Question:

Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

You’re obviously very dumb.  Norway is quite affluent.  Ever hear of North Sea oil.  DUH! Jeff Trishia Rose wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

Impoverised ?? they are about twice as wealthy as USA per capita and one of most technicaly advanced. maybe we could learn a thing or two from them.  before speaking read following info on Norway: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/no.html here is what it says about economics:       Economy – overview:       The Norwegian economy is a prosperous bastion of welfare capitalism, featuring a combination of free market activity and government intervention. The government controls key areas, such as the vital petroleum sector (through large-scale state enterprises). The country is richly endowed with natural resources – petroleum, hydropower, fish, forests, and minerals – and is highly dependent on its oil production and international oil prices, with oil and gas accounting for one-third of exports. Only Saudi Arabia and Russia export more oil than Norway. Norway opted to stay out of the EU during a referendum in November 1994. The government has moved ahead with privatization. With arguably the highest quality of life worldwide, Norwegians still worry about that time in the next two decades when the oil and gas begin to run out. Accordingly, Norway has been saving its oil-boosted budget surpluses in a Government Petroleum Fund, which is invested abroad and now is valued at more than $43 billion. GDP growth was a lackluster 1% in 2002 and 0.5% in 2003 against the background of a faltering European economy.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

begin 666 dictionary.jpg M`0`"$0,1“`![$!QLO)F!2B6-F),%"!1_]H`" $!“$%`L8_+6#:X&W-6;D MQ*#NI+U/BO4&[<[YK[XBC1&E7ZJ(NYEK;P3F_;#KV;&S9M;,]61 M9A)XI"=Y=1(RBF2+RT8ZIU;4XS3("B=’/%=?Y]+;"O*`VF-GD*- M,;G3,.NRKL*,1#6Y&6,AR!’8`3 4-!W"<K[!G<9]8""7)56-WJ_B(S! ` end begin 666 listing.jpg [`1" `2`!D#`1$``A$!`Q$!_` MWF:MNC;LXQD14N7OPGZL^+ <6)%L4ZIO0DFM.IOG#*9O%(J-ZGC,C&_*]N:9 J*7ITP7&58N(((JM,D9(TRZR^ZT9[7 S2RH080OX:T2=I*!B%U__9 ` end

Response:

Impoverised ?? they are about twice as wealthy as USA per capita and one of most technicaly advanced.

Methinks I ruffled a feather with my initial post, and that said feather was skillfully crafted into a perfectly tied fly, floated gently downstream on the Current of Believability, and right into the waiting maw of the wily Nutzfish. Of course I've been known to be wrong. JP Still wondering..... - Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -maybe we could learn a thing or two from them. before speaking read following info on Norway: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/no.html here is what it says about economics:      Economy - overview:      The Norwegian economy is a prosperous bastion of welfare capitalism, featuring a combination of free market activity and government intervention. The government controls key areas, such as the vital petroleum sector (through large-scale state enterprises). The country is richly endowed with natural resources - petroleum, hydropower, fish, forests, and minerals - and is highly dependent on its oil production and international oil prices, with oil and gas accounting for one-third of exports. Only Saudi Arabia and Russia export more oil than Norway. Norway opted to stay out of the EU during a referendum in November 1994. The government has moved ahead with privatization. With arguably the highest quality of life worldwide, Norwegians still worry about that time in the next two decades when the oil and gas begin to run out. Accordingly, Norway has been saving its oil-boosted budget surpluses in a Government Petroleum Fund, which is invested abroad and now is valued at more than $43 billion. GDP growth was a lackluster 1% in 2002 and 0.5% in 2003 against the background of a faltering European economy. Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I'm not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status...

Response:

I'm not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find [...] the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

No no no! You have to be more subtle when you troll, otherwise it just seems… stupid. /Fredrik

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people! Alex

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people!

But no lions or tigers. Alex

Alan — Alan Williams, Room IT301, Department of Computer Science, University of Manchester, Oxford Road, Manchester, M13 9PL, U.K. Tel: +44 161 275 6270      Fax: +44 161 275 6280

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway,

I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

A Norwegian here once told me one of her favorite sayings: "Ten thousand Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian." I attended her wedding (to a Swede) in the teeny tiny Norwegian Seamen’s Church in San Francsico.  She wore a real gold crown.

Response:

NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people!

You say that now, but just wait until the warrior-laden longships sail into YOUR harbor! — Visit my Iron Age Pages for technical and fun stuff (holiday specials, too)! http://pages.prodigy.net/feaudrey

Response:

You say that now, but just wait until the warrior-laden longships sail into YOUR harbor!

HA! They’re my ancient descendancy actually. Brothers. Alex

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people! Alex

They did the best damn opening and closing shows of any Winter Olympics that I’ve ever seen. It was within the last 10 years.. awesome show. I’m so wanting to see it in person. robbielynn

Response:

Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking?

Yes but they cannot afford sandpaper so they use dried lutefish instead. Beats eating the stuff. … Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?

Last I heard, they did in Tromso. — FF

Response:

… Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access? Last I heard, they did in Tromso.

 out of 4.5 million norwegians there are 2.5 million internet accounts.  so I would say just about every family is hooked up. Jaap

Response:

… Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access? Last I heard, they did in Tromso.  out of 4.5 million norwegians there are 2.5 million internet accounts.  so I would say just about every family is hooked up. Jaap

No, there are only 5 Norwegians with internet access.  The rub is that each one of them has 500,000 internet accounts.

Response:

Yes but they cannot afford sandpaper so they use dried lutefish instead.

Can you dry it?   I thought the slime was a permanent feature. Beats eating the stuff.

Drown it in enough melted butter so you don’t taste it.   Wrap it in a bit of lefse. The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. scott

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

But how much does that $20 buy? — –John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Response:

A Norwegian here once told me one of her favorite sayings: "Ten thousand Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian."

Wrong. That was :Ten thousand female virgin Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian with his Norwegian Wood." I once had a girl or should I say she once had me She showed me her room, isn’t it good Norwegian wood She asked me to stay and she told me to sit anywhere So I looked around and I noticed there wasn’t a chair I sat on a rug biding my time drinking her wine We talked until two and then she said: ‘It’s time for bed’ She told me she worked in the morning and started to laugh I told her I didn’t and crawled off to sleep in the bath And when I awoke I was alone, this bird had flown So I lit a fire, isn’t it good Norwegian wood   The Beatles

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it.

What about the Norwegian hottie that serves it? JP

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. What about the Norwegian hottie that serves it?

They’re all in Norway.   Hottie and Wisconsin don’t seem to go together. scott (alright, enough flames already).

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it.

<rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g    – Mark

Response:

While lutefisk, and the prep thereof is disgusting, it isn’t, when served with the bacon and pea mush, not that bad. We experienced it on Crystal Harmony in 1994 at the Captain’s table, and when we were lucky enough the seated there again in 1995 on Crystal Symphony with the same Captain, we requested it again. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. <rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g    – Mark

Response:

Shut up, Chrissy, just shut the fuck up.

Response:

Trishia: Either you’re trying to be amusing and failing badly, or you know absolutely nothing about Norway. Norway, for example, is one of the richest countries in the entire world. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

Shut up Dick. just shut the fuck up – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – While lutefisk, and the prep thereof is disgusting, it isn’t, when served with the bacon and pea mush, not that bad. We experienced it on Crystal Harmony in 1994 at the Captain’s table, and when we were lucky enough the seated there again in 1995 on Crystal Symphony with the same Captain, we requested it again. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. <rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g   — Mark

Response:

Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

You’re obviously very dumb.  Norway is quite affluent.  Ever hear of North Sea oil.  DUH! Jeff Trishia Rose wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

Impoverised ?? they are about twice as wealthy as USA per capita and one of most technicaly advanced. maybe we could learn a thing or two from them.  before speaking read following info on Norway: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/no.html here is what it says about economics:       Economy – overview:       The Norwegian economy is a prosperous bastion of welfare capitalism, featuring a combination of free market activity and government intervention. The government controls key areas, such as the vital petroleum sector (through large-scale state enterprises). The country is richly endowed with natural resources – petroleum, hydropower, fish, forests, and minerals – and is highly dependent on its oil production and international oil prices, with oil and gas accounting for one-third of exports. Only Saudi Arabia and Russia export more oil than Norway. Norway opted to stay out of the EU during a referendum in November 1994. The government has moved ahead with privatization. With arguably the highest quality of life worldwide, Norwegians still worry about that time in the next two decades when the oil and gas begin to run out. Accordingly, Norway has been saving its oil-boosted budget surpluses in a Government Petroleum Fund, which is invested abroad and now is valued at more than $43 billion. GDP growth was a lackluster 1% in 2002 and 0.5% in 2003 against the background of a faltering European economy.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

begin 666 dictionary.jpg M`0`"$0,1“`![$!QLO)F!2B6-F),%"!1_]H`" $!“$%`L8_+6#:X&W-6;D MQ*#NI+U/BO4&[<[YK[XBC1&E7ZJ(NYEK;P3F_;#KV;&S9M;,]61 M9A)XI"=Y=1(RBF2+RT8ZIU;4XS3("B=’/%=?Y]+;"O*`VF-GD*- M,;G3,.NRKL*,1#6Y&6,AR!’8`3 4-!W"<K[!G<9]8""7)56-WJ_B(S! ` end begin 666 listing.jpg [`1" `2`!D#`1$``A$!`Q$!_` MWF:MNC;LXQD14N7OPGZL^+ <6)%L4ZIO0DFM.IOG#*9O%(J-ZGC,C&_*]N:9 J*7ITP7&58N(((JM,D9(TRZR^ZT9[7 S2RH080OX:T2=I*!B%U__9 ` end

Response:

Impoverised ?? they are about twice as wealthy as USA per capita and one of most technicaly advanced.

