Question:

::Do you file your taxes early or are you a late filer? Always early being we get a nice return  .

Question:

Ongoing acts of a madman and his regime. When will the people say "enough is enough " and boot this criminal mob out of the White House? How many atrocities does it take? Now we know Bush went into the White House obsessed with "taking out" Saddam Hussein. We know he lied to the people in his attempts to justify his obsession to invade and "take out" Hussein. We have heard he believes he is on a"mission for God." Certainly a psychological examination is in order. It appears he is merely a chump being used by the "axis of evil" comprising the staff at the White House. And people thought the "Big Brother" of communism was bad. Wake up people. Terrorism is at work here in the USA by elected "officials." Look and see who the real enemy is. DW Suiter Son of God

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wounded "Held Captive" at Walter Reed Disabled Vets Fire Back at Rumsfeld By DAVID VEST "The organization known as Disabled American Veterans has been helping U.S. combat casualties figure out what benefits they have coming to them and how to apply for them since 1920. Lately the Bush administration has been going out of its way to make the DAV’s job harder. Their job would be hard enough even if the government appreciated their efforts and was glad to see them coming. Incredibly, it doesn’t and it isn’t. Not any more. An army of U.S. veterans more than twice the size of Operation Iraqi Freedom have lost their health insurance benefits since Bush took office. As many as half a million vets are homeless. Seven VA hospitals are being closed as part of an effort to "restructure" the Department of Veterans Affairs. Meanwhile, veterans of the Iraq campaign can fall in line with over 250,000 U.S. veterans who are already waiting at least six months to see a doctor. Although it hasn’t hesitated to send them to face death in Iraq, the administration has consistently opposed any attempt to extend full benefits to Reservists and National Guardsmen, twenty percent of whom have no health insurance by General Accounting Office estimates. It was one thing when the White House tried to roll back increases in monthly imminent-danger pay and family separation allowance, and another when it called a modest proposal to increase the sum given to families of soldiers who die on active duty "wasteful and unnecessary." Finally, it occurred to the firm of Bush Cheney Rumsfeld Rice Minions and Myrmidons to wonder how much money the country would save (and how much more could be diverted to Bechtel and Halliburton contracts) if veterans couldn’t even find out what their benefits are. And so now we learn that ever since Operation Iraqi Freedom got underway, it has been easier for a terrorist to get into the United States legally than for a DAV representative to get into a military hospital to help wounded soldiers with their benefit applications. Sickeningly, the Pentagon has been severely limiting DAV access to wounded veterans and doing it on grounds of "security." Oh, yes, and protecting "privacy." It protects the veterans’ privacy by not allowing them to speak with DAV representatives "un monitored." Fortunately someone blinked and it wasn’t the Disabled American Veterans. When he got back to the office after celebrating New Year’s and opened his mail, Donald Rumsfeld found a letter informing him that he had messed with the wrong people this time. Here’s part of what DAV Washington Headquarters Executive Director David W. Gorman had to say to the Secretary of Defense: "At one facility in particular [Walter Reed Army Medical Center] our efforts to visit with wounded patients have been severely restricted. For example, all requests to visit patients must now be made through the WRAMC headquarters office, which then selects the patients we may visit and strictly limits information about the patients, even the patient’s name and the nature of the injury is withheld without express permission. The DAV’s representatives also are escorted at all times while in the facility, and all contact with patients is closely monitored by the escort. This is particularly unnerving and inappropriate as all conversations between a representative and client are confidential in nature. "I believe these overly broad restrictions on patient access inhibit the ability of our professional accredited representatives to help ensure these wounded service members have the vital information they and their families need in order to obtain the medical care and benefits many of these veterans will depend on for decades to come. "The American public would be outraged if these restrictions became public knowledge." [Would they? Hard to tell. There has been little or no coverage in the mainstream media since the DAV released the letter.] Gorman goes on to say: "The record of benefits awarded by the VA shows our honored wounded and injured are getting less than they are rightfully entitled. Those wounded and disabled in service to our nation should not be held captive and deprived of the knowledge that would allow them to receive all their rightful benefits, earned on a battlefield half a world away. It brings great dishonor to our nation to learn of disabled veterans suffering physical and economic hardships following their release from medical treatment solely because they are unaware and uninformed of their rightful benefits." Think of it … wounded veterans "held captive" … prevented from seeing people who have a congressional charter to serve them … not allowed to speak with DAV reps in private, lest their "privacy" be violated … an administration that regards Disabled American Veterans as security risks. A government increasingly unable to tell the difference between terrorists and its own citizens.

Response:

Wounded "Held Captive" at Walter Reed Disabled Vets Fire Back at Rumsfeld By DAVID VEST "The organization known as Disabled American Veterans has been helping U.S. combat casualties figure out what benefits they have coming to them and how to apply for them since 1920. Lately the Bush administration has been going out of its way to make the DAV’s job harder. Their job would be hard enough even if the government appreciated their efforts and was glad to see them coming. Incredibly, it doesn’t and it isn’t. Not any more. An army of U.S. veterans more than twice the size of Operation Iraqi Freedom have lost their health insurance benefits since Bush took office. As many as half a million vets are homeless. Seven VA hospitals are being closed as part of an effort to "restructure" the Department of Veterans Affairs. Meanwhile, veterans of the Iraq campaign can fall in line with over 250,000 U.S. veterans who are already waiting at least six months to see a doctor. Although it hasn’t hesitated to send them to face death in Iraq, the administration has consistently opposed any attempt to extend full benefits to Reservists and National Guardsmen, twenty percent of whom have no health insurance by General Accounting Office estimates. It was one thing when the White House tried to roll back increases in monthly imminent-danger pay and family separation allowance, and another when it called a modest proposal to increase the sum given to families of soldiers who die on active duty "wasteful and unnecessary." Finally, it occurred to the firm of Bush Cheney Rumsfeld Rice Minions and Myrmidons to wonder how much money the country would save (and how much more could be diverted to Bechtel and Halliburton contracts) if veterans couldn’t even find out what their benefits are. And so now we learn that ever since Operation Iraqi Freedom got underway, it has been easier for a terrorist to get into the United States legally than for a DAV representative to get into a military hospital to help wounded soldiers with their benefit applications. Sickeningly, the Pentagon has been severely limiting DAV access to wounded veterans and doing it on grounds of "security." Oh, yes, and protecting "privacy." It protects the veterans’ privacy by not allowing them to speak with DAV representatives "un monitored." Fortunately someone blinked and it wasn’t the Disabled American Veterans. When he got back to the office after celebrating New Year’s and opened his mail, Donald Rumsfeld found a letter informing him that he had messed with the wrong people this time. Here’s part of what DAV Washington Headquarters Executive Director David W. Gorman had to say to the Secretary of Defense: "At one facility in particular [Walter Reed Army Medical Center] our efforts to visit with wounded patients have been severely restricted. For example, all requests to visit patients must now be made through the WRAMC headquarters office, which then selects the patients we may visit and strictly limits information about the patients, even the patient’s name and the nature of the injury is withheld without express permission. The DAV’s representatives also are escorted at all times while in the facility, and all contact with patients is closely monitored by the escort. This is particularly unnerving and inappropriate as all conversations between a representative and client are confidential in nature. "I believe these overly broad restrictions on patient access inhibit the ability of our professional accredited representatives to help ensure these wounded service members have the vital information they and their families need in order to obtain the medical care and benefits many of these veterans will depend on for decades to come. "The American public would be outraged if these restrictions became public knowledge." [Would they? Hard to tell. There has been little or no coverage in the mainstream media since the DAV released the letter.] Gorman goes on to say: "The record of benefits awarded by the VA shows our honored wounded and injured are getting less than they are rightfully entitled. Those wounded and disabled in service to our nation should not be held captive and deprived of the knowledge that would allow them to receive all their rightful benefits, earned on a battlefield half a world away. It brings great dishonor to our nation to learn of disabled veterans suffering physical and economic hardships following their release from medical treatment solely because they are unaware and uninformed of their rightful benefits." Think of it … wounded veterans "held captive" … prevented from seeing people who have a congressional charter to serve them … not allowed to speak with DAV reps in private, lest their "privacy" be violated … an administration that regards Disabled American Veterans as security risks. A government increasingly unable to tell the difference between terrorists and its own citizens.

