastes.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use What did your accountant suggest? — Brandon Sommerville Sommerville Consulting Taking care of your Caseview needs caseview at consultant dot com toll free voice message/fax: 1-877-271-9800  ext 9789053

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a service that is essential to meaningful books and accurate tax returns.  You can have a friend who thinks they know accounting show you for free or you can pay a professional. My violin is a delight because I paid a professional to teach me the basics.  I’d still be squeaking along if I hadn’t paid for that essential service.  I’m not ready for an audience, but I’m not driving my family nuts either. — Sincerely, Joanne

The above is an excellent comparative example. I’ve been involved in public accounting for just under 30 years.  I have a number of different software packages on my hard drive, including QB2000. I recently had reason to "encourage" a long term tax client to "clean up" his accounting records (His wife and bookkeeper – same person – had died and had not been replaced).  I brought in a highly qualified professional bookkeeper and asked her for help. Accounting software?  Whatever she is comfortable with. — Jim Hudspeth, CFE, CPA http://home.att.net/~jdhcpa/mainpage.html Washington, USA

Response:

I agree A freind of mine just started a renovation business this year. I suggested find an accountant you can relate to. and I helped him post his income and expense to Quicken. Quicken is not a accounting program but as it works like a check book "an accounting moron" can use it. After a year or so you will know more about accounting and the sorting of income and expense in Quicken will create the background for the chart of accounts for an accounting program. AccPac Simply Accounting, MYOB or Quickbooks will all do what you want. Check your local tech schools for instruction in book keeping / software accounting. Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees

Check with your accountant re having these people sub-contract.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a service that is essential to meaningful books and accurate tax returns.  You can have a friend who thinks they know accounting show you for free or you can pay a professional. My violin is a delight because I paid a professional to teach me the basics.  I’d still be squeaking along if I hadn’t paid for that essential service.  I’m not ready for an audience, but I’m not driving my family nuts either. — Sincerely, Joanne The above is an excellent comparative example. I’ve been involved in public accounting for just under 30 years.  I have a number of different software packages on my hard drive, including QB2000. I recently had reason to "encourage" a long term tax client to "clean up" his accounting records (His wife and bookkeeper – same person – had died and had not been replaced).  I brought in a highly qualified professional bookkeeper and asked her for help. Accounting software?  Whatever she is comfortable with. — Jim Hudspeth, CFE, CPA http://home.att.net/~jdhcpa/mainpage.html Washington, USA

Response:

My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use

What did your accountant suggest? — Brandon Sommerville Sommerville Consulting Taking care of your Caseview needs caseview at consultant dot com toll free voice message/fax: 1-877-271-9800  ext 9789053

Response:

Sounds like a certain software application provider posts a question then answers it themselves. But really you may not need any computer accounting software if you run a hair salon. Cash in – checks out. Deposits equal income. Buy a payroll chart and spend one hour figuring the pay  - write checks based on it the next 26 or 52 times.  As far as tips go – well leave that to the hairdresses (no accounting program can help you there). Back into sales tax by dividing by 1.0XX. File all your returns manually. Or waste your time and your accountants and get a cheap make you feel good accounting program. Lots of Luck.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

Response:

QuickBooks is inexpensive, but you will have to learn how to use it, how to set up the right chart of accounts, etc.  When we started, we were completely clueless about accounting, didn’t know what a chart of accounts was, and didn’t know about asset accounts, liability accounts, "bank" accounts, depreciation, etc.  So, we put a lot of stuff in the wrong places and made a pretty big mess of it all. If you do get quickbooks, it would be a good idea to get someone to help set it up and show you how to use it.