Methinks I ruffled a feather with my initial post, and that said feather was skillfully crafted into a perfectly tied fly, floated gently downstream on the Current of Believability, and right into the waiting maw of the wily Nutzfish. Of course I've been known to be wrong. JP Still wondering..... - Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -maybe we could learn a thing or two from them. before speaking read following info on Norway: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/no.html here is what it says about economics:      Economy - overview:      The Norwegian economy is a prosperous bastion of welfare capitalism, featuring a combination of free market activity and government intervention. The government controls key areas, such as the vital petroleum sector (through large-scale state enterprises). The country is richly endowed with natural resources - petroleum, hydropower, fish, forests, and minerals - and is highly dependent on its oil production and international oil prices, with oil and gas accounting for one-third of exports. Only Saudi Arabia and Russia export more oil than Norway. Norway opted to stay out of the EU during a referendum in November 1994. The government has moved ahead with privatization. With arguably the highest quality of life worldwide, Norwegians still worry about that time in the next two decades when the oil and gas begin to run out. Accordingly, Norway has been saving its oil-boosted budget surpluses in a Government Petroleum Fund, which is invested abroad and now is valued at more than $43 billion. GDP growth was a lackluster 1% in 2002 and 0.5% in 2003 against the background of a faltering European economy. Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I'm not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status...

Response:

I'm not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find [...] the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

No no no! You have to be more subtle when you troll, otherwise it just seems… stupid. /Fredrik

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people! Alex

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people!

But no lions or tigers. Alex

Alan — Alan Williams, Room IT301, Department of Computer Science, University of Manchester, Oxford Road, Manchester, M13 9PL, U.K. Tel: +44 161 275 6270      Fax: +44 161 275 6280

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway,

I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

A Norwegian here once told me one of her favorite sayings: "Ten thousand Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian." I attended her wedding (to a Swede) in the teeny tiny Norwegian Seamen’s Church in San Francsico.  She wore a real gold crown.

Response:

NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people!

You say that now, but just wait until the warrior-laden longships sail into YOUR harbor! — Visit my Iron Age Pages for technical and fun stuff (holiday specials, too)! http://pages.prodigy.net/feaudrey

Response:

You say that now, but just wait until the warrior-laden longships sail into YOUR harbor!

HA! They’re my ancient descendancy actually. Brothers. Alex

Response:

Crap what a sickeningly disrespectful reply! Troll-ette! NORWAY! AWESOME COUNTRY of a peaceful people! Alex

They did the best damn opening and closing shows of any Winter Olympics that I’ve ever seen. It was within the last 10 years.. awesome show. I’m so wanting to see it in person. robbielynn

Response:

Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking?

Yes but they cannot afford sandpaper so they use dried lutefish instead. Beats eating the stuff. … Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?

Last I heard, they did in Tromso. — FF

Response:

… Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access? Last I heard, they did in Tromso.

 out of 4.5 million norwegians there are 2.5 million internet accounts.  so I would say just about every family is hooked up. Jaap

Response:

… Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access? Last I heard, they did in Tromso.  out of 4.5 million norwegians there are 2.5 million internet accounts.  so I would say just about every family is hooked up. Jaap

No, there are only 5 Norwegians with internet access.  The rub is that each one of them has 500,000 internet accounts.

Response:

Yes but they cannot afford sandpaper so they use dried lutefish instead.

Can you dry it?   I thought the slime was a permanent feature. Beats eating the stuff.

Drown it in enough melted butter so you don’t taste it.   Wrap it in a bit of lefse. The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. scott

Response:

I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, I just returned from 10 days in the Norwegian fjiords….if that is poverty, how do I emigrate?  (minimum wage is approx $20. USD)

But how much does that $20 buy? — –John Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Response:

A Norwegian here once told me one of her favorite sayings: "Ten thousand Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian."

Wrong. That was :Ten thousand female virgin Swedes ran through the weeds, chased by one Norwegian with his Norwegian Wood." I once had a girl or should I say she once had me She showed me her room, isn’t it good Norwegian wood She asked me to stay and she told me to sit anywhere So I looked around and I noticed there wasn’t a chair I sat on a rug biding my time drinking her wine We talked until two and then she said: ‘It’s time for bed’ She told me she worked in the morning and started to laugh I told her I didn’t and crawled off to sleep in the bath And when I awoke I was alone, this bird had flown So I lit a fire, isn’t it good Norwegian wood   The Beatles

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it.

What about the Norwegian hottie that serves it? JP

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. What about the Norwegian hottie that serves it?

They’re all in Norway.   Hottie and Wisconsin don’t seem to go together. scott (alright, enough flames already).

Response:

The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it.

<rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g    – Mark

Response:

While lutefisk, and the prep thereof is disgusting, it isn’t, when served with the bacon and pea mush, not that bad. We experienced it on Crystal Harmony in 1994 at the Captain’s table, and when we were lucky enough the seated there again in 1995 on Crystal Symphony with the same Captain, we requested it again. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. <rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g    – Mark

Response:

Shut up, Chrissy, just shut the fuck up.

Response:

Trishia: Either you’re trying to be amusing and failing badly, or you know absolutely nothing about Norway. Norway, for example, is one of the richest countries in the entire world. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone out there from Norway? Just curious. JP I’m not from Norway, but reading your post made me think.  In a country as impoverished and unstable as Norway, do people still find time and resources to pursue such luxurious endeavors as woodworking? I understand it is quite natural and something of a psychological defense to divert oneself with some trivial game or other distraction during the final days before starvation, but woodworking seems rather an illogical conduit for this.  Actually, now that I think about it, does anyone in Norway even have internet access?  I would think with the state of things over there, there are a lot of other things they could spend their money on that would help them crawl closer towards third world status…

Response:

Shut up Dick. just shut the fuck up – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – While lutefisk, and the prep thereof is disgusting, it isn’t, when served with the bacon and pea mush, not that bad. We experienced it on Crystal Harmony in 1994 at the Captain’s table, and when we were lucky enough the seated there again in 1995 on Crystal Symphony with the same Captain, we requested it again. — DG in Cherry Hill, NJ The only good thing about a lutefisk dinner is the swedish meatballs, mashed potatoes and lefse! served along with it. <rerun "The Power of Lutefisk" http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~atman/ic/lutefisk.html </rerun <g   — Mark

Response:

Question:

Amortizing start-up costs over 5 years may be applicable in the US or other countries, but not in Canada so far as I know. I strongly agree that he should get some professional help immediately.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello,  I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions…  Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee?  Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements?  And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating?  Thanks in advance, Dipesh S. all these costs definitely go into the accounting records however some appear to be "start-up" costs and for tax purposes they are amortized over 5 years. The contributed or donated fixed assets and software is handled differently using fair market values and depreciated but since they were "personal" items before the business they also get special tax treatment!    It would be to your financial advantage to have some professional help setting up your business before you get much further —

Response:

Did not know he was located in Canada until I read his later post. — Regards, Mark X Rigotti

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Amortizing start-up costs over 5 years may be applicable in the US or other countries, but not in Canada so far as I know. I strongly agree that he should get some professional help immediately. Hello,  I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions…  Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee?  Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements?  And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating?  Thanks in advance, Dipesh S. all these costs definitely go into the accounting records however some appear to be "start-up" costs and for tax purposes they are amortized over 5 years. The contributed or donated fixed assets and software is handled differently using fair market values and depreciated but since they were "personal" items before the business they also get special tax treatment!    It would be to your financial advantage to have some professional help setting up your business before you get much further —

Response:

Get thyself to a CPA or EA STP (Sooner Than Possible) – specifically one familiar with Sections 351 & 357 of the Internal Revenus Code.  These sections cover the specific circumstances that you find yourself in. Basically, transferring assets and liabilities from personal to a corporation in a tax-free manner. This post does assume that you wish to accomplish this in a TAX FREE manner and not have to recognize DRY INCOME. — Regards, Mark X Rigotti

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello,  I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions…  Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee?  Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements?  And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating?  Thanks in advance, Dipesh S. — Using M2, Opera’s revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello,  I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions…  Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee?  Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements?  And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating?  Thanks in advance, Dipesh S.

all these costs definitely go into the accounting records however some appear to be "start-up" costs and for tax purposes they are amortized over 5 years. The contributed or donated fixed assets and software is handled differently using fair market values and depreciated but since they were "personal" items before the business they also get special tax treatment!    It would be to your financial advantage to have some professional help setting up your business before you get much further —

Response:

Hello,  I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions…  Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee?  Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements?  And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating?  Thanks in advance, Dipesh S. — Using M2, Opera’s revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Response:

You may want to tell everyone that you are in Canada or they may give answers that apply in the US but not Canada. Ima Goodlay —– – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hello, I’ve just incorporated earlier this year, however, I’m just a begginer in accounting (I’m using Simply Accounting). If someone can kindly answer the following questions… Do I include my incorporation costs in my accounting software & statements, including my name search (NUANS) fee? Prior to incorporating, I had a logo designed for my incorporated company. Are costs for logo design included in my accounting statements? And finally, how do I determine values (assets, I guess) for software and my computer for my newly incorporated company, especially since I’ve owned both before incorporating? Thanks in advance, Dipesh S. — Using M2, Opera’s revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Response:

Question:

I heard Teri Speak at a AHA convention where she said,"Some artists must paint, I must brew." — Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at www.listermann.com Free shipping for orders greater than $35 and East of the Mighty Miss.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Teri doesn’t actually brew these days.  She is the head brewer, but it’s more of a situation of vist the various locations and do quality checks. I thought that Teri Fahrendorf  was Steelhead’s head brewer. — Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at www.listermann.com Free shipping for orders greater than $35 and East of the Mighty Miss. I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. message Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss. I basically will be near both Airports… Mike, pick up a Celebrator Brewspaper and see what’s nearby. I don’t really know the Southbay too well. Los Gatos Brewing has some good beer and food; a bit pricey if I recall but I enjoyed it. Will you have access to a vehicle? Can you get to SF which is about 45 minutes north? If you can, you’ll have a lot more options. If you get to SF, you’ll want to drop by Toronado http://www.toronado.com/draft.htm

I’ve been meaning to hit the Tornado for years, and even had an idea to try and make the Barleywine Festival this year.  I doubt I have the time for the SF run, but you never know…;) Plenty of good brewpubs in the city too, like 21st Ammendment, Thirsty Bear, Steelhead, Magnolia and others. And call ahead to see if you can tour Anchor. Heck, I might join you if you can make it up this way.