Response:

Question:

Purchase Orders are contingent or future commitments and will become actual commitments only if accepted by the vendor, they do not become expenses until the vendor has fulfilled his obligations.  Since they are not expenses they are not included in a P&L. I don’t think you mean what you said about Accounts Payable; they belong on the balance sheet and not in a P&L.  Perhaps you are comparing a cash-basis P&L with an accrual-basis "Itemized P&L". You won’t find the report you want in QuickBooks or any other program I’ve seen.  With a later version of QB you could export to Excel and create your own custom report, but you’re out of luck with QB4. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Using QuickBooks Pro 4.0 Windows. How do I include Purchase Orders in an expense report?  How to include Purchase Orders in any kind of expense report is a mystery.  Also mysterious is that a "Standard – Profit & Loss" will not include Accounts Payable, but the "Itemized – Profit & Loss" will include Accounts Payable.  Basically, I need some form of comprehensive expense report to include what I’ve spent and what I’m committed to spend (open purchase orders, and payables).

Response:

To accomplish what you want you will need to do an analysis of all your purchase orders and create a journal entry accruing your future purchases. After you run your reports you should either reverse or delete this entry. What you want to do is rather unusual to say the least. I have never come across this in 30 years of practice, but then its your books you can do as you wish. Perhaps you can share with us why you need to make such an unorthodox adjustment to your reports. If I were to speculate then perhaps your business has gone under and will not have any more revenue in the furture; but you need to make future expenditures to cover product waranties for sales make in the past.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Using QuickBooks Pro 4.0 Windows. How do I include Purchase Orders in an expense report?  How to include Purchase Orders in any kind of expense report is a mystery.  Also mysterious is that a "Standard – Profit & Loss" will not include Accounts Payable, but the "Itemized – Profit & Loss" will include Accounts Payable.  Basically, I need some form of comprehensive expense report to include what I’ve spent and what I’m committed to spend (open purchase orders, and payables).

Response:

You should talk to an Accountant. Des

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Using QuickBooks Pro 4.0 Windows. How do I include Purchase Orders in an expense report?  How to include Purchase Orders in any kind of expense report is a mystery.  Also mysterious is that a "Standard – Profit & Loss" will not include Accounts Payable, but the "Itemized – Profit & Loss" will include Accounts Payable.  Basically, I need some form of comprehensive expense report to include what I’ve spent and what I’m committed to spend (open purchase orders, and payables).

Response:

To accomplish what you want you will need to do an analysis of all your purchase orders and create a journal entry accruing your future purchases.

What in the world? And some folk thinks that Enron accounting was screwy. Using QuickBooks Pro 4.0 Windows. How do I include Purchase Orders in an expense report?

You can’t.  They are contigent on a future event which hasn’t happened yet. Basically, I need some form of comprehensive expense report to include what I’ve spent and what I’m committed to spend (open purchase orders, and payables).

Probably what you are wanting is a Cash Needs Report, which shows the future cash needs of the company.  I am not aware of any "in-the-box" accounting software that can generate such a report with the flick of a finger. Basically it’s a projected cash flows report, indicating the expected cash in and cash out over the next period(s).  What you can use this for is knowing when you’ll have to see the banker to extend the line-of-credit. The Board of Directors and such probably don’t have a finger on the cash needs of their company like say, a smaller business where the owner handles almost all the business functions.  They are the ones who will need to see a report that depicts the future need to find additional cash to fill the shortfall before it happens.  Generally they have two colors, green and red, and you know how bad the color red is. — Paul A. Thomas, CPA taxman at negia.net

Response:

To accomplish what you want you will need to do an analysis of all your purchase orders and create a journal entry accruing your future purchases. What in the world? And some folk thinks that Enron accounting was screwy.

Paul, Didn’t you read the balance of my post? Personaly I think what he wants is absurd. The poster asked how, not if this were proper to so.

Response:

Using QuickBooks Pro 4.0 Windows. How do I include Purchase Orders in an expense report?  How to include Purchase Orders in any kind of expense report is a mystery.  Also mysterious is that a "Standard – Profit & Loss" will not include Accounts Payable, but the "Itemized – Profit & Loss" will include Accounts Payable.  Basically, I need some form of comprehensive expense report to include what I’ve spent and what I’m committed to spend (open purchase orders, and payables).

Response:

Question:

PricewaterhouseCoopers has a $1.1 billion dollar contract with BP for accounting outsourcing.  I found that by doing a search for "outsourcing" on www.pwcglobal.com. There are other clients disclosed at the "business process outsourcing" section of pwcglobal.com. Other firms may also offer this service but I did not check their websites. In article – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know of any business that contract out their accounting positins? I don’t know specific business names, but it is done.  There is a CPA firm here in my town that does outsourcing of financial accounting functions for small and medium businesses. T

Response:

Does anyone know of any business that contract out their accounting positins?

Response:

Does anyone know of any business that contract out their accounting positins?