This is a service that is essential to meaningful books and accurate tax returns.  You can have a friend who thinks they know accounting show you for free or you can pay a professional. My violin is a delight because I paid a professional to teach me the basics.  I’d still be squeaking along if I hadn’t paid for that essential service.  I’m not ready for an audience, but I’m not driving my family nuts either. — Sincerely, Joanne If it’s right for you, then it’s right, . . . . . for you!!! Play – http://www.jobird.com Pay for Play – http://www.jobird.com/refund.htm Looking for Love? – http://www.jobird.com/hearts.htm

Response:

I would suggest you engage the services of a competent and well recommended public accountant.  If for nothing else than to just start the books and explain what you need to do. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

– *             Ronald Lee Todd M.B.A., C.P.A.                  * *                                                             * *   Unemployed six years, and really beginning to enjoy it.   * *    From the Socialist People’s Republic of Kalifornia       * *                   Ayn Rand was right                        *

Response:

QuickBooks is inexpensive, but you will have to learn how to use it, how to set up the right chart of accounts, etc.  When we started, we were completely clueless about accounting, didn’t know what a chart of accounts was, and didn’t know about asset accounts, liability accounts, "bank" accounts, depreciation, etc.  So, we put a lot of stuff in the wrong places and made a pretty big mess of it all. If you do get quickbooks, it would be a good idea to get someone to help set it up and show you how to use it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Quickbooks is the obvious choice… My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

Response:

Quickbooks is the obvious choice…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

Response:

My appologies for cross-posting, but I’m not sure where to post this. I’m an accounting moron, but must set something up for my wife’s very small hair salon. I’d appreciate any recommendations for accounting software than can run under Win98SE. My goals are: Easy to use Not too exspensive Able to handle payroll / taxes for 5 employees Able to handle a small number of suppliers Easy to use Good help available  (in the software or " xxxx For Dummies"-type book) Easy to use Thanks. Les Wichtel

Response:

Question:

    I just graduated college with a diploma in accounting.  The reason for the diploma is it is an addition to my already established Bachelors Degree in Business Administration from Eastern College in Saint Davids, Pennsylvania.  Due to lack of income and expensive living conditions in Pennsylvania, I had to move to Kentucky.  Unfortunately, I haven’t been able to find any jobs here which match my qualifications.  When I called my old alma mater about job assistance and placement they could not assist me in a job search because my location was out of their jurisdiction.  Therefore, I got a degree but no job assistance.     Recently I attended Sullivan College, now Sullivan University, in Louisville Kentucky and took up the needed accounting classes for a career in accounting.  I at the time of taking classes was working for a retail outfit as a cashier and needed something I enjoyed and would provide me with a good income.  However I am in my 40’s and would appreciate any suggestions for experience.  I am looking to be committed with a company and serve long term.  Not only am I looking at jobs within the area but I am looking at jobs abroad.  What are your suggestions?

Response:

… a good income.  However I am in my 40’s and would appreciate any suggestions for experience.  

… The only procedure I know of is to buy Bowles’s (sp?) book, "What color is my parachute."  Read it carefully and follow its methodology.

Response:

Question:

I am starting a small home bookkeeping and payroll service.  What would be the best software package for me? I will probably have up to 8 to 10 companies at the most. I have experience mostly with Peachtree Complete Accounting, MS Money and QuickBooks 99.  Is Quickbooks 99 still available to purchase, QuickBooks 2000 scares me as I have not heard anything good about it.  Thanks for your help! * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

I have a small home bookkeeping business (11 small businesses) and I use both Quickbookspro 99 and 2000.  I use both because some of my clients use QB 99 and some use 2000.  I didn’t like 2000 at first but now that I have used it for a while and have become accustomed to it, I like it somewhat better than the older versions (have used QB since version 2 for DOS).  My clients range from medical offices to construction and QB works well for all of them. Angela Remember:  That which doesn’t break us makes us stronger.