I have a bit of time on Monday afternoon.  The plane hits SJ a little before noon, but I have to get to Fresno in one piece by bedtime…;) Cheers, Mike

Response:

I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Stoddard’s Brewhouse and Eatery.  There’s two; one in Sunnyvale (15 min. drive north, depending on the traffic) and the other in Campbell (a little closer but the one in Sunnyvale gets better reviews). Cheers! http://www.stoddardsbrew.com   (nayy)

Response:

Teri doesn’t actually brew these days.  She is the head brewer, but it’s more of a situation of vist the various locations and do quality checks. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I thought that Teri Fahrendorf  was Steelhead’s head brewer. — Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at www.listermann.com Free shipping for orders greater than $35 and East of the Mighty Miss. I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

If you can make it into San Francisco while you’re in the San Jose area, try the Gordon Biersch brewery and The Thirsty Bear brewery.

I can’t agree. Gordon Biersch’s Maerzen is OK but their other beers are disappointing. Thirsty Bear I think is middling at best. With the exception of 21st Amendment, I don’t think there are any SF brewpubs worth visiting. ben

Response:

I can’t agree. Gordon Biersch’s Maerzen is OK but their other beers are disappointing.

I was at the Gordon Beirsch in Columbus.  A big disappointment.  All the beers had a nasty dry finish. — Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at www.listermann.com Free shipping for orders greater than $35 and East of the Mighty Miss.

 Thirsty Bear I think is middling at best. With the – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – exception of 21st Amendment, I don’t think there are any SF brewpubs worth visiting. ben

Response:

You know you’re in for trouble with a GB beer when the descriptions for each beer note that the one they serve is a "lighter" version of the style. "Light" Bocks are not in my vocabulary. I’ll have to get a list of the breweries down your way. My parents gave me their time share condo in Coronado (a week every August). I know there is one close to Coronado and some in the Gas Light district but that’s all I know. Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think that RB started letting their brewers have some freedom. That’s why the beer at the Portland sight has improved so much. I just wasn’t sure if it have trickled down to the other locations. Same ol’ song-and-dnace here at the two Rock Bottom locations here in San Diego….. Very boring and "safe" beers on tap. GB was going to put a location in Portland at the renovated and soon to be trendy Henry Weinhard’s Brewery (which is now a building of condos and artsie fartsie shops).  I think the economy scared them off. Too bad, the poor reviews that they would have received after going up against Portland beers would have scared them into producing something super or going out of business. Since the country is short of craft lager breweries, it would have been nice to seem them straighten up. I agree with the logic of this, but unfortunately, it hasn’t really woked out that way in practice (at least in the greater San Diego area). There are three really great microbreweries (Alesmith, Stone, Ballast Point), and a dozen brewpubs, so while San Diego is no-where near a Portland or Seattle (craft beer-wise), there is still enough competition to force Gordon Birsch to pay attention. But alas, the local GB produces the *exact* same four dull beers that seemingly all of the other locations do, day-in and day-out (Marzen , Pilsner, Hefe, and Bock). {shrug} Their loss. My money easily goes elsewhere. Cheers, Todd Bissell Eye Chart Brewing Company "Beers So Bitter, Your Eyes Will Cross!" http://www.eyechartbrewing.com

Response:

I’ll have to get a list of the breweries down your way. My parents gave me their time share condo in Coronado (a week every August). I know there is one close to Coronado and some in the Gas Light district but that’s all I know.

No problem, drop me a line off-list (bis9170_at_cox_dot_net) when you’re getting ready to come down this way. If I’m in town, buy ya’ a beer too…! Cheers, Todd Bissell Eye Chart Brewing Company "Beers So Bitter, Your Eyes Will Cross!" http://www.eyechartbrewing.com

Response:

If you can make it into San Francisco while you’re in the San Jose area, try the Gordon Biersch brewery and The Thirsty Bear brewery.

I doubt I make it to SF, not enough time…. Cheers, Mike

Response:

Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up.

Thanks for the information and the invite, I doubt I will have time, but I’ll drop you a line, you never know…;) Cheers, Mike

Response:

I think that RB started letting their brewers have some freedom. That’s why the beer at the Portland sight has improved so much. I just wasn’t sure if it have trickled down to the other locations.

Same ol’ song-and-dnace here at the two Rock Bottom locations here in San Diego….. Very boring and "safe" beers on tap. GB was going to put a location in Portland at the renovated and soon to be trendy Henry Weinhard’s Brewery (which is now a building of condos and artsie fartsie shops).  I think the economy scared them off. Too bad, the poor reviews that they would have received after going up against Portland beers would have scared them into producing something super or going out of business. Since the country is short of craft lager breweries, it would have been nice to seem them straighten up.

I agree with the logic of this, but unfortunately, it hasn’t really woked out that way in practice (at least in the greater San Diego area). There are three really great microbreweries (Alesmith, Stone, Ballast Point), and a dozen brewpubs, so while San Diego is no-where near a Portland or Seattle (craft beer-wise), there is still enough competition to force Gordon Birsch to pay attention. But alas, the local GB produces the *exact* same four dull beers that seemingly all of the other locations do, day-in and day-out (Marzen , Pilsner, Hefe, and Bock). {shrug} Their loss. My money easily goes elsewhere. Cheers, Todd Bissell Eye Chart Brewing Company "Beers So Bitter, Your Eyes Will Cross!" http://www.eyechartbrewing.com

Response:

If you can make it into San Francisco while you’re in the San Jose area, try the Gordon Biersch brewery and The Thirsty Bear brewery. Thirsty Bear is pretty awesome, and the food absolutely fabulous as well! In fact I was cleaning up the living room a few hours ago and stumbled across a Thirsty Bear coaster that I hadn’t seen in a while. Gordon Biersch on the other hand I wasn’t very impressed with.  I had their beer at the airport and I guess it wasn’t bad but also wasn’t anything to wrote to mom about.

San Jose has a Gordon Biersch, as well.  I didn’t like their beer at all. Well, one was drinkable, but not memorable. Regards, Mike Sharp

Response:

It’s been a long time, but I thought that Tied House was pretty decent.  I’m with y’all about GB, though.  Maybe I got them on their "miss" night, but it was pretty crappy.  Crowded, though, so there’s no accounting for taste. RB might be mainstream yuppie, but the beer’s drinkable…at least up here in the PNW.  Not at the top of the pile, though. Regards, Mike Sharp

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports…

Mike, pick up a Celebrator Brewspaper and see what’s nearby. I don’t really know the Southbay too well. Los Gatos Brewing has some good beer and food; a bit pricey if I recall but I enjoyed it. Will you have access to a vehicle? Can you get to SF which is about 45 minutes north? If you can, you’ll have a lot more options. If you get to SF, you’ll want to drop by Toronado http://www.toronado.com/draft.htm Plenty of good brewpubs in the city too, like 21st Ammendment, Thirsty Bear, Steelhead, Magnolia and others. And call ahead to see if you can tour Anchor. Heck, I might join you if you can make it up this way.

Response:

I thought that Teri Fahrendorf  was Steelhead’s head brewer. — Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at www.listermann.com Free shipping for orders greater than $35 and East of the Mighty Miss.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

Plenty of good brewpubs in the city too, like 21st Ammendment, Thirsty Bear, Steelhead, Magnolia and others. And call ahead to see if you can tour Anchor.

Yeah, Magnolia has some great beers, as well.  Good food, too.  Pretty "full crunch granola" atmosphere if that matters to you one way or the  other  But again that’s way up in San Fran. Didn’t see anyone else mention the Fault Line yet down San Jose way, but everyone I’ve ever sent there has thanked me for it afterwards. cheers, -Alan

Response:

I think that RB started letting their brewers have some freedom. That’s why the beer at the Portland sight has improved so much. I just wasn’t sure if it have trickled down to the other locations. GB was going to put a location in Portland at the renovated and soon to be trendy Henry Weinhard’s Brewery (which is now a building of condos and artsie fartsie shops).  I think the economy scared them off. Too bad, the poor reviews that they would have received after going up against Portland beers would have scared them into producing something super or going out of business. Since the country is short of craft lager breweries, it would have been nice to seem them straighten up. Their garlic fries are great though. The rest of the food is good as well. Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been a long time, but I thought that Tied House was pretty decent. I’m with y’all about GB, though.  Maybe I got them on their "miss" night, but it was pretty crappy.  Crowded, though, so there’s no accounting for taste. RB might be mainstream yuppie, but the beer’s drinkable…at least up here in the PNW.  Not at the top of the pile, though. Regards, Mike Sharp I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

Faultline Brewpub is in there somewhere.  It’s just off Great America Parkway and I think that’s still San Jose.  Or maybe it’s Santa Clara at that point.  The food is absolutely incredible, and the beers are great, too. If you are driving along Great America away from the Great America theme park towards the highway (101?), drive up over the highway and the first set of lights take a right.  That’s the first non-highway set of lights because I seem to recall the onramps there have lights, too.  Anway, at the first set there are burger joints on each corner on your right and you turn right, driving between them basically. Immediately you hit a "T" so you turn right back towards the highway.  The road veers left and then drives along parallel to the highway, then veers left again so the highway is not behind you.  On this corner on the left is a motel/hotel – fairly nice one in fact in a largish complex, but only 2 story.  Then right after that is the Faultline (on the left) cheers, -Alan

Response:

the highway is not behind you.

"now" behind you

Response:

If you can make it into San Francisco while you’re in the San Jose area, try the Gordon Biersch brewery and The Thirsty Bear brewery. Beer here, Mike — **Remove the obvious when replying**

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss. I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

If you can make it into San Francisco while you’re in the San Jose area, try the Gordon Biersch brewery and The Thirsty Bear brewery.