I don’t know specific business names, but it is done.  There is a CPA firm here in my town that does outsourcing of financial accounting functions for small and medium businesses. T

Response:

Question:

For the second time in 3 months, I have spotted a Tango A320 at LAX. Yesterday, 9 Feb 2002 (same day I noticed the QF 747’s) it operated AC 796 from LAX to YYZ.   Given all the pretending that Tango is a seperate company from Air Canada (read the horror stories on www.errorplan.com) why is this livery showing up in a market not served by Tango? Does AC use the same accounting practices as Enron? Wasn’t the setting up of Tango a condition for the takeover of CP and/or the allowing of Canada 3000 to fail? -Erik

Response:

For the second time in 3 months, I have spotted a Tango A320 at LAX. Yesterday, 9 Feb 2002 (same day I noticed the QF 747’s) it operated AC 796 from LAX to YYZ. Given all the pretending that Tango is a seperate company from Air Canada (read the horror stories on www.errorplan.com) why is this livery showing up in a market not served by Tango? Does AC use the same accounting practices as Enron? Wasn’t the setting up of Tango a condition for the takeover of CP and/or the allowing of Canada 3000 to fail?

Actually, Tango is a separate *product.*  But it’s AC allright.   (Tango was going to be forbidden by the competition bureau, but C3000 went belly up first.)

Response:

For the second time in 3 months, I have spotted a Tango A320 at LAX. Yesterday, 9 Feb 2002 (same day I noticed the QF 747’s) it operated AC 796 from LAX to YYZ. Given all the pretending that Tango is a seperate company from Air Canada (read the horror stories on www.errorplan.com) why is this livery showing up in a market not served by Tango?

Tango is a separate division. Tango flights are AC6xxx and all the airplanes still registered to AC. Don’t know what the callsign is, I haven’t heard one on the freq. yet. So they can substitute the planes on any route if needed (tech. of the scheduled etc.). Piss off some J customers at the same time too. Wasn’t the setting up of Tango a condition for the takeover of CP and/or the allowing of Canada 3000 to fail?

No. AC was expressly forbidden from starting up a LoCo for two years on any existing city pair. B.

Response:

Tango is a separate division. Tango flights are AC6xxx and all the airplanes still registered to AC. Don’t know what the callsign is, I haven’t heard one on the freq. yet. So they can substitute the planes on any route if needed (tech. of the scheduled etc.). Piss off some J customers at the same time too.

I hear the Tango flights arriving at YYZ as "Air Canada 6xxx". Howard

Response:

I hear the Tango flights arriving at YYZ as "Air Canada 6xxx".

The dorval airport web site arrivals/departure page shows Tango flights using NV 6xxx flight numbers. AC’s flights show  ACA xxx

Response:

…snip Tango is a separate division. Tango flights are AC6xxx and all the airplanes still registered to AC. Don’t know what the callsign is, I haven’t heard one on the freq. yet. So they can substitute the planes on any route if needed (tech. of the scheduled etc.). Piss off some J customers at the same time too.

…snip How many planes are actually painted in Tango livery anyway?  I suspect it is less than the number actually used on Tango routes right now.

Response:

I hear the Tango flights arriving at YYZ as "Air Canada 6xxx". The dorval airport web site arrivals/departure page shows Tango flights using NV 6xxx flight numbers. AC’s flights show  ACA xxx

Interesting, it peaked my curiosity so here’s a quick check of a few other "Tango" cities shows there is no common way of looking for a tango flight. For YYZ, they list ALL Air Canada, Air Nova, Tango and Air Georgian Flight using the ACXXXX for flight numbers. They list "Tango" under the "airlines". YYC just lists ALL AC mainline, regional and Tango under Air Canada and ACXXXX for flight numbers. YVR lists tango flight numbers as "ACT6075" while the Airline as Air Canada? I guess to each their own for looking up flights.  At least it appears to be consistent in the air for ATC! Howard

Response:

Question:

With 10 users go ahead and take Great Plains off the list.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks to Alan and Peter. We have a 10 concurrent user licence and sometimes need more. How many users do you need in the system?  If it is one or two, Great Plains has a pricing structure for their Dynamics package that may work for you. It would be more expensive but would probably give you more features and definitely give you a longer life with the same package as your business grows. Alan we are currently using Sage’s Business Works accounting package for our 40 employee company. Sage has been promising to release a new 32 bit version for centuries now. I’m getting tired of waiting for features I know I can get with competing package called Business Vision 32. Does anyone know anything about Business Vision? Are there other packages in this price range (~$200 per module as I recall)? Thanks in advance.

Response:

BusinessVision 32 is NOT modular, save for an add-on Multi-Currency module.  You get 19 or so modules in the program whether you need them or not.  The price is attractive for the value, especially if you will use most of the modules. Feel free to E-mail me if you want more info on BV32.

Response:

Thanks to Alan and Peter. We have a 10 concurrent user licence and sometimes need more.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How many users do you need in the system?  If it is one or two, Great Plains has a pricing structure for their Dynamics package that may work for you. It would be more expensive but would probably give you more features and definitely give you a longer life with the same package as your business grows. Alan we are currently using Sage’s Business Works accounting package for our 40 employee company. Sage has been promising to release a new 32 bit version for centuries now. I’m getting tired of waiting for features I know I can get with competing package called Business Vision 32. Does anyone know anything about Business Vision? Are there other packages in this price range (~$200 per module as I recall)? Thanks in advance.

Response:

we are currently using Sage’s Business Works accounting package for our 40 employee company. Sage has been promising to release a new 32 bit version for centuries now. I’m getting tired of waiting for features I know I can get with competing package called Business Vision 32. Does anyone know anything about Business Vision? Are there other packages in this price range (~$200 per module as I recall)? Thanks in advance.

Response:

How many users do you need in the system?  If it is one or two, Great Plains has a pricing structure for their Dynamics package that may work for you. It would be more expensive but would probably give you more features and definitely give you a longer life with the same package as your business grows. Alan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – we are currently using Sage’s Business Works accounting package for our 40 employee company. Sage has been promising to release a new 32 bit version for centuries now. I’m getting tired of waiting for features I know I can get with competing package called Business Vision 32. Does anyone know anything about Business Vision? Are there other packages in this price range (~$200 per module as I recall)? Thanks in advance.