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Question:

Typing these extracts, from the proposed rulemaking document: The new section provides that within their 3-year total of 120 hours, – a minimum of 20 hours per year. – a CPA in public practice must complete 8 hours of A&A per yr.     (The new rule reduces the A&A requirement from 32 hours      every 2 years under the old system, to 8 hours per year.) – a CPA is limited to 24 hours of non-technical subjects for      the whole 3 years (e.g. 8 hrs/ year) – all CPAs are required to complete the 4 hour ethics course. The rule change also – establishes reasonable cause provisions for exemption from CPA – provides guidelines to CPAs who want to change their status      from the ‘reasonable cause’ status – requires reciprocity applicants from other states to comply,      except for the 4-hour ethics course. There is a hearing July 29, 1999 1:30 pm at    Western Washington University,    Viking Addition, Room 461    Bellingham WA   You can submit written comments until July 27, to    Dana McInturff    PO Box 9131    Olympia, WA  98507-9131    Fax (360) 664-9190 Seems clear and simple enough to me.  It doesn’t change my life at all.  I’m going to study GAAP, reporting, accounting topics more than 8 hours a year anyway. 32 hours of Nontechnical subjects were previously allowed every 24 months (e.g. 16 hours per year). Definitions are http://www.cpaboard.wa.gov/rules/wac/wac4_25_811.html  (b) Nontechnical subjects:     (i)   Communication skills;     (ii)  Interpersonal management skills;     (iii) Personal development skills;     (iv)  Public relations;     (v)   Practice development. Hummph..  I don’t have a problem with that either. But here are the "Technical Subjects": (a) Technical subjects:   (i)   Accounting and auditing;   (ii)  Management advisory services;   (iii) Personal financial planning;   (iv)  Taxation;   (v)   Management information services;   (vi)  Budgeting and cost analysis;   (vii) Asset management;   (viii) Professional ethics;   (ix)  Specialized areas of industry;   (x)   Human resource management;   (xi)  Economics;   (xii) Business law;   (xiii) Mathematics, statistics, and quantitative applications in business;   (xiv) Business management and organization Accounting and/or auditing subjects are not defined anyplace I can see. The words computer, automation, software, information systems, etc. don’t appear anyplace, either.   The general rule is "contributes to the growth in the professional knowledge and professional competence of an individual in the practice of the profession" * Todd F. Boyle CPA    http://www.GLDialtone.com/ * 9745-128th Av NE, Kirkland WA 98033       (425) 827-3107 * XML Accounting Web ledger ASP netledger, web GL Dialtone, whatever.

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The words computer, automation, software, information systems, etc. don’t appear anyplace, either.   The general rule is "contributes to the growth in the professional knowledge and professional competence of an individual in the practice of the profession"

Using the profession’s "traditional" way of defining these terms, I would expect most computer work would fall under either A&A *OR* Management Advisory Services, both of which are relatively broad categories.  Heck, I’ve even lectured in sessions that were "officially" tax presentations that dealt with technology issues. I would certainly expect most CPE providers to attempt to qualify their courses under one of those two broad categories, even if the information would also be of use to a CPA in his/her own practice. In general, technology normally would be applied to accomplish another goal–rarely does it exist in a vacuum.  I think the practical application for the technology being discussed would determine the nature of the CPE course.

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Seems clear and simple enough to me.  It doesn’t change my life at all.  I’m going to study GAAP, reporting, accounting topics more than 8 hours a year anyway.

It doesn’t change anything for me, either. As a tax practitioner, I have absolutely no need for A&A. Yet, under the proposed new rule, I must take as much as before (on average, 8 hours per year). In fact, the proposed rule is even *more* burdensome by requiring a minimum of 8 credits *per year*, thereby eliminating the "lower cost" alternative of attending a *single* 16 (or 24) hour A&A course once during the 2 (or 3) year cycle. I don’t get the rationale for the proposed new rule. It cuts in half the amount of required A&A CPE for licensees who *actually practice* in the A&A area, and it totally eliminates the A&A requirement for licensees in private practice (without regard for whether they work in an A&A environment). So, everyone gets a break *except* tax practitioners who have no need for the A&A course work in the first place! Nuts! MTW -Michael T. Wing, CPA (WA)  http://www.versatax.com/