Thirsty Bear is pretty awesome, and the food absolutely fabulous as well! In fact I was cleaning up the living room a few hours ago and stumbled across a Thirsty Bear coaster that I hadn’t seen in a while. Gordon Biersch on the other hand I wasn’t very impressed with.  I had their beer at the airport and I guess it wasn’t bad but also wasn’t anything to wrote to mom about. cheers, -Alan

Response:

Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

I should  add that if the Stealhead in Palo Alto is anything like it’s brother in Eugene, it’s definitely makes the list of place to find good beer. Years ago, it was another GB or RB but I think the SH hired a head brewer that oversees all locations now. Denny or Matt, comments? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’d take Bob up on that offer. There isn’t much in the SJ area. GB and RB are both yuppy eateries that sell mediocre beers at best. On the way up to Bob’s hit Pacific Coast. One of the few, if not only, extract breweries yet worthy of a visit. The service sucks and the food is ok but you’re there for the beer, right? Burp, -Dan — Replace "nospam" with msn to send me email. Downtown San Jose is about 5 minutes from the airport. Go ahead and try Tied House in San Pedro Square. The beers are good but, the food is so-so. Also real close is Gordon Biersh. I haven’t been in there in a long while but, what I remember the beer is hit and miss. I think my favorites were Export and Marzen and the latter is hit an miss. Down in Campbell which is down Highway 17 get off the exit for Pruneyard and Rock Bottom Brewery is there. Solid beers although not allot of choices but the food is pretty good. Orrrr if you have a rental car and want to venture about 35 minutes east of San Jose that’s where I live in a town named Livermore. The wife is a gourmet cook getting a catering business off the ground and I have 12 beers and 4 meads on tap e-mail me directly if you’d like to hook up. Brewer Bob I have a very hastily put together trip next week to Fresno, and then to San Jose.  Are there any places of note in the area I should try not to miss.  I basically will be near both Airports… Cheers, Mike

Response:

Question:

Bill, I was commenting on United as an international carrier and not referring to US domestic routes. I have every sympathy for the tens of thousands of US employees that will be out of work soon but I have nothing but contempt for the multiple tiers of United management that have miss-managed the airline for some many years and gained millions from so doing.   They spent millions on Mission statements and other b***s**t and never read them and as you pointed out, their food and service is crap compared with other international carriers and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to second Jack. I haven’t flown on United since 1994. While I had some bad experiences on other airlines, those were minor compared to terrible experiences I had on United. It is often said that price is all that matters to flyers, so the airlines have no choice but to offer bad service. But its not entirely true. While the accountants at many organizations often try to mandate use of the lowest fares, there are often loopholes. Sufficiently motivated flyers like myself can find ways to avoid United. I think that Jack is right: there are millions of flyers who try to avoid United. In order to counteract this, United is forced to cut its prices to levels where it cannot make a profit. Christofer’s response, that bad service is particular to the U.S., is nonsense. When my foreign friends complain about American food, I say "When you come to the U.S., don’t eat the bad food, eat the good food." So don’t fly on United, fly on Midwest Express (and I have generally had good experiences on American Airlines). Once regarded among the most prestigious airliner, United Airlines now is facing a plunge motion into bankruptcy. Why? While the answer isn?t simple, one aspect of UA that has been a part of the cause is CUSTOMER SERVICE. I have seen an enormous amount of complaints and I myself have countless unpleasant experiences from rude and unprofessional ground crew as well as FAs. Not all of FAs are "bad" but enough of the "bad apples" that can bring a negative public opinion towards the crew. The ground crew is by far the worst, however. Because of the poor service, I have been avoiding UA as much as I can and I am sure millions have done the same. Consequently, UA has driven itself into the trouble it is in now. The management has been disconnected with the customers? needs and its policies tend to piss lots of people off. So, here we are, listening in the news of the inevitable consequences. When will the "big" corporations learn they can never be too big to care about customers and too powerful to be above the laws of nature? For the case with UA, where is the good o?friendly sky?

Response:

written: [ Snip ] …and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express.

But *every* airline is crap when compared with Midwest Express. Malc.

Response:

In article written: [ Snip ] …and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express. But *every* airline is crap when compared with Midwest Express.

Question but have you flown them inthe past few weeks?  Seats might be good but they did revise their meal service policy – not for the better as far as travellers go.

Response:

From airline of the year in 1999, to crap in 2002, Delta now is going to create a sub-airline within an airline, dumping Delta Express, and transferring 36 of their Boeing 757’s, reconfigured to seat 199 passengers in coach class on short haul runs. Concentrating on the North East, NYC, Boston, MCO routes.

Delta, recognizing the success of Eastern Airlines, is creating this branch to fly the sort of routes that Eastern, and also US Airways, specialized in. Hopping up and down the east coast.

Response:

SNIP Now, since the employees own 55% of the airline, they in essence control the board of directors, and by extension, control how the airline is run.  Therefore, it is the employees who actually run the company by they way the control the management.  It is ultimately the employees that choose how much to compensate management, and the employees who tolerated the "miss-management" of the company. So who is really at fault in this circle?

Kinda makes you laugh.  Employee ownership sure has done wonders, hasn’t it? Rich — Visit America’s Aviation Headquarters: www.usaviation.com

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think that Jack is right: there are millions of flyers who try to avoid United. And there are million who avoid AA, Delta, Continental etc. The larger the airline, the more problems it will have and the more complaints it will receive. But what percentage of customers are happy vs unhappy ? That would be the metric. The one area where an airline can be different is in its scheduling which may cause huge logjams at airports such as ORD. If they get all the flighst to land at the same time, stay on ground for 2 hours and then depart at the same time, it not only makes the plane utilisation very poor, but by creating a huge "rush hour" at the airport, it makes for a less pleasurable experience by the customer, and when problems arise, there are just way too manyt people at the airport for the UA staff to deal with the problem in a nice, efficient way. This doesn’t mean that ORD cannot remain a hub, it just means that they have to change their hub philosophy: the airport should be the hub, not the parked planes. Planes should land and depart ASAP, and pax should then wait in the airport for their next flight, instead of planes waiting for folks to transfer from one flight to another. (eg: rolling hub which AA is thinking about).

The problems that I was referring to, and that have kept me off of UA since 1994, are not just airport delays. Numerous arrivals a day late when UA cancelled flights that were less than full, and overseas trips that turned into a hell week of sleep deprivation and standing in lines. There was a class trip out of Wisconsin to Europe on UA. The kids spent several days being flown around to various US airports and finally just returned home without ever getting to Europe. If you freak out in these situations, you’ll just end up in the custody of the air marshalls. The only thing you can do is promise yourself to never, never, NEVER fly on UA again. Bill

Response:

written: [ Snip ] …and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express.

But *every* airline is crap when compared with Midwest Express. Malc.

Response:

In article written: [ Snip ] …and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express. But *every* airline is crap when compared with Midwest Express.

Question but have you flown them inthe past few weeks?  Seats might be good but they did revise their meal service policy – not for the better as far as travellers go.

Response:

I think that Jack is right: there are millions of flyers who try to avoid United.

And there are million who avoid AA, Delta, Continental etc. The larger the airline, the more problems it will have and the more complaints it will receive. But what percentage of customers are happy vs unhappy ? That would be the metric. The one area where an airline can be different is in its scheduling which may cause huge logjams at airports such as ORD. If they get all the flighst to land at the same time, stay on ground for 2 hours and then depart at the same time, it not only makes the plane utilisation very poor, but by creating a huge "rush hour" at the airport, it makes for a less pleasurable experience by the customer, and when problems arise, there are just way too manyt people at the airport for the UA staff to deal with the problem in a nice, efficient way. This doesn’t mean that ORD cannot remain a hub, it just means that they have to change their hub philosophy: the airport should be the hub, not the parked planes. Planes should land and depart ASAP, and pax should then wait in the airport for their next flight, instead of planes waiting for folks to transfer from one flight to another. (eg: rolling hub which AA is thinking about).

Response:

From airline of the year in 1999, to crap in 2002, Delta now is going to create a sub-airline within an airline, dumping Delta Express, and transferring 36 of their Boeing 757’s, reconfigured to seat 199 passengers in coach class on short haul runs. Concentrating on the North East, NYC, Boston, MCO routes. Direct competition with South West, ATA and Jet Blue. But, remember this is Delta – whose customer service has gone in the dumpers never to be restored. Looks like United Airlines, an employee-owned airline, is following the same path. Government turned down their request for loan guarantee, so bankruptcy looms. Delta, American, United, Continental, U.S. Air, none of them offer us anything more than the commuter airlines offer anyway, so why take them anyplace? Emphasis on flying is turnaround time, and getting there, the business has changed radically, and the majors can’t compete with the commuter airlines anymore.

Response:

… I have nothing but contempt for the multiple tiers of United management that have miss-managed the airline for some many years and gained millions from so doing.  

Some people get a certain Kafkaesque satisfaction out of the recursive nature of the UAL organization.   You blame the management of the airline, and suggest they have run away with millions, of dollars, I presume.  Yet management policies, and compensation, only exist with the consent and support of the airline’s board of directors. If the board is unhappy with the way the airline is run, they have the power to adjust compensation, or replace the management entirely, if they choose. Now, since the employees own 55% of the airline, they in essence control the board of directors, and by extension, control how the airline is run.  Therefore, it is the employees who actually run the company by they way the control the management.  It is ultimately the employees that choose how much to compensate management, and the employees who tolerated the "miss-management" of the company. So who is really at fault in this circle?

Response:

Bill, I was commenting on United as an international carrier and not referring to US domestic routes. I have every sympathy for the tens of thousands of US employees that will be out of work soon but I have nothing but contempt for the multiple tiers of United management that have miss-managed the airline for some many years and gained millions from so doing.   They spent millions on Mission statements and other b***s**t and never read them and as you pointed out, their food and service is crap compared with other international carriers and crap when compared to domestic US carries like Midwest Express.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to second Jack. I haven’t flown on United since 1994. While I had some bad experiences on other airlines, those were minor compared to terrible experiences I had on United. It is often said that price is all that matters to flyers, so the airlines have no choice but to offer bad service. But its not entirely true. While the accountants at many organizations often try to mandate use of the lowest fares, there are often loopholes. Sufficiently motivated flyers like myself can find ways to avoid United. I think that Jack is right: there are millions of flyers who try to avoid United. In order to counteract this, United is forced to cut its prices to levels where it cannot make a profit. Christofer’s response, that bad service is particular to the U.S., is nonsense. When my foreign friends complain about American food, I say "When you come to the U.S., don’t eat the bad food, eat the good food." So don’t fly on United, fly on Midwest Express (and I have generally had good experiences on American Airlines). Once regarded among the most prestigious airliner, United Airlines now is facing a plunge motion into bankruptcy. Why? While the answer isn?t simple, one aspect of UA that has been a part of the cause is CUSTOMER SERVICE. I have seen an enormous amount of complaints and I myself have countless unpleasant experiences from rude and unprofessional ground crew as well as FAs. Not all of FAs are "bad" but enough of the "bad apples" that can bring a negative public opinion towards the crew. The ground crew is by far the worst, however. Because of the poor service, I have been avoiding UA as much as I can and I am sure millions have done the same. Consequently, UA has driven itself into the trouble it is in now. The management has been disconnected with the customers? needs and its policies tend to piss lots of people off. So, here we are, listening in the news of the inevitable consequences. When will the "big" corporations learn they can never be too big to care about customers and too powerful to be above the laws of nature? For the case with UA, where is the good o?friendly sky?