Response:

Question:

I thought some of you might enjoy a recent experience I had.         My daughter will be teaching pre-kindergarten this next year.  SWMBO and I visited her family last weekend (she lives a couple of hundred miles away), and TD (the daughter) wanted some help in getting her classroom ready – some other person had taught in the room last year and had left the room in a mess.  So she, SWMBO and I went up one afternoon to put in a couple of hours or so.  First, TD wanted the height on an adjustable table lowered.  I asked, "got a screwdriver around here?"  Of course not!!  So off I went to the maintenance guy’s closet and borrowed one.  Some time later, I had a need for a pair of pliars – Yep, same answer, so back to the maintenance guy.  A bit later, had a need for a skill knife to cut a piece of carpet. Yeah, you guessed it!         That evening, I made a trip to a nearby Lowe’s.  Purchased a small tool box, and a few basic tools and supplies – hammer, regular pliars, channel locks, screwdrivers, a skill knife, a small plastic box which I filled with several sizes of nails and brads, a glue gun, etc.  Only cost me about 60 bucks.  Went back to TD’s and presented it to her – told her if her husband or any of the three kids wanted to borrow any of the contents to say "NO!! – go get your own".  Actually, she’ll keep it in her school room.          Last evening, she called and wanted to tell me about her tool box. The latter part of the week, she had been in her schoolroom most every day working.  She heard one of the other teachers say she needed a screwdriver, so she said, "just a moment".  The next few days, several teachers had heard about "Laura’s tool box" and were wanting one of their own.         Well, I started to feel proud and a bit egotistic about the whole thing, and then the thought hit me:  TD is 43 years old – and has been married for some 20 years.  Instead of me depending upon her husband to take care of all her needs and tool/repair education, why didn’t I do this when she was in public school or when she went off to college 25 years ago. Think about it!!                                                             Regards,  Roy Hickman

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I thought some of you might enjoy a recent experience I had.        My daughter will be teaching pre-kindergarten this next year.  SWMBO and I visited her family last weekend (she lives a couple of hundred miles away), and TD (the daughter) wanted some help in getting her classroom ready – some other person had taught in the room last year and had left the room in a mess.  So she, SWMBO and I went up one afternoon to put in a couple of hours or so.  First, TD wanted the height on an adjustable table lowered.  I asked, "got a screwdriver around here?"  Of course not!!  So off I went to the maintenance guy’s closet and borrowed one.  Some time later, I had a need for a pair of pliars – Yep, same answer, so back to the maintenance guy.  A bit later, had a need for a skill knife to cut a piece of carpet. Yeah, you guessed it!        That evening, I made a trip to a nearby Lowe’s.  Purchased a small tool box, and a few basic tools and supplies – hammer, regular pliars, channel locks, screwdrivers, a skill knife, a small plastic box which I filled with several sizes of nails and brads, a glue gun, etc.  Only cost me about 60 bucks.  Went back to TD’s and presented it to her – told her if her husband or any of the three kids wanted to borrow any of the contents to say "NO!! – go get your own".  Actually, she’ll keep it in her school room.         Last evening, she called and wanted to tell me about her tool box. The latter part of the week, she had been in her schoolroom most every day working.  She heard one of the other teachers say she needed a screwdriver, so she said, "just a moment".  The next few days, several teachers had heard about "Laura’s tool box" and were wanting one of their own.        Well, I started to feel proud and a bit egotistic about the whole thing, and then the thought hit me:  TD is 43 years old – and has been married for some 20 years.  Instead of me depending upon her husband to take care of all her needs and tool/repair education, why didn’t I do this when she was in public school or when she went off to college 25 years ago. Think about it!!                                                            Regards,  Roy Hickman

My really sad comment on this story is that in the District where I work your jaunt into the classroom as well as any use by your daughter of the tools which you purchased for her would have been met with a grievance from the custodial/maintenance union – which they clearly would have won – and subsequent possilble discipline against the teacher involved. Dave Hall

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I thought some of you might enjoy a recent experience I had.         My daughter will be teaching pre-kindergarten this next year.  SWMBO and I visited her family last weekend (she lives a couple of hundred miles away), and TD (the daughter) wanted some help in getting her classroom ready – some other person had taught in the room last year and had left the room in a mess.  So she, SWMBO and I went up one afternoon to put in a couple of hours or so.  First, TD wanted the height on an adjustable table lowered.  I asked, "got a screwdriver around here?"  Of course not!!  So off I went to the maintenance guy’s closet and borrowed one.  Some time later, I had a need for a pair of pliars – Yep, same answer, so back to the maintenance guy.  A bit later, had a need for a skill knife to cut a piece of carpet. Yeah, you guessed it!         That evening, I made a trip to a nearby Lowe’s.  Purchased a small tool box, and a few basic tools and supplies – hammer, regular pliars, channel locks, screwdrivers, a skill knife, a small plastic box which I filled with several sizes of nails and brads, a glue gun, etc.  Only cost me about 60 bucks.  Went back to TD’s and presented it to her – told her if her husband or any of the three kids wanted to borrow any of the contents to say "NO!! – go get your own".  Actually, she’ll keep it in her school room.          Last evening, she called and wanted to tell me about her tool box. The latter part of the week, she had been in her schoolroom most every day working.  She heard one of the other teachers say she needed a screwdriver, so she said, "just a moment".  The next few days, several teachers had heard about "Laura’s tool box" and were wanting one of their own.         Well, I started to feel proud and a bit egotistic about the whole thing, and then the thought hit me:  TD is 43 years old – and has been married for some 20 years.  Instead of me depending upon her husband to take care of all her needs and tool/repair education, why didn’t I do this when she was in public school or when she went off to college 25 years ago. Think about it!!                                                             Regards, Roy Hickman

Nice one, Roy! I’ve done the same thing for the significant women in my life. [A long- time girlfriend, ex-wife, present wife, step-daughter.] I had a lot of fun compiling the tool-kits, the gifts were genuinely appreciated and I also got to use the tools myself from time to time, in emergencies. And guess whose best chisels NEVER got BORROWED to open a can of paint! Cheers Before you buy.

Response:

Not to mention prosecution for bringing deadly weapons onto school property! Kevin — Don’t die wondering! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My really sad comment on this story is that in the District where I work your jaunt into the classroom as well as any use by your daughter of the tools which you purchased for her would have been met with a grievance from the custodial/maintenance union – which they clearly would have won – and subsequent possilble discipline against the teacher involved. Dave Hall

Response:

My daughter is in college and last year moved into an off-campus apartment with a couple of other girls.  My "house-warming" gift to her was a small collection of basic-survival tools.  A couple of screwdrivers, pliers, adjustable wrench, hammer and a small assortment of nails and screws. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I thought some of you might enjoy a recent experience I had.        My daughter will be teaching pre-kindergarten this next year.  SWMBO and I visited her family last weekend (she lives a couple of hundred miles away), and TD (the daughter) wanted some help in getting her classroom ready – some other person had taught in the room last year and had left the room in a mess.  So she, SWMBO and I went up one afternoon to put in a couple of hours or so.  First, TD wanted the height on an adjustable table lowered.  I asked, "got a screwdriver around here?"  Of course not!!  So off I went to the maintenance guy’s closet and borrowed one.  Some time later, I had a need for a pair of pliars – Yep, same answer, so back to the maintenance guy.  A bit later, had a need for a skill knife to cut a piece of carpet. Yeah, you guessed it!        That evening, I made a trip to a nearby Lowe’s.  Purchased a small tool box, and a few basic tools and supplies – hammer, regular pliars, channel locks, screwdrivers, a skill knife, a small plastic box which I filled with several sizes of nails and brads, a glue gun, etc.  Only cost me about 60 bucks.  Went back to TD’s and presented it to her – told her if her husband or any of the three kids wanted to borrow any of the contents to say "NO!! – go get your own".  Actually, she’ll keep it in her school room.         Last evening, she called and wanted to tell me about her tool box. The latter part of the week, she had been in her schoolroom most every day working.  She heard one of the other teachers say she needed a screwdriver, so she said, "just a moment".  The next few days, several teachers had heard about "Laura’s tool box" and were wanting one of their own.        Well, I started to feel proud and a bit egotistic about the whole thing, and then the thought hit me:  TD is 43 years old – and has been married for some 20 years.  Instead of me depending upon her husband to take care of all her needs and tool/repair education, why didn’t I do this when she was in public school or when she went off to college 25 years ago. Think about it!!                                                            Regards,  Roy Hickman

Posted Via Uncensored-News.Com – Still Only $9.95 – http://www.uncensored-news.com  With Servers In California, Texas And Virginia – The Worlds Uncensored News Source

Response:

Nice of you two to take a dump on a refreshing story! — Daniel Willard Spirits Apprentice "It’s only my opinion!"

Not to mention prosecution for bringing deadly weapons onto school property! Kevin — Don’t die wondering!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My really sad comment on this story is that in the District where I work your jaunt into the classroom as well as any use by your daughter of the tools which you purchased for her would have been met with a grievance from the custodial/maintenance union – which they clearly would have won – and subsequent possilble discipline against the teacher involved. Dave Hall

Response:

Nice of you two to take a dump on a refreshing story!

I am sorry if this bothered you. I agree with providing children with basic tools as a good idea. I did so with both my son and daughter when they turned 16 and started driving. Basic tools included the hammer, pliers, set of SAE and metric wrenches, screwdrivers, jumper cables, etc. which would suffice for emergencies on and off the road. However, that in no way obviates the reality that in many workplaces, including a majority of school districts (such as the one in which I am currently employed and in which the maintenance department indirectly reports to me), the senerio described would get the employee in trouble. Maybe this will give second thoughts to those about to bring their toolboxes to work in a union environment. I do not agree with such work rules, but many of us, especially in our youth, are unaware of such contract rules and can get into trouble. I myself was called into the Partner-in-Charges office of the large Accounting office I used to work for a year or so into my career because I was so "stupid" as to put together a little computer cart in my office ( this was a kit that required all of a screwdriver to put together). I was told in no uncertain terms that I was to never do such things and  that the union for the 40 story office building maintenence department had filed a grievance because some custodian had walked by and seen me doing this nasty deed. They won the grievance of course. Apparently I had screwed some guy out of 4 hours of overtime for this 15 minute task. Again, I am sorry that my original comment troubled you. I tried to keep it low key. Dave Hall

Response:

And not to mention that you pay the high taxes that pay the salary of the maintenance guy who should have been doing the job. — Larry Bailey Illegitimi non carborundum

Not to mention prosecution for bringing deadly weapons onto school property! Kevin — Don’t die wondering!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My really sad comment on this story is that in the District where I work your jaunt into the classroom as well as any use by your daughter of the tools which you purchased for her would have been met with a grievance from the custodial/maintenance union – which they clearly would have won – and subsequent possilble discipline against the teacher involved. Dave Hall

Response:

Not to mention prosecution for bringing deadly weapons onto school

property! Not to rain on the party, but Kevin is correct here.  We had an 11 or 12 year old boy killed in Houston when a fellow classmate drove a screwdriver into his head less than a year ago.  What Roy did should be an acceptable practice for any dad to his daughter.  I don’t want to take this post to a political level, but if the kids in that classroom get access to that tool box (skill knife, screwdrivers, etc.) the sweet under-paid and under-appreciated teacher will have liability written all over her.  I say she keeps the tools in the trunk of her car and take them out on an "as-needed" basis.  Just my .03 worth!  (inflation got the extra penny!) — Jim Mc Namara Future Collectibles www.futurecollectibles.com

Response:

Nice story and good job on helping out the school! They need all the help they can get and were ever they can get it from. And remember, it’s never to late to pass on the value of basic handywork. You just might have started TD on becoming a This Old School person, hahaha. Bernie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I thought some of you might enjoy a recent experience I had.         My daughter will be teaching pre-kindergarten this next year. SWMBO and I visited her family last weekend (she lives a couple of hundred miles away), and TD (the daughter) wanted some help in getting her classroom ready – some other person had taught in the room last year and had left the room in a mess.  So she, SWMBO and I went up one afternoon to put in a couple of hours or so.  First, TD wanted the height on an adjustable table lowered.  I asked, "got a screwdriver around here?"  Of course not!!  So off I went to the maintenance guy’s closet and borrowed one.  Some time later, I had a need for a pair of pliars – Yep, same answer, so back to the maintenance guy.  A bit later, had a need for a skill knife to cut a piece of carpet. Yeah, you guessed it!         That evening, I made a trip to a nearby Lowe’s.  Purchased a small tool box, and a few basic tools and supplies – hammer, regular pliars, channel locks, screwdrivers, a skill knife, a small plastic box which I filled with several sizes of nails and brads, a glue gun, etc.  Only cost me about 60 bucks.  Went back to TD’s and presented it to her – told her if her husband or any of the three kids wanted to borrow any of the contents to say "NO!! – go get your own".  Actually, she’ll keep it in her school room.          Last evening, she called and wanted to tell me about her tool box. The latter part of the week, she had been in her schoolroom most every day working.  She heard one of the other teachers say she needed a screwdriver, so she said, "just a moment".  The next few days, several teachers had heard about "Laura’s tool box" and were wanting one of their own.         Well, I started to feel proud and a bit egotistic about the whole thing, and then the thought hit me:  TD is 43 years old – and has been married for some 20 years.  Instead of me depending upon her husband to take care of all her needs and tool/repair education, why didn’t I do this when she was in public school or when she went off to college 25 years ago. Think about it!!                                                             Regards,  Roy Hickman

Response:

Apparently the school in question was not union or the maintenance man would not have loaned his tools.  The teacher would have filled out a work request and submitted it to the board and they would have written a work order to the maintenance man and he would get the things done, in time for next year. My $.03 Not inflation, it’s taxes. My father and I have had several union discussions.  He was and I’m not.  One question was inflation. Do unions cause inflation?   My answer:  A three year contract with 10% a year built-in automatically causes the industry (and every value-added process in between the raw material supplier and the consumer.) involved to raise their prices each year. Dad’s answer:  The workers are just catching up to last year’s inflation, not causing next year’s. Needless to say it was never resolved and we dropped it because of family love that might be lost.