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Seems clear and simple enough to me.  It doesn’t change my life at all.  I’m going to study GAAP, reporting, accounting topics more than 8 hours a year anyway. It doesn’t change anything for me, either. As a tax practitioner, I have absolutely no need for A&A. Yet, under the proposed new rule, I must take as much as before (on average, 8 hours per year). In fact, the proposed rule is even *more* burdensome by requiring a minimum of 8 credits *per year*, thereby eliminating the "lower cost" alternative of attending a *single* 16 (or 24) hour A&A course once during the 2 (or 3) year cycle. I don’t get the rationale for the proposed new rule. It cuts in half the amount of required A&A CPE for licensees who *actually practice* in the A&A area, and it totally eliminates the A&A requirement for licensees in private practice (without regard for whether they work in an A&A environment). So, everyone gets a break *except* tax practitioners who have no need for the A&A course work in the first place! Nuts! MTW

Mike, Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things. I did get a copy of the entire agenda.  Most of the other items on it are housekeeping things that are not likely to get anyone stirred up. Jim Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things.

Might not be a bad idea.  I get the feeling that many of the "bad" things we complain about happen primarily because too many of us like to sit around and complain about what has happened. While if no one else shows up you may be Don Quixote tilling at a windmill, at least you can say you attempted to *do* something and the opposition is prevented from saying that they adopted it based on "overwhelming" support since no complaints were registered.

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Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things. Might not be a bad idea.  I get the feeling that many of the "bad" things we complain about happen primarily because too many of us like to sit around and complain about what has happened. While if no one else shows up you may be Don Quixote tilling at a windmill, at least you can say you attempted to *do* something and the opposition is prevented from saying that they adopted it based on "overwhelming" support since no complaints were registered.

I know it works.  I have seen to many of my ideas turned into law to think otherwise. Word of caution – be sure of what you ask for – you just might get it. A relevent example: In 1984 I vigorously lobbied the Washington Board to establish a quality control program.   One of the board members told me to my face that he didn’t know if I was a visionary of just plain nuts, but that there was no way he was going to vote to get the state board involved in a quality control program. Nevertheless, five years later, in 1989, the Board ran its first QAR cycle. With the help of some 20/20 hindsight, I think that board member was right. Jim Hudspeth, CPA Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Word of caution – be sure of what you ask for – you just might get it.

Unintended consequences are always a major issue <grin.

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Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things.

I’m sure I will send a letter. But, probably won’t go in person… MTW -Michael T. Wing, CPA (WA)  http://www.versatax.com/

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Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things. I did get a copy of the entire agenda.  Most of the other items on it are housekeeping things that are not likely to get anyone stirred up. Jim

I have decided it probably isn’t a good use of my time.. but hey, if you drive to Bellingham via I-405 I’ll buy you a free lunch. Would be a lot of fun!   Todd

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Might be worthwhile to go and tell them what you think about it.  If enough of you tax guys show up and make noise it might change things. I did get a copy of the entire agenda.  Most of the other items on it are housekeeping things that are not likely to get anyone stirred up. Jim I have decided it probably isn’t a good use of my time.. but hey, if you drive to Bellingham via I-405 I’ll buy you a free lunch. Would be a lot of fun! Todd

I’m leaving it a bit loose.  None of my "hot button" issues are on the agenda, however there are new board members I haven’t met. We can get together & do lunch anyway. Jim Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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I have decided it probably isn’t a good use of my time..