Response:

management, poor service, arrogance, all the usual US attributes.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Once regarded among the most prestigious airliner, United Airlines now is facing a plunge motion into bankruptcy. Why? While the answer isn’t simple, one aspect of UA that has been a part of the cause is CUSTOMER SERVICE. I have seen an enormous amount of complaints and I myself have countless unpleasant experiences from rude and unprofessional ground crew as well as FAs. Not all of FAs are "bad" but enough of the "bad apples" that can bring a negative public opinion towards the crew. The ground crew is by far the worst, however. Because of the poor service, I have been avoiding UA as much as I can and I am sure millions have done the same. Consequently, UA has driven itself into the trouble it is in now. The management has been disconnected with the customers’ needs and its policies tend to piss lots of people off. So, here we are, listening in the news of the inevitable consequences. When will the "big" corporations learn they can never be too big to care about customers and too powerful to be above the laws of nature? For the case with UA, where is the good o’friendly sky?

Response:

I want to second Jack. I haven’t flown on United since 1994. While I had some bad experiences on other airlines, those were minor compared to terrible experiences I had on United. It is often said that price is all that matters to flyers, so the airlines have no choice but to offer bad service. But its not entirely true. While the accountants at many organizations often try to mandate use of the lowest fares, there are often loopholes. Sufficiently motivated flyers like myself can find ways to avoid United. I think that Jack is right: there are millions of flyers who try to avoid United. In order to counteract this, United is forced to cut its prices to levels where it cannot make a profit. Christofer’s response, that bad service is particular to the U.S., is nonsense. When my foreign friends complain about American food, I say "When you come to the U.S., don’t eat the bad food, eat the good food." So don’t fly on United, fly on Midwest Express (and I have generally had good experiences on American Airlines). – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Once regarded among the most prestigious airliner, United Airlines now is facing a plunge motion into bankruptcy. Why? While the answer isn?t simple, one aspect of UA that has been a part of the cause is CUSTOMER SERVICE. I have seen an enormous amount of complaints and I myself have countless unpleasant experiences from rude and unprofessional ground crew as well as FAs. Not all of FAs are "bad" but enough of the "bad apples" that can bring a negative public opinion towards the crew. The ground crew is by far the worst, however. Because of the poor service, I have been avoiding UA as much as I can and I am sure millions have done the same. Consequently, UA has driven itself into the trouble it is in now. The management has been disconnected with the customers? needs and its policies tend to piss lots of people off. So, here we are, listening in the news of the inevitable consequences. When will the "big" corporations learn they can never be too big to care about customers and too powerful to be above the laws of nature? For the case with UA, where is the good o?friendly sky?

Response:

Once regarded among the most prestigious airliner, United Airlines now is facing a plunge motion into bankruptcy. Why? While the answer isn

Question:

Hello all, I recently installed a couple of new phone jacks.  It’s a small house so I just ran wire from the interface doo-hickie.  Jacks work fine but when I went to test them with my line tester it said they were reversed polarity. I didn’t wire them wrong and sure enough every jack in the house is reversed.  Is there any reason not  to simply reverse the two wires that lead to the main interface from which all the individual wires run.  I’ve read that reversed polarity can screw up modems, etc.  Any ideas would be helpful. Thanks, Nathan —

Response:

I recently installed a couple of new phone jacks.  It’s a small house so I just ran wire from the interface doo-hickie.  Jacks work fine but when I went to test them with my line tester it said they were reversed polarity. I didn’t wire them wrong and sure enough every jack in the house is reversed.  Is there any reason not  to simply reverse the two wires that lead to the main interface from which all the individual wires run.  I’ve read that reversed polarity can screw up modems, etc.  

It also makes it impossible to dial out.  Sounds like your tester needs to be reversed.

Response:

Reversed polarity doesn’t cause any dial out problems.  I clip onto lines all week long in my job, and make test calls, etc.  Many times I am reversed.  Your modem will work fine too.  It’s not right to leave it this way though, and things are for a reason, though typically you will not see a problem.   If every one in your house is coming up wrong, you can absolutely revers the red and green from the interface box (customer premises side) and you will be just fine and fix your issue. Have fun Chris – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I recently installed a couple of new phone jacks.  It’s a small house so I just ran wire from the interface doo-hickie.  Jacks work fine but when I went to test them with my line tester it said they were reversed polarity. I didn’t wire them wrong and sure enough every jack in the house is reversed.  Is there any reason not  to simply reverse the two wires that lead to the main interface from which all the individual wires run.  I’ve read that reversed polarity can screw up modems, etc.   It also makes it impossible to dial out.  Sounds like your tester needs to be reversed.

Response:

Reversed polarity doesn’t cause any dial out problems.

It does here in NYC.  I discovered it by accident 15 years ago.  If you reverse the polarity, the phone’s buttons won’t generate a tone, of at least it won’t on the old Bell phones. However incoming calls work fine.  I don’t have a clue why it does this but I used it for years in my old recording studio to enforce an "incoming only" phone in the control room.

Response:

I recently installed a couple of new phone jacks.  It’s a small house so I just ran wire from the interface doo-hickie. Jacks work fine but when I went to test them with my line tester it said they were reversed polarity. I’ve read that reversed polarity can screw up modems, etc. It also makes it impossible to dial out.  Sounds like your tester needs to be reversed.

Very little modern equipment is polarity sensitive. The old 2500 sets were polarity sensitive, and would not dial with reversed polarity. In the olden days when touch-tone dialing was a premium service, you could get 2500’s to work by reversing your own service lines – that was often the trick Ma Bell used to force you to pay up for the service. I haven’t run into any phones that cared about polarity in a long time, and while there might be a few high speed modems that care, it’s unlikely. Most equipment doesn’t draw power from the DC on the line as older equipment did (and thus is protected or doesn’t care). Also: Are you *sure* the polarity is reversed? In the bizarro world of Bell, the tip (green) is positive with respect to the ring (red). Between each wire and a good earth ground, green will be slightly positive and red will be about 48 volts negative. (This drops to about 6 volts when a phone is off the hook on the circuit. Hope that helps. — |   See http://www.nitrosyncretic.com for the Heinlein FAQ & more   |

Response:

Reversed polarity doesn’t cause any dial out problems.

Just to show that I haven’t been sniffin’ glue: http://hyperarchive.lcs.mit.edu/telecom-archives/TELECOM_Digest_Onlin… http://www.ale.org/archive/ale/ale-2000-12/msg00305.html I’m told that most modern phones have a polarity senser to correct polarity problems automatically.

Response:

Very little modern equipment is polarity sensitive. The old 2500 sets were polarity sensitive, and would not dial with reversed polarity.

Yeah, that’s how I tested the polarity when I home ran new phone lines in my house.  I love those old Bell phones.

Response:

Reversed polarity doesn’t cause any dial out problems. I’m told that most modern phones have a polarity senser to correct polarity problems automatically.

In most cases, it’s just a diode bridge to ensure that the polarity enters the phone correctly. And those are only found in phones that draw their operating power from the line, which are increasingly uncommon. — |   See http://www.nitrosyncretic.com for the Heinlein FAQ & more   |

Response:

Also: Are you *sure* the polarity is reversed? In the bizarro world of Bell, the tip (green) is positive with respect to the ring (red). Between each wire and a good earth ground, green will be slightly positive and red will be about 48 volts negative. (This drops to about 6 volts when a phone is off the hook on the circuit.

It’s not so bizarre.  Telephone circuits are typically 48 volts positive ground.  Having a negative potential on the lines reduces oxydation.

Response:

Also: Are you *sure* the polarity is reversed? In the bizarro world of Bell, the tip (green) is positive with respect to the ring (red). It’s not so bizarre.  Telephone circuits are typically 48 volts positive ground.  Having a negative potential on the lines reduces oxydation.

Yeah, sure. The basic elements of telephone signals are probably the oldest "new" technology still in use, and they are bass-ackward and upside down from most newer implementations of similar technology. The polarity of local telephone loops has no real justification; it’s just how it was designed almost a hundred years ago. The bit about reducing oxidation is post hoc. Just like the order of keys on a touch-tone pad. If you ask, you’ll be told that time-and-motion studies proved this layout (key 1 upper left) was somehow easier, faster, etc. Which is BS. It was designed that way because the design devolved to one senior Bell engineer, whose only instruction was "don’t make it look like a desk calculator." (Old-style electric desk calculators were universal on desktops in the 1940s and later. They have the same pattern as modern calculators, with 1 in the bottom left. Bell was concerned that the new touch-tone phones would be confused with calculators or that unfavorable comparisons would be made, hence the design imperative…) — |   See http://www.nitrosyncretic.com for the Heinlein FAQ & more   |

Response:

It does here in NYC.  I discovered it by accident 15 years ago.  If you reverse the polarity, the phone’s buttons won’t generate a tone, This only applies to antiques.

Antiques, maybe.  But two of my antiques are still in service and going strong despite countless drops.  I’ve never had to replace the handset cables, never had to change the batteries, never heard a drop out, click or chainsaw noise.  Unfortunately, I can’t say the same for the modern phones I’ve bought since.  Bring ‘em back, I say.