Response:

My wife is also a teacher. We put together a basic toolbox for her. Unfortunately, everyone in the department now knows about it, so about every 2 years we have to restock it… Loyd

Response:

My wife is also a teacher. We put together a basic toolbox for her. Unfortunately, everyone in the department now knows about it, so about every 2 years we have to restock it…

When the Buckhorn STDN shut down, one of the guys in our Range put together a took box for me after all the good stuff had been picked over by the folks with a real use for it.  I got a set of eight Snap-On screwdrivers, a Snap-On quarter-inch socket set, about five "C" clamps, two or three pairs of dikes, three hammers (from tack to large), a variety of colors of electrician’s tape, a utility knife and a couple of boxes of blades, an electrician’s knife and scissors, three sizes of Crescent wrenches, a pair of Vise-grips, a twist of lock wire, a six-inch steel rule, a clump of cable ties, and a couple of pairs of pliers, all fitted into a snappy little metal tool box.  Since this is all NASA property, it’s available to anyone who needs it, but I’m very stern about getting things returned. I’ve filled in some of the gaps, like tiny screwdrivers, small and needlenose pliers, a tape measure (from the tool crib), lubricants for squeaky chairs and sticking locks, a set of allen wrenches, and a few other things.  Others have also contributed to it, now that there’s a central place to keep such things. This tool kit gets called upon at least once a month and usually more frequently.  When we moved into this building with modular furniture, it suddenly became even more popular as everyone customized their cubicles.  We do have a contractor who will do all the little repairs and assembling that the kit helps with, but using that service requires a work order and several signatures, as well as a wait for anything that’s not an emergency. There’s only one thing that puzzles me and that’s what the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet.  No one I’ve asked has been able to identify them, but current thinking is that they’re for holding cable fittings. — Mary Shafer Senior Handling Qualities Research Engineer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA

Response:

If the curved jaw pliers are adjustable and lined with nylon type material they may be for amphenol connectors. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Tool list snipped There’s only one thing that puzzles me and that’s what the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet.  No one I’ve asked has been able to identify them, but current thinking is that they’re for holding cable fittings. — Mary Shafer Senior Handling Qualities Research Engineer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA

Response:

Tool list snipped There’s only one thing that puzzles me and that’s what the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet.  No one I’ve asked has been able to identify them, but current thinking is that they’re for holding cable fittings. If the curved jaw pliers are adjustable and lined with nylon type material they may be for amphenol connectors.

No, solid metal, no adjustability, no lining.  I’d say the diameter of whatever they’re intended to hold is about half an inch, but the maximum opening is 0.75" and when closed the gap is 0.25".  The jaws are 1.25" long, with an ogival curve for the last 0.5, and smooth, not serrated.  The overall length of the pliers is 5.25".  There are markings, "Utica tools" and "K56305" on one side and "319-B" on the other side.  I guess I need to see if Utica has a web site and to check MSC’s site, too. — Mary Shafer Senior Handling Qualities Research Engineer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA

Response:

See! I knew there had to be a story here. Thanks for sharing! 8^) — Daniel Willard Spirits Apprentice "It’s only my opinion!"

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Nice of you two to take a dump on a refreshing story! I am sorry if this bothered you. I agree with providing children with basic tools as a good idea. I did so with both my son and daughter when they turned 16 and started driving. Basic tools included the hammer, pliers, set of SAE and metric wrenches, screwdrivers, jumper cables, etc. which would suffice for emergencies on and off the road. However, that in no way obviates the reality that in many workplaces, including a majority of school districts (such as the one in which I am currently employed and in which the maintenance department indirectly reports to me), the senerio described would get the employee in trouble. Maybe this will give second thoughts to those about to bring their toolboxes to work in a union environment. I do not agree with such work rules, but many of us, especially in our youth, are unaware of such contract rules and can get into trouble. I myself was called into the Partner-in-Charges office of the large Accounting office I used to work for a year or so into my career because I was so "stupid" as to put together a little computer cart in my office  this was a kit that required all of a screwdriver to put together). I was told in no uncertain terms that I was to never do such things and  that the union for the 40 story office building maintenence department had filed a grievance because some custodian had walked by and seen me doing this nasty deed. They won the grievance of course. Apparently I had screwed some guy out of 4 hours of overtime for this 15 minute task. Again, I am sorry that my original comment troubled you. I tried to keep it low key. Dave Hall

Response:

Some would argue that, without the protection the union provides, the "human cost" would be even greater than the adjustment for inflation. I think "union" is just another cost passed onto the consumer.  You have a choice.  Put your money where your convictions are. Kevin — Don’t die wondering!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Apparently the school in question was not union or the maintenance man would not have loaned his tools.  The teacher would have filled out a work request and submitted it to the board and they would have written a work order to the maintenance man and he would get the things done, in time for next year. My $.03 Not inflation, it’s taxes. My father and I have had several union discussions.  He was and I’m not.  One question was inflation. Do unions cause inflation? My answer:  A three year contract with 10% a year built-in automatically causes the industry (and every value-added process in between the raw material supplier and the consumer.) involved to raise their prices each year. Dad’s answer:  The workers are just catching up to last year’s inflation, not causing next year’s. Needless to say it was never resolved and we dropped it because of family love that might be lost.