Actually, I’m having second thoughts about even submitting a letter. I guess I really don’t want to call attention to myself. <g By the way, here is another tidbit that I gleaned from the WA State Board’s proposed new rules – a new rule on reciprocity contains the following statement (with respect to out-of-state licensees): "You may not use the title CPA and you may not hold out as a CPA in public practice until you have filed a complete application with the board." Note that this is *new* language…post Ibanez (maybe word of the Supreme Court case hasn’t reached the west coast yet <g). My inquiring mind wants to know…how will this impact out-of-state internet practitioners who solicit business in WA state??? MTW -Michael T. Wing, CPA (WA)  http://www.versatax.com/

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have decided it probably isn’t a good use of my time.. Actually, I’m having second thoughts about even submitting a letter. I guess I really don’t want to call attention to myself. <g By the way, here is another tidbit that I gleaned from the WA State Board’s proposed new rules – a new rule on reciprocity contains the following statement (with respect to out-of-state licensees): "You may not use the title CPA and you may not hold out as a CPA in public practice until you have filed a complete application with the board." Note that this is *new* language…post Ibanez (maybe word of the Supreme Court case hasn’t reached the west coast yet <g). My inquiring mind wants to know…how will this impact out-of-state internet practitioners who solicit business in WA state???

Will not impact them at all. Unless there is a complaint, the Board has no way of knowing it is going on, and even if they did know they don’t have the resources to pursue it. Also, unless the "internet practitioner" has a point of presence in Washington State it is highly doubtful the Washington Board has the authority to regulate them. Jim Hudspeth Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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By the way, here is another tidbit that I gleaned from the WA State Board’s proposed new rules – a new rule on reciprocity contains the following statement (with respect to out-of-state licensees): "You may not use the title CPA and you may not hold out as a CPA in public practice until you have filed a complete application with the board."

I think it depends on how they enforce that provision.  I doubt the Supreme Court will have problems with the state if they go against those who do not file with the board, physically practice in Washington, but don’t disclose the fact that they aren’t subject to Washington state regulation.  However, I doubt that the Supremes would be terribly happy with them if they went against a CPA that *clearly* indicated he/she was licensed by another state. As I’ve said before, this is not anything really new since we’ve had various times when CPAs have used the title in a state they weren’t licensed in–if by no other medium than via publishing articles in magazines. — Ed Zollars, CPA (AZ) http://www.getnet.com/~hmtzcpas

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Unless there is a complaint, the Board has no way of knowing it is going on, and even if they did know they don’t have the resources to pursue it.

Well, I certainly agree with that. Pretty much the "bottom line" of *all* worrying over state board regulations is that actual enforcement is unlikely. Also, unless the "internet practitioner" has a point of presence in Washington State it is highly doubtful the Washington Board has the authority to regulate them.

But, the proposed rule says nothing about physical presence. It simply restricts use of the title (notwithstanding Ibanez, apparently) and "holding out" – whatever the heck that means. <g MTW -Michael T. Wing, CPA (WA)  http://www.versatax.com/

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unless there is a complaint, the Board has no way of knowing it is going on, and even if they did know they don’t have the resources to pursue it. Well, I certainly agree with that. Pretty much the "bottom line" of *all* worrying over state board regulations is that actual enforcement is unlikely. Also, unless the "internet practitioner" has a point of presence in Washington State it is highly doubtful the Washington Board has the authority to regulate them. But, the proposed rule says nothing about physical presence. It simply restricts use of the title (notwithstanding Ibanez, apparently) and "holding out" – whatever the heck that means. <g

The Washington Board can’t restrict what some guy in Arizona puts on his web site. Jim Hudspeth, CPA Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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But, the proposed rule says nothing about physical presence. It simply restricts use of the title (notwithstanding Ibanez, apparently) and "holding out" – whatever the heck that means. <g

It may just be that by putting that provision in the rules, they are "keeping happy" the local practitioners.  Florida for years was viewed as having rules whose primary goal was to keep New York CPAs from retiring and setting up part time practices <grin.  I suspect that Washington may face similar concerns about California CPAs moving into the state. Whether they ever would actually be able to *enforce* the rule is another issue entirely.  But, what the heck, there are lots of laws on the books that are clearly unenforcable.

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The Washington Board can’t restrict what some guy in Arizona puts on his web site.