Response:

  I recently installed a couple of new phone jacks.  It’s a small   house so I just ran wire from the interface doo-hickie.  Jacks work   fine but when I went to test them with my line tester it said they   were reversed polarity. I didn’t wire them wrong and sure enough   every jack in the house is reversed.  Is there any reason not  to   simply reverse the two wires that lead to the main interface from   which all the individual wires run.  I’ve read that reversed   polarity can screw up modems, etc.  Any ideas would be helpful.   What kind of telephone service drop or lateral do you have? Single pair airiel service drops have a ridge on one side to indicate the ring side of the pair. The terms tip, ring, and sleeve come from the parts of a 1/4" phone plug that was used to connect calls on manual switch boards.  These plugs are identical to the ones to be found on stereo head phones with 1/4" plugs. Multi pair cable will be color coded to indicate tip and ring.  In most service drop or lateral cables to single family residences the wires having a white color with a colored stripe will be the ring conductor. The wire having a solid color with or without a white stripe will be the tip conductor.  The metal cable jacket in underground cabling will be the sleeve or earth ground conductor. Four wire "JK" station wire should have the tip on the green and the ring on the red.  If there is a second line in the station wire the tip will be on the black and the ring on the yellow. The rhyme that outside plant trainees were taught was "the ring is ridged or red, readable to ground, and terminates on the right". "Readable to ground" means that you can measure forty eight volts DC between the ring and earth ground with all instruments on hook. The ring side of the pair should be forty eight volts positive relative to earth ground potential.  The tip side of the pair will be at or close to ground potential.  When touch tone service was first offered it was a premium service for which customers were charged an additional fee. Those customers who did not purchase it had there pair reversed at the exchange so that the polarity sensitive touch pads would not work.  This practice has long since been abandoned but many reversed polarity pairs remain in service. If you have an interior point at which all of your station wires are terminated then the simplest thing is to flop the lead between that point and the NID.  If all of your station wires terminate directly to the NID customer terminals then you will have to reverse them all. — Tom

Response:

    It does here in NYC.  I discovered it by accident 15 years ago.  If   you reverse the polarity, the phone’s buttons won’t generate a tone,   of at least it won’t on the old Bell phones. However incoming calls   work fine.  I don’t have a clue why it does this but I used it for   years in my old recording studio to enforce an "incoming only" phone   in the control room.     The first touch tone phones were made by western electric.  Reversed polarity was used to prevent customers from using touch tone phones on lines that were not paying for touch tone service.  Modern telephones use bridge rectifiers to supply power to the touch pad and are unaffected by reverse polarity. — Tom

Response:

Snip   Just like the order of keys on a touch-tone pad. If you ask, you’ll   be told that time-and-motion studies proved this layout (key 1   upper left) was somehow easier, faster, etc. Which is BS. It was   designed that way because the design devolved to one senior Bell   engineer, whose only instruction was "don’t make it look like a   desk calculator."     (Old-style electric desk calculators were universal on desktops in   the 1940s and later. They have the same pattern as modern   calculators, with 1 in the bottom left. Bell was concerned that the    new touch-tone phones would be confused with calculators or that   unfavorable comparisons would be made, hence the design   imperative…)   The first touch pads were identical to electric calculators.  They sere used by operators not customers. Operators who had secretarial or accounting experience would dial faster than the electro mechanical equipment of there day could handle.  The pad pattern was changed to force the operators to slow down to a speed that the equipment could manage.  My great uncle was working in the office were the redesign was done and that really is the reason. — Tom

Response:

Question:

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Response:

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Question:

I think you CAN do that! If you only need to use one line, more lines might be a problem. Look in your help file under customized invoice – FOOTER info. You can show just totals in the Footer and hide the individual line items of the invoice. Another possibility is to run non-printing invoices for the orders followed by a printed statement as the final bill. Your Statement description of the applicable invoice could be chinese food! TTUL Gary

Response:

Thanks Karl, I’ll have to do some experimenting, but I think this will take care of what I want.  I hadn’t looked at groups before. I use Managing Your Money for my personal finances.  Groups in that software are merely a way to control how your accounts/items are displayed in drop down lists & reports.  More or less an outline hierarchy.  I had assumed it was the same in QB. I appreciate the help. Before you buy.

Response:

Take a look at setting up a group item. The individual items in the group will be the screen, but only the group subtotal prints on the invoice. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (also posted on the Quicken.com small business message board & biz.comp.accounting, but I haven’t gotten a response there) I’m trying to set my parents’ business up on QuickBooks 2000 Pro. A critical business function is the ability to print summarized invoices, w/o printing the itemized details.  They need to preserve the detail for their own reference, but don’t want to disclose the itemized charges to the customer. I experimented w/ customized invoices & subtotals, but couldn’t ever get it to work. I’ve talked to the QB helpdesk folks & they said it couldn’t be done. However, the people I talked to admitted that they were sales folks, not technical wizards. The only suggestion they had was to generate a statement for each invoice, but they said we’d only be able to get one line for each invoice.  That won’t work because they need a limited level of detail on whatever the customer sees. Basically, they want a line for labor, a line for material, & a line for misc. charges.  The labor isn’t a time multipllier, it’s based on per unit charges that variy based on what the customer wants. Can QB2K do this? Before you buy.

Response:

Gary, Thanks for the response, but I don’t think this is quite what I’m looking for. Your solution hides columns, not rows.  Your customer still sees a line for each item that you put on the invoice. I need to only print subtotals & hide the detail that rolls into the subtotals.  Right now, I have items set up from a menu of services that they provide.  The charges that roll into the subtotal are not a multiplier from the cost, they are the sum of individual items from the menu. Customized invoices can hide columns or sections of the invoice, but I haven’t found any way to only print subtotals. e.g. Let’s assume this is a Chinese Food restaurant & a customer wants chicken-chow-mein w/ extra chicken.  When building the invoice, you’ll items). I want the screen to display: chicken-chow-mein                    $5.99 extra chicken                        $1.99 total                                $7.98 But on the printed invoice, I only want one line that shows: Chinese food                         $7.98 Before you buy.

Response:

Hi Shelton Yes you can! By creating a custom template first, then editing it’s print columns. I literally pulled my hair out over a problem where I had to move an asset to COGS using the sale receipt, but I didn’t want the customer to see my COGS naturally. I wasn’t a wizard enough to pull this off, but a fellow down at the local SBA office could and created a couple of templates for me that fit exactly what I was doing perfectly. Basically, it is printing an itemized invoice with three columns. The first column shows my costs, the second a multiplier or fixed dollar profit amount and the third column is the total. Now when I print the form to give to a customer, the first two number columns are set to non-print, so the final printed form only shows the numbers I want the customer to see. In my case, because the two lines (asset line and COGS line) must be on the invoice and can’t be removed, not having the numbers appear on the printed invoice is OK with me.  I really which you could kill a printed item line but you can’t do it that way. Just play with templates and I’m sure you will figure it out.  If not, hunt down a guru like I did, hi hi….. TTUL Gary

Response:

(also posted on the Quicken.com small business message board & biz.comp.accounting, but I haven’t gotten a response there) I’m trying to set my parents’ business up on QuickBooks 2000 Pro. A critical business function is the ability to print summarized invoices, w/o printing the itemized details.  They need to preserve the detail for their own reference, but don’t want to disclose the itemized charges to the customer. I experimented w/ customized invoices & subtotals, but couldn’t ever get it to work. I’ve talked to the QB helpdesk folks & they said it couldn’t be done. However, the people I talked to admitted that they were sales folks, not technical wizards. The only suggestion they had was to generate a statement for each invoice, but they said we’d only be able to get one line for each invoice.  That won’t work because they need a limited level of detail on whatever the customer sees. Basically, they want a line for labor, a line for material, & a line for misc. charges.  The labor isn’t a time multipllier, it’s based on per unit charges that variy based on what the customer wants. Can QB2K do this? Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

If one is to accept the Jesus knew what he was talking about, the whole idea that he rose on Sunday morning is open to debate. Jesus says in  Matthew 12:40, that he will be in the grave for three days and three nights. This is in turn repeated in Matthew 20:17-19, Mark 10: 32-34, and Luke 18: 31-34, which all mention the three days. We also know that he had to be in the ground before dark on the day of the crucifixation. So regardless of how you calculate it, he would have to rise just at dusk on the third day. As Mary went down on Sunday morning, the first day of the week, and the grave was empty, it is possible that he arose at dusk on Saturday night. Now, lets have a Catholic explain what Jesus is saying in Matthew 12:40. Did he or did he not know what he was talking about. And please don’t give me this weird argument that three days and three nights really meant something else. Ever since Genesis, when God made the darkness and the light the first day, a day and a night have been that, darkness and light.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If one is to accept the Jesus knew what he was talking about, the whole idea that he rose on Sunday morning is open to debate. Jesus says in  Matthew 12:40, that he will be in the grave for three days and three nights. This is in turn repeated in Matthew 20:17-19, Mark 10: 32-34, and Luke 18: 31-34, which all mention the three days. We also know that he had to be in the ground before dark on the day of the crucifixation. So regardless of how you calculate it, he would have to rise just at dusk on the third day. As Mary went down on Sunday morning, the first day of the week, and the grave was empty, it is possible that he arose at dusk on Saturday night. Now, lets have a Catholic explain what Jesus is saying in Matthew 12:40. Did he or did he not know what he was talking about. And please don’t give me this weird argument that three days and three nights really meant something else. Ever since Genesis, when God made the darkness and the light the first day, a day and a night have been that, darkness and light.

Jesus spoke to some disciples on the road to Emmaus. The disciples said to Jesus:" The chief priests and our rulers handed him over to be sentenced to death, and they crucified him…..it is the third day since all this took place." The third day from Sunday afternoon brings us to Thursday night, the beginning of his passion.  How can you reconcile this to your theory? If one reads carefully, Matthew,Mark and Luke all reads exactly the same. After three days, from having been betrayed to the chief priests and the teachers of the law, after being mocked and flogged and finaly killed, he will rise up.All of this is considered to be his passion, not only his crucifixion. Therefore Matthew 12:40 must also mean more than his death. In fact, you have misquoted the scriptures, for it does not read he will be in the "grave" but in the "belly of the earth". The belly of the earth represents hades, where the souls of the departed rests, where as the grave means the place for the dead body. Jesus could have gone to hades prior to having been killed; in fact, as a catholic, the last supper, being one with the sacrifice of the cross, must have been a revelation to those in hades concerning their redemption to come. Andre

Response:

If one is to accept the Jesus knew what he was talking about, the whole idea that he rose on Sunday morning is open to debate. Jesus says in  Matthew 12:40, that he will be in the grave for three days and three nights. This is in turn repeated in Matthew 20:17-19, Mark 10: 32-34, and Luke 18: 31-34, which all mention the three days. We also know that he had to be in the ground before dark on the day of the crucifixation. So regardless of how you calculate it, he would have to rise just at dusk on the third day.