Response:

Mary, the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet are probably cable connector pliers, used to tighten and remove MS style screw lock or bayonet lock type connectors.  In general they will have cushioned jaws so as not to break the surface coating, but the pads do get lost.  They save a lot of blisters and knicked knuckles.  They’re used a lot on avionics LRU’s (Line Replacable Units).                 Don – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife is also a teacher. We put together a basic toolbox for her. Unfortunately, everyone in the department now knows about it, so about every 2 years we have to restock it… When the Buckhorn STDN shut down, one of the guys in our Range put together a took box for me after all the good stuff had been picked over by the folks with a real use for it.  I got a set of eight Snap-On screwdrivers, a Snap-On quarter-inch socket set, about five "C" clamps, two or three pairs of dikes, three hammers (from tack to large), a variety of colors of electrician’s tape, a utility knife and a couple of boxes of blades, an electrician’s knife and scissors, three sizes of Crescent wrenches, a pair of Vise-grips, a twist of lock wire, a six-inch steel rule, a clump of cable ties, and a couple of pairs of pliers, all fitted into a snappy little metal tool box.  Since this is all NASA property, it’s available to anyone who needs it, but I’m very stern about getting things returned. I’ve filled in some of the gaps, like tiny screwdrivers, small and needlenose pliers, a tape measure (from the tool crib), lubricants for squeaky chairs and sticking locks, a set of allen wrenches, and a few other things.  Others have also contributed to it, now that there’s a central place to keep such things. This tool kit gets called upon at least once a month and usually more frequently.  When we moved into this building with modular furniture, it suddenly became even more popular as everyone customized their cubicles.  We do have a contractor who will do all the little repairs and assembling that the kit helps with, but using that service requires a work order and several signatures, as well as a wait for anything that’s not an emergency. There’s only one thing that puzzles me and that’s what the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet.  No one I’ve asked has been able to identify them, but current thinking is that they’re for holding cable fittings. — Mary Shafer Senior Handling Qualities Research Engineer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA

Response:

Mary, the pliers with the curved jaws that don’t meet are probably cable connector pliers, used to tighten and remove MS style screw lock or bayonet lock type connectors.  In general they will have cushioned jaws so as not to break the surface coating, but the pads do get lost.  They save a lot of blisters and knicked knuckles.  They’re used a lot on avionics LRU’s (Line Replacable Units).

I don’t think these ever had pads (I’m going to have to take these home tonight and scan them in and put them up on a Web site, so we’ll all be wondering about the same thing) but after searching all the pliers pages in the McMaster-Carr catalog, I’m now convinced they’re either connector pliers or for installing and removing domed lamp covers. Utica, now Cooper, Tool didn’t recognize the number, either. — Mary Shafer Senior Handling Qualities Research Engineer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA

Response:

My really sad comment on this story is that in the District where I work your jaunt into the classroom as well as any use by your daughter of the tools which you purchased for her would have been met with a grievance from the custodial/maintenance union – which they clearly would have won – and subsequent possilble discipline against the teacher involved. Dave Hall

Why don’t you drop all your crap about unions.  No one cares. Tom

Response:

Why don’t you drop all your crap about unions.  No one cares. Tom

oooooh! Touchy. Dave Hall

Response:

Why don’t you drop all your crap about unions.  No one cares. Tom oooooh! Touchy.

Au contraire, Tommy. People do care ‘cuz unions suck. Unions probably drive the price of homes up $50k only to give us worse workmanship and materials as a result. (unions: BTDT once only.)       The more we gripe,      *  http://www.diversify.com/stees.html the longer God makes us live. *  Graphic Design – Humorous T-shirts

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why don’t you drop all your crap about unions.  No one cares. Tom oooooh! Touchy. Au contraire, Tommy. People do care ‘cuz unions suck. Unions probably drive the price of homes up $50k only to give us worse workmanship and materials as a result. (unions: BTDT once only.)       The more we gripe,      *  http://www.diversify.com/stees.html the longer God makes us live. *  Graphic Design – Humorous T-shirts

        Well, since my wife got fired by the damn TEAMSTER’s (she worked for them in one of their offices) when she was on maternity leave to have our son, and just after buying a new house and 2 vehicles…no big deal…it only put us in the hole and struggling for 3 years before we ultimately had to file bankruptcy….so it goes without saying, I’m no fan of unions……

Response:

After many delays I am just about ready to break ground on the new workshop. Its a 1026 sq ft free standing building with 10 ft 2 X 6 walls and scissor ceiling trusses to make it eaven higher. The idea is to use in the slab radiant heat but today I had a couple of people question if that would be sufficient. I am in the Vancouver British Columbia area so the winters are not that bad. Does anyone have any experience with radiant heating? Grizzle

Response:

This is a popular option here in northern Alberta – I have worked in several shops with in floor heating. The only "problem" is the recovery time if you have a large overhead door open in -30

Question:

Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Is the throat plate flat and flush with the table?  Burning when you’re applying downward pressure is a dead giveaway.  One side of your board dips and rubs against the side of the blade.

Response:

Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Response:

Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Most likely make sure blade is aligned to miter slots and fence is also (ie, both will be aligned to each other.) — ~ John Gunterman If you really want to send a direct reply replace the "*" with a "u" in the address ;-(

Response:

I’ve had exactly the same problem, also only with oak.  When I checked I found out that my fence was just a touch out of alignment (back was tilted away from the blade).  After fixing that it got rid of most of the burning, the remainder went away when I put my splitter back on.  I think more than anything it was really the feed speed that affected the burning, the out of alignment table fence and pinching without the splitter just slowed down my feed speed and through that caused more burning.  It still burns a little when I’m doing thick stock but most of the problem is gone. Hope that helps, Joe P. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Joseph B. Paperman Assistant Professor of Accounting School of Business Administration University of Washington Box 353200 Seattle, WA  98195-3200

Response:

Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Your fence is probably a little out of alignment.  A quick check is to rip a few inches into a board, shut the saw off and flip the board to the back of the blade and look.  There is also the possibility that your table is not square to the blade so check and make sure your miter slots are parallel to the blade. You can use a pencil held against your miter attachment and make sure the same tooth just barely kisses the pencil tip on the back and front sides of the table slot. Provided every thing else lines up you may want to slightly offset your fence just a little bit on the back side of the blade. Tom

Response:

Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ?

Probably not. When the work is passing the blade there is nothing to hold it against the fence and it tends to creep into the blade, then it burns it slightly. If it burns a lot that is a different problem. The best remedy is to somehow keep the work against the fence and using the splitter is a good choice. Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Could be a little. Use a sliding bevel gauge placed along the heel and toe of the blade to check the distance to the fence.

:{) Lorne

Response:

When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence.

Sounds like your fence is not parallel to the blade – ie it’s a little closer at the back end.  Align it so it’s perfectly parallel.  If your fence doesn’t have a precise way of doing that (like a sears fence doesn’t), err towards having the fence slightly farther away from the blade at the back. Does this mean that blade is getting dull ?