No, they can’t regulate the (truthful) *content* of a website because that would clearly run afoul of the first amendment. However, they can impose licensing requirements on CPAs "holding out" in this state. If the guy in Arizona is claiming to be a CPA and is clearly soliciting business from Washington State residents, I’d bet that the WA state board would have something to say on the matter. (Indeed, under their proposed rule, the mere use of the CPA title in WA would require reciprocal licensing.) The practical answer, of course, is that none of this probably much matters unless or until a complaint is filed. But, where would an aggrieved WA resident file that complaint? With the AZ Board? With the WA Board? Which state’s rules (if there was a difference) would apply? Would the AZ Board attempt to enforce WA’s rules in such a case? And/or can a CPA avoid *any possibility* of state board enforcement by only accepting work from clients *outside* of his licensure state??? Who knows… <g   MTW -Michael T. Wing, CPA (WA)  http://www.versatax.com/

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The Washington Board can’t restrict what some guy in Arizona puts on his web site. No, they can’t regulate the (truthful) *content* of a website because that would clearly run afoul of the first amendment. However, they can impose licensing requirements on CPAs "holding out" in this state. If the guy in Arizona is claiming to be a CPA and is clearly soliciting business from Washington State residents, I’d bet that the WA state board would have something to say on the matter. (Indeed, under their proposed rule, the mere use of the CPA title in WA would require reciprocal licensing.)

Under your facts, the WA Board could say anything it wanted to say, but could do nothing (except complain to the Arizona Board). The practical answer, of course, is that none of this probably much matters unless or until a complaint is filed. But, where would an aggrieved WA resident file that complaint? With the AZ Board? With the WA Board? Which state’s rules (if there was a difference) would apply? Would the AZ Board attempt to enforce WA’s rules in such a case?

Seems to me the only place a complaint could be effectively filed would be in the state of licensure, which in this example would be Arizona. Jim Hudspeth, CPA Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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The practical answer, of course, is that none of this probably much matters unless or until a complaint is filed. But, where would an aggrieved WA resident file that complaint? With the AZ Board? With the WA Board? Which state’s rules (if there was a difference) would apply? Would the AZ Board attempt to enforce WA’s rules in such a case? And/or can a CPA avoid *any possibility* of state board enforcement by only accepting work from clients *outside* of his licensure state???

If the issue involved was tax related, the *IRS* obviously has jurisdiction in the case at hand.  And, I would argue, that since this individual would be using his Arizona license, the entity that granted it (Arizona Board of Accountancy) could take action against him. — Ed Zollars, CPA (AZ) http://www.getnet.com/~hmtzcpas

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Question:

No question about it, any golf page without a picture of Joe Carpath is second rate — http://home.midsouth.rr.com/joecartpath – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a golf picture page that I am trying to expand on.  Which golfer should I include next?  Lehman, Daly, or others??  I already have Couples, Woods and some others.  My page is at http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/6235/golf.html if you want to see it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks

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obviously second rate — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

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obviously second rate

Picky, picky Lorry.  The guy’s a bank officer, not a web designer. kb

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Picky, picky Lorry.  The guy’s a bank officer, not a web designer.

I went to Joe’s site and really liked the content and the quirky writing style. An anecdote: Some of you might know a little about Australian Rules Football. They have these goal umpires that dress in white coats with hats. They have all these crazy sort of actions and signals for goals and points, and are real masters of suspense as the crowd waits with bated breath for them to signal a score. They are really theatrically "wacky" in front of a crowds of up to 100,000 people. They’ve become real cult figures in some sections of the Australian public. Well, I saw a profile of about them last football season, and wouldn’t you know it, they were all bank officers, insurance clerks, accountants or actuaries. Behind every web designer is a bank teller waiting to get out, eh Joe? Cheers Colin Wilson Trentham Golf Club http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham

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Lorry, I think I’m the only person who caught what you were pointing out<LOL! Joe! Get your picture up there!!!! Steve Stay Late,     Behave,     Wait for a ride! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – obviously second rate — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