The way that *we* calculate a day is different from the way that the ancient Jews did.  Before clocks were invented, a day *began* at sunset….a day was counted as a night and the following day.  That is why the Jewish Sabbath (which we consider as Saturday) actually begins on Friday night. With this accounting, consider: –Thursday night was the beginning of the "day" that Jesus was crucified (day one) — Friday night began the day after Jesus died–the second day of His death, since he was dead before the end of the day (day two) –Saturday night began the third day that Jesus was dead (day three)…which is probably the reason why the Mass of Holy Saturday is also the Mass of the Resurrection, since it is the beginning of the day on which He arose…. So yes, Jesus arose on the third day…. Buny

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Question:

between moments of lucidity.  However, Randi’s refusal to sign Benneth’s application form before (and if) they go to bat could be construed as a dodge. I don’t know what a lawyer would say. Well, I do. The Challenge is a unilateral contract. It’s kind of an unusual insrument, if you can call it that. I call it b’llsh’t. Anyway, there’s no clear legal recourse until he signs it as far as I can see, and it really takes an expert on unilaterals to tell us what it is, and even then, what kind of an agreement is it really? And what’s it’s jurisdiction? All I have

Are you saying that you’ve sought legal counsel (or done your own research) and have been told or learned that there’s no legal guarantee that if you win the preliminary according to the mutually agreed upon protocol that Alain and Randi are working on — including the homeopathic pharmacist and trusty NIST biochemist, the cameras, the accounting firm, et al. — that Randi will be legally bound to negotiate a final trial with you?  This is the exact opposite of what Mona, a lawyer, is insisting to be the case. from Randi are about five or six dozen e-mails from the man either to me or about me, and all derogatory or threats to humiliate me. In one he types to me an angry sounding letter in ALL CAPS and  commands me to F*CK OFF. Now why does he have to act so hostile if he’s got a valid offer?      And here’s more questions:

I’ve been tempted to type those words to you myself, and I’ve only been on the receiving end of a fraction of the venom you’ve directed at Randi.       NAME ONE APPLICANT HE’S EVER TESTED.

Why should it really matter as far as *your* case is concerned?  I do have the name and ph. number of the homeopath (or his secretary; I can’t remember) he tested, BTW — I got it from Randi — and when I offered to share it with you a few months ago, you basically said "who cares?"       WHO AT GOLDMAN SACHS WILL VERIFY THE AWARD?

Have you actually phoned or faxed the GS numbers given on the application form you signed?       WHY CAN’T WE SEE THE RECORDS OF PREVIOUS TRIALS IF THERE ARE ANY?

That would be highly desirable, but why should it prevent you from pursuing your shot at the Challenge?       WHY WON’T RANDI SIGN HIS OWN CHALLENGE?

I’d also like to know; but it would seem his signature isn’t required on this "unilateral contract" for it to be enforceable.      If all the answers to these questions is so easy, then why is he hiding them?

I don’t know why he’s hiding "most* of them (where’s the secrecy about Goldman Sachs, for instance?), but again, if you’re legally protected and can agree on a protocol that gives you a fair chance to prove your ability, what’s the problem? Why let these details deter you from moving in for the kill?       SYd, I’ve been screaming about this for over half a year now. After a while it’s gets to be funny and I actually start feeling sorry for him.  So what’s left to do but clown around until he wakes up from the smell of his reputation in flames? Really, if he wants me to act sensibly, then he could start the ball rolling by simply typing a few names so we could check this out. ANd why is he Maybe if he thinks I’m a crazy fool it will give him the needed confidence and schedule a test of my claims. But of course, that would mean he’d have to sign the paper, wouldn’t it? And he won’t do tthat, will he? He’s never done it before, and he’ll never do it ever.       But maybe you can work on him to endorse my proposal to open testing       up to the schools using my oat test and the Jones/Jenkins Yeast test. http://www.marius.net/yeast.html

He is so gonna like that idea, don’t ya know! At this point I’ve given up any hope of getting my million bucks from his cheap carney act inthe way he’s suggested it can’t be done, so what do I have to lose by revealing my methods? Let a bunch of little school kids validate my claims. What could be better? Besides, I got other ways of doing this he hasn’t even dreamed of yet.      WHERE"S MY MILLION RANDI? I GOT YOUR PROOF BOTH LIVING AND MECHANICAL, RIGHT HERE.  . . . COME AND GET IT!

I can hear his little footsteps galloping your way this very minute. Syd            http://www.escape.ca/~sgb                      Dealing with Depression Naturally                               and other books by Syd Baumel.                                      …and cool record reviews!

Response:

Sue him.  You really like to ask stupid questions Herbie.  Try thinking before you type. Good advice Doggie, you should follow it!!! The point is that Randi makes you sign a contract so you CANNOT sue him. Understand now? The person has no recourse if Randi refuses to pay. He must not be too sure of his challenge if he has to resort to such tactics.

A lawyer, we already checked out her credentials, who works in this field, has opined that the clause in Randi’s contract wouldn’t prevent someone who won the challenge from suing for their money.  It isn’t the purpose of the clause.  And if you’d followed idiots like Riley G., you’d see why it’s necessary. arf

Response:

What do you mean, erf? You have to sign away your right to sue when you apply, don’t you?

It’s hd, erf is jus’ a ‘lil noise.  This have been debated to death.  The clause in the challenge dealing with lawsuits wouldn’t prevent someone from suing to collect the prize if they won.  Plus substantial damages. ruf

Response:

Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense. And what are these people supposed to do when they prove what they are doing and Randi refuses to pay up? Sue him.  You really like to ask stupid questions Herbie.  Try thinking before you type. erf

Good advice Doggie, you should follow it!!! The point is that Randi makes you sign a contract so you CANNOT sue him. Understand now? The person has no recourse if Randi refuses to pay. He must not be too sure of his challenge if he has to resort to such tactics.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Very, very well put.  I wish the skeptical community would openly ponder the possibility that the Emperor has been wearing too many clothes. Your recommendations for tightening the screws on the ‘Randi Challenge’ thing are valuable. The Challenge is an important signal tower for those skeptics who prefer not to investigate the paranormal for themselves. Most believe that until someone wins the million, the evidence supporting PSI amounts to precicely zero and there is no need to read and take seriously published articles or books, no matter how well recieved these are by the more critical scientific establishment. Randi therefore has a lot of power, and as long as he is able to dodge promising applicants evidence obtained by serious researchers will not readily reach it’s audience. I have no direct evidence that Randi has ever tried to dodge promising applicants, other than putting Benneth on hold for no good reason for three months.

Make that seven months, Syd . . . he’s been doing the Zwinge waltz since last January . . . Ironically, now it’s Randi who has been nose-to- the-grindstone since ~July 31 in trying to negotiate a trial for Benneth (not *with* Benneth, and I can’t say that I blame him), but Benneth has been playing (or being) the clown, fool, crazed Prince of Denmark … between moments of lucidity.  However, Randi’s refusal to sign Benneth’s application form before (and if) they go to bat could be construed as a dodge. I don’t know what a lawyer would say.

Well, I do. The Challenge is a unilateral contract. It’s kind of an unusual insrument, if you can call it that. I call it b’llsh’t. Anyway, there’s no clear legal recourse until he signs it as far as I can see, and it really takes an expert on unilaterals to tell us what it is, and even then, what kind of an agreement is it really? And what’s it’s jurisdiction? All I have from Randi are about five or six dozen e-mails from the man either to me or about me, and all derogatory or threats to humiliate me. In one he types to me an angry sounding letter in ALL CAPS and  commands me to F*CK OFF. Now why does he have to act so hostile if he’s got a valid offer?      And here’s more questions:       NAME ONE APPLICANT HE’S EVER TESTED.       WHO AT GOLDMAN SACHS WILL VERIFY THE AWARD?       WHY CAN’T WE SEE THE RECORDS OF PREVIOUS TRIALS IF THERE ARE ANY?       WHY WON’T RANDI SIGN HIS OWN CHALLENGE?       If all the answers to these questions is so easy, then why is he hiding them?       SYd, I’ve been screaming about this for over half a year now. After a while it’s gets to be funny and I actually start feeling sorry for him.  So what’s left to do but clown around until he wakes up from the smell of his reputation in flames? Really, if he wants me to act sensibly, then he could start the ball rolling by simply typing a few names so we could check this out. ANd why is he Maybe if he thinks I’m a crazy fool it will give him the needed confidence and schedule a test of my claims. But of course, that would mean he’d have to sign the paper, wouldn’t it? And he won’t do tthat, will he? He’s never done it before, and he’ll never do it ever.        But maybe you can work on him to endorse my proposal to open testing up to the schools using my oat test and the Jones/Jenkins Yeast test. http://www.marius.net/yeast.html At this point I’ve given up any hope of getting my million bucks from his cheap carney act inthe way he’s suggested it can’t be done, so what do I have to lose by revealing my methods? Let a bunch of little school kids validate my claims. What could be better? Besides, I got other ways of doing this he hasn’t even dreamed of yet.       WHERE"S MY MILLION RANDI? I GOT YOUR PROOF BOTH LIVING AND MECHANICAL, RIGHT HERE.  . . . COME AND GET IT! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – However, even the most zealous skeptics agree that at least some small PSI effects have been demonstrated to exist. And still, the million dollars have not been won. This fact alone should be enough to convince skeptics that the Challenge is not as subtle a barometer of PSI activity as they might think. Either Randi revamps his program by exposing the mechanics and dynamics of his application policy and by publishing the details of tests and preliminaries, or he should throw in the towl and declare the program void. That would hopefully send skeptics back to doing what they should, namely informing themselves about the status of psi-research as it stand today, instead of wasting their time standing at attention in Randi’s ranks. Joris van Dorp Syd

Yeah, Joris has written the definitive statement and speaks my sentiments exactly. John Benneth at the World’s greatest website Click here and see why . . . http://www.marius.net/ (Nose to the grindstone, yeah right sure. Most of it is his complaining about all the e-mail he gets about this . . . and by the way, Art Bell told me he does this . . . and Art has invtied him to appear on the program, but you know magic is a vanishing art)

Response:

Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense. And what are these people supposed to do when they prove what they are doing and Randi refuses to pay up?

Sue him.  You really like to ask stupid questions Herbie.  Try thinking before you type. erf

Response:

So describe the experiments.   — John Walkup

Response:

Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense. And what are these people supposed to do when they prove what they are doing and Randi refuses to pay up? Sue him.  You really like to ask stupid questions Herbie.  Try thinking before you type. erf

What do you mean, erf? You have to sign away your right to sue when you apply, don’t you? kb

Response:

. Look, Randi, why don’t you take two of the tests we’ve furnished for you, and your people, whoever they are, can do them immediately as your preliminary tests. In fact, why doesn’t everyone who reads this do the test or do something to have it done in their area?.

 What type of test are you talking about? Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense. Peter Moran

Response:

Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense.

And what are these people supposed to do when they prove what they are doing and Randi refuses to pay up?

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. Look, Randi, why don’t you take two of the tests we’ve furnished for you, and your people, whoever they are, can do them immediately as your preliminary tests. In fact, why doesn’t everyone who reads this do the test or do something to have it done in their area?.  What type of test are you talking about?

We’ve come up with a protocol that narrows down the arugment to separating homeopathically potentized solutions form non.     The problem now is to get Randi to agree to a test. To provide further evidence, and because Randi’s refusing to accept the information as confirmation of our cliam, we’re releasing two different but easy methods by which to do what we’re claiming can be done.      One makes use of oat seeds and takes a few days to get results, but the other uses yeast and the results can be seen within 24 hours sing a microscope.       All these people who have mouths bigger than their brains can now see for themselves using objective measures whether it works or not. So now the argument about homeopathy can go from "he said" to "I saw."      Try it and see for yourself if you won’t agree that Randi owes me a million bucks. Also if I was dealing with all the crackpots wanting to take on Randi’s challenge I would as sure as day want to have some protection against being sued if they don’t like the outcome.  It is common sense.

As one of the crackpots, I have to say that getting an outcome as you put it, seems to be impossible to do with Randi. I applied to take the test seven months ago, and now he’s saying he won’t communicate with me. When I’ve sent evidence to him he becomes furious, starts writing me long letters in all caps, and cussing me out. He won’t even sign and return his own challenge. If he’s afreaid of being sued, then why did he make the offer in the first place? If he’s so sure I can’t win, then why doesn’t schedule the trial and get it over with? And so far, we have not seen any reports of previous trials, nor have we been able to find anyone he’s ever tested or have we ever seen a signed copy of his CHallenge for anyone previously. To me, from first hand knowledge, the Psychic Challenge is not a valid offer, nor does it seem to have bever been one, and it makes me wonder how much valid phenomena he’s been suppressing. Most of his communication to us has been hostile.. Perhaps you can tell us where reports of former trials can be found. And how many of these "crackpots" do you know who have tried to sue him? Peter Moran

Thanks for responding to this, Peter. If I can furnish anymore information, let me know. John Benneth http://www.marius.net/proof.html

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             DIRECTLY RELEVANT: Getting on with it  Organization:             Personal   References:             1 My chemist (PhD in analytical chemistry) can do the preparation any weekend in November.  The work will all be done at Mount Saint Mary’s College. Will Benneth be ready by then?                                 Randi

     Well how do you like that?       Will Benneth be ready then? Benneth was ready the day hefiled the application to the Psychic CHallenge, on January 26th, 1999 http://www.marius.net/application.html      After seven months of bickering Randal finally agrees to a test at Mt. St. Mary’s College on some weekend in November. But what college is he talking about? Here we have a puicture of some scientists sitting around a desk at the college you propose. Is this NIST? http://www.msmcollege.com/science_dep.htm Or is this it? http://www.msmary.edu/science/ Maybe  this is it? http://www.msmc.edu/webdex/science/science/home.htm       What are you trying to pull now, Mr. Zwinge?      Seriously, I think we ALL can do better than this. Look, Randi, why don’t you take two of the tests we’ve furnished for you, and your people, whoever they are, can do them immediately as your preliminary tests. In fact, why doesn’t everyone who reads this do the test or do something to have it done in their area?. Maybe everyone could go to the science editor of their local newspaper or the head of the science department at your local college, start there, ask who could pull this off, who would be interested?       Tell them why it’s important. Tell them its to validate or debunk what purposts to be the world’s greatest doctrine of energy medicine ever known. Money and lives are riding on it.      The yeast test is the quickest one to do, but the oat test is the easiest.      Do both yourself, or get one of your people to do it, Randi, and everyone else should be doing the same.     What’s the big deal here? If a dummy, as you call me,  can pull it off, why can’t you, a MacArthur Genius, do it?  You’re the genius here who never finished high school? Is the problem not enough time?      If it’s time, we would have had this done long ago. You would have had the confidence to shoot me down immediately.      Or at least try. But you haven’t done it because you already lost this war long ago. You’ve seen plenty of evidence to prove that what you’re talking about is real, and so all you can do is to hurl ad hominem.      Is it that it isn’t important? I don’t think so. I think it’s real important. Homeopathy is a growth industry. The consumer is demanding that his government use its superior resources to rectify its trade. And it WILL happen, within a few years, homeopathy will be regulated, as it is in France with the bug remedies like the clap (Medorrhinum), because they are not similia, they are idem, and Hahnemann enjoins us against the use of idem for present manifestations of disease. . . .      There’s a lot of people out there who believe that there really is something to homeopathy, and if they’re wrong, they’re being defrauded and this is a grand hoax that should be exposed. But if the opposite is true, then this may be further validation for what appears to a lot of people as being the greatest known medical doctrine to appear in modern times. It already has become, within only 200 years, the second most used doctrine of healing in the world today, second only to Chinese medicine. That’s a lot of people for a high school dropout to characterize as stupid.      So what I suggest we do is start promoting these two tests. I’ll start posting the recipes at my web site at http://www.marius.net      And I’ll hit the newsgroups with this.      This way anyone can have access to the tests and do them for themselves to see if this is a real phenomenon. Skeptics, believers, and agnostics alike can all have the same simple procedure. All the St. Mary’s Colleges all over the world can have the test by simply logging on to http://marius.net . And then if we need to, we’ll start collecting affidavits from people who have done testing and we’ll present these to Goldman Sachs as as the preliminary evidence.      Randi, you can do these experiments for yourself and see the results. I’ll give you  the method and tell you what ingredients you need  to do it with, I’ll consult with your top scientists, although you might want to call on your quantum physicist to render an opinion for you as well about this      And lets bring in some outside testimony for what this is, that is if you’re still not convinced. People like Richard Gerber, M.D., the author of VIBRATIONAL MEDICINE. And Andrew Weil, M.D. Let’s officially bring in a representative from NIST, let’s have invite the APS to run the tests.      Let’s also being in a well known jurist, somebody on the level of a Bork to oversee any formal test. ANd let’s use everyday people to create the double blind, people neither you nor I have anything to do with selecting.      And let’s go before the media with this. We can squeeze this for everything it’s worth. You can hype your book and I can hype mine.      Then instead of everyone having an opinion about what someone else has claimed to have done, they can do for it themselves. Or do you just want to go on arguing and trading barbs like we’ve been doing?  Either way, I’m going to enjoy it. I’ve got more than enough evidence to prove the hypothesis, plenty of published studies, and more than enough method, and I’ve got a whole library worth of ad hominem remarks I can make about Hamilton Zwinge, either way I’m bucked up solid and real confident I can’t lose. So what’s it going to be, Randal? Either way it’s fine, or you can get your little white hanky out and concede now, maybe we can work out a cash settlement. I don’t care, but how is it again I’m supposed to lose? In some dark little classroom at some little ignominious school in England?     If after doing the little experiments I’ve given you and everyone else you all come up with nothing , well,  then by a putative decision we’ll have our results. If they’re negative and people are complaining that this doesn’t work, then we can all consider that the hypothesis was wrong. But if the results are positive, if you’re getting deluged by school children from Mount St. Mary’s College in England who are seeing the same 150% growth over the controls that I recorded in the oat test, if people are replicating the work of Jones and Jenkins with yeast, then maybe that will be a cue that it’s time to schedule a formal trial of your hypothesis, that , how did Mr. Thuro, aka Happy Dog, put it? *The purpose of the challenge is to refute the argument that there is insufficient incentive for promoters of the paranormal, like homeopaths, to prove their assertions.* So as a promoter of what you would deem the paranormal, I have to say that after seven months you have yet to show me the bait. And this upsets me. I took your offer to be made in good faith and I think that when the American public sees what it is that you’ve been pulling, they’re going to feel disenchanted with you, not homeopathy. I think those of us who have applied to your little challenge feel there has been little incentive to take your test. You won’t even sign your own challenge. YOu won’t even give us the name of the person at Goldman Sachs whose supposed to confirm that you even have a prize. That’s not too much to ask for people who are risking reputation and expense to meet the demands of your challenge.      I think when the American public sees what it is you’re doing, they’re going to be upset with people like you and Bob Park, because they take you to be a modern Diogenes, dedicated to the truth, not deception.  Yet that is all your craft speaks for itself, are these perpetual deceptions that serve no one but yourself in the way they aggrandize you. And is it hurting people? Yes, your recalcitrance to look at the facts is indeed hurting people, it’s killing people, because it creating a situation where superior medical treatment is being withheld from them because its been denounced by the likes of you and your ever decreasing gang.       Now we could sit back and let you simply become a footnote in history, but I’m not content with that. I want to see you rectified, but I also want my money . . . and Mr. Zwinge, I’m going to get it. .     Well, do you think we can have grounds for a formal test, perhaps on that weekend in November? Sound fair enough? That should speed things up, don’t you think? If you like, we could schedule next February, or MArch. I don’t care I could move a few appointments around and make time for you and your friends.      I’m not in any special rush. Time money and public interest are all on my side. What have you got? We’ve already seen the rabbit.      So let’s start with your mystery scientist. Let me speak to him on the phone, and he and I can collaborate on how he can see these things for himself.      This weekend.      Is that getting on with it? John Benneth 503-661-4842

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I am looking for another pilot to share the rental cost of a C172 to fly round trip to Albany, NY on March 19.  I expect that the trip will take 2.4 hours each way.  Engine time is $55/hour.  I would like to leave at 6:00am and return to Bangor by 9:00pm. Interested pilots may reply via email or telephone as listed below.  Thanks. — Regards, Tom "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return" Leonardo da Vinci J. Thomas Hicks, CPA Williams & Hicks, P.A. Certified Public Accountants 145 Exchange Street, Suite 4 Bangor, ME 04401 Tel. (207) 941-9810 Fax. (207) 941-9432

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