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One think I would hope your teachers at Northern would explain to you is about copyrights. Just looking over your pages very quick, I recognized plenty of pictures as shots that belong to other sources, Allsport, Associated Press, etc…  I’d be careful here.  While it doesn’t look like your trying to go profitable or anything with your site, commercial companies get very picky about the use of their material.  You would generally need their permission and need to give them proper credit. I have a golf picture page that I am trying to expand on.  Which golfer should I include next?  Lehman, Daly, or others??  I already have Couples, Woods and some others.  My page is at http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/6235/golf.html if you want to see it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks

Dan King GolfWeb "The course [Crooked Stick] is so long I had to take the curvature of the Earth into consideration."  –David Feherty, 1991

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Great page! cheer from France (add me!!! ))

Alain…this group is not for posting pics…. In the future, please send our pics via email to the interested party. Thanks! A Good Walk NOT Spoiled, Mark

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Hi Alain If you’re really pissed off with one person, why take it out on the rest of us? It took ages to download all your pictures. Incidentally, don’t bother trying to zap me too, you just joined the rest of the posters and subjects I filter – so I won’t see the reply … — Eddie Haynes-Smart Cape Town, South Africa

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No feelings hurt – I DID catch on. But I still think both the site and my game are second rate Hope to improve BOTH of them over the next couple of months. — http://home.midsouth.rr.com/joecartpath – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Whew…..I was getting a little worried….  occasionally RSGers (names withheld to protect the innocent) are known to shoot first and ask his site was pretty cool and I’m pretty sure he caught on..Lorry — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

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I know – just like my golf game. — http://home.midsouth.rr.com/joecartpath – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – obviously second rate — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

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Whew…..I was getting a little worried….  occasionally RSGers (names withheld to protect the innocent) are known to shoot first and ask his site was pretty cool and I’m pretty sure he caught on..Lorry — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

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Whew…..I was getting a little worried….  occasionally RSGers (names withheld to protect the innocent) are known to shoot first and ask his site was pretty cool and I’m pretty sure he caught on..Lorry — Stay Calm,    Be Brave,   Wait for the Signs

If there’s humor to be found, I’ll find it! Mr. … wait a minute, I’ll be right back! Holy jumpin’ horny toads, that cold front came through last night! Mr. 68 (going to 75 by noon) Deg F.

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Sure why not. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Would you like a picture of me playing with Johnny Miller? You could say I’m you (g). — Steve Conlon Conlon’s Custom Clubs-NJ http://www.proclubs.com

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I have tried to contact these companies but I never get a response, so I just say What the Hell. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One think I would hope your teachers at Northern would explain to you is about copyrights. Just looking over your pages very quick, I recognized plenty of pictures as shots that belong to other sources, Allsport, Associated Press, etc… I’d be careful here.  While it doesn’t look like your trying to go profitable or anything with your site, commercial companies get very picky about the use of their material.  You would generally need their permission and need to give them proper credit. I have a golf picture page that I am trying to expand on.  Which golfer should I include next?  Lehman, Daly, or others??  I already have Couples, Woods and some others.  My page is at http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/6235/golf.html if you want to see it. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks Dan King GolfWeb "The course [Crooked Stick] is so long I had to take the curvature of the Earth into consideration."  –David Feherty, 1991

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I have a golf picture page that I am trying to expand on.  Which golfer should I include next?  Lehman, Daly, or others??  I already have Couples, Woods and some others.  My page is at http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/6235/golf.html if you want to see it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks

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 I’d have to agree…very cool web page! Keep it in the short grass!!! ~milo~ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No question about it, any golf page without a picture of Joe Carpath is second rate — http://home.midsouth.rr.com/joecartpath I have a golf picture page that I am trying to expand on.  Which golfer should I include next?  Lehman, Daly, or others??  I already have Couples, Woods and some others.  My page is at http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/6235/golf.html if you want to see it.  Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks

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