Not at all. Rich

Response:

It may be time to take a close look at the blade/fence alignment there Art. sounds like the fence may be toeing in a bit. Also, if you’ve been cutting a lot of sappy wood such as pine  your blade may be a tad gummy with resins. You’ll be able to see that ofcourse so if your blade has a nasty care of brown goop on it cleaning will help. Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

A thought Lolo Mt. URL http://www.marsweb.com/mtcowboy

Response:

Howdy again Art I almost forgot, and no offence intended, but, since you find it necessary to ask I would suggest that you may be depending on repeatability a bit to much. It would not be a bad idea to carry a small  engineering square in your pocket to check your miter guage and check the alingement of your fence whenever you are doing any kind of a critical cut . Trust me, once you get in the habit it will become automatic and you won’t be wondering  and asking if your saw is out of alignment when things go wrong.  It’s a bit like never checking the tread on your tires  and asking the cop if you should have after you slide into the rear end of another car. Hi, When ripping oak boards I’m burning the boards on only one side. The side between the blade and fence. It seems to happen more often when I go slow than when I really "push" the board thru. It only seems to happen with oak. I’m using a caribide tipped combination blade. It’s less than 6 months old (maybe 4 hours of cut time). Does this mean that blade is getting dull ? Does it mean that the blade or fence is out of allignment ?

Another thought Lolo Mt. URL http://www.marsweb.com/mtcowboy

Response:

Provided every thing else lines up you may want to slightly offset your fence just a little bit on the back side of the blade.

A very interesting statement Tom!  My fence came with it slightly wider to the back of the blade that to the front.  I always figured that since it was the front of the blade that does the cutting, no harm.   I.ve been using it like that for about 8 years now with no problems that *I* can detect.   Jim

Response:

Line your fence with wood stock from the front of the table to the blade and stop there, therefore the rear of the fence don’t matter. — – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Provided every thing else lines up you may want to slightly offset your fence just a little bit on the back side of the blade. A very interesting statement Tom!  My fence came with it slightly wider to the back of the blade that to the front.  I always figured that since it was the front of the blade that does the cutting, no harm. I.ve been using it like that for about 8 years now with no problems that *I* can detect.   Jim

Response:

Question:

The best thing about boats is that you never have to push them uphill at 1:00 am so you can coast them down the other side to the gas station. And when a nice man finally stopped to help me, he was worried about letting me walk home "in this neighborhood."  A block from my apartment.  ooops. Am I right in believing that the north atlantic doesn’t have "those kind of neighborhoods"? Reasons I want a (bigger) boat to live on:        - don’t have to push up hill…        - can put the *&%^ car out of its misery for good and take the train            (live in the city but not in the city)  (?)        - impossible to leave 2 weeks worth of dishes in the sink !!!        - no landlady heating home to 90 degrees        - rocked to sleep        - rocked awake        - my own place        - women at parties thinking I’m incredibly different and attractive for          living on a boat (?)        - perfect excuse for missed lab deadlines  ;-)        - feel like I’m sailing whenever I’m home        - lower rent          - being forced to learn more focus, in a way I’d enjoy        - being forced to cut down on possessions        - don’t have to drive almost a hour to go sailing        - closer to nature        - less cleaning & basic housework        - amazing sunsets        - instant cure for umpeenth midlife crisis Did I miss anything? Karina —                            –  Comet #2970  <– It looks like a boat. ***  It leaks like a boat.  ***  It must be a boat.

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The best thing about boats is that you never have to push them uphill at 1:00 am so you can coast them down the other side to the gas station.

** Fun stuff about living aboard deleted ** Reasons for thinking twice:         That first leak in the basement might be a REAL bummer         You never have to haul and paint an apartment         No 90-degree heat in february         Cabin fever But, then, I’m being a poop….go for it! Cheers! Scott

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Reasons I want a (bigger) boat to live on:       – don’t have to push up hill…

But if you run aground you may still have to get out and push, and you get very wet.  Boats are subject to more ills than cars or houses and it is often more difficult to get them taken care of without a lot of work or expense.       – can put the *&%^ car out of its misery for good and take the train           (live in the city but not in the city)  (?)

Having a boat doesn’t make it any easier to get around town; you just have two vehicles to feed and service.       – impossible to leave 2 weeks worth of dishes in the sink !!!

Where there is a will, there is a way!       – no landlady heating home to 90 degrees

No, you just put up with whatever the weather sends you.       – rocked to sleep

Can be nice, if it isn’t TOO rocky and you aren’t worried about the anchor or docklines.       – rocked awake

Yeah, in the middle of the night if the weather blows up or some bozo in a powerboat roars past.       – my own place

Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable and a house won’t sink.       – women at parties thinking I’m incredibly different and attractive for         living on a boat (?)

Hmm.  I haven’t found that woman yet, but I’m still looking!       – perfect excuse for missed lab deadlines  ;-)

Good luck!       – feel like I’m sailing whenever I’m home

No, you’re with your boat if you truly love it, but you aren’t sailing until you cast off the lines.       – lower rent  

Overall, it is a somewhat cheaper life lifestyle, but slip rent can be very high in some urban areas.  Anchoring out is a real pain if you have shoreside obligations, like a job.       – being forced to learn more focus, in a way I’d enjoy

There are at least as many distractions, probably more.       – being forced to cut down on possessions

True, in spades!  This is the hardest and most difficult aspect.       – don’t have to drive almost a hour to go sailing

No, but now you have to stow your house to go sailing.  Most people don’t realise what a hassle this is until they actually live aboard full time.  Most live-aboards do very little casual sailing.  It is just too much trouble to get ready for it.  It probably IS easier to take off for a short cruise, however.  You don’t have to move stuff on and off the boat.       – closer to nature

Some places.       – less cleaning & basic housework

Well, less area, but it gets dirty or cluttered faster, and now you have the joys of a marine head, a basement full of bilgewater, servicing the engine in the living room, etc.       – amazing sunsets

Some places.       – instant cure for umpeenth midlife crisis

You may have to try that to find out! Did I miss anything?

Most people are surprised that the social life can be a major attraction.   Live aboard marinas are real little communities and often very lively in a way that is rare at apartment complexes or suburban neighborhoods. And finally, there is the freedom of being able to cast off the lines if you get bored or annoyed at where you are! Give it a try! Mike Michael H. Hughes                       Aboard, S/V Marynya (Alberg 37 yawl)

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-*—- Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable …

The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so? Russell — Galbraith’s Law of Human Nature: Faced with the choice between changing one’s mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everybody gets busy on the proof.

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      – my own place Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable and a house won’t sink.

Well, the interest is, isn’t it? dsc

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Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so?

Well, before I bought my boat I checked with the IRS, to see if it would qualify for interest deduction as a _second_ home.  Their words: "The interest is deductible if it is used as a second home" (Whatever that means).  They wouldn’t get more specific. I have seen interpretations with the criteria being that the boat has a place to sleep, cook, and a bathroom.  While this may reasonably apply to the IRS statement, I have also known people who have interpreted these somewhat loosely.  But a sleeping bag in the cockpit, a can of sterno, and a bucket? Also, it seems that almost every year legislation is introduced in Congress to remove this deduction, so maybe we shouldn’t keep counting on it.  It always seems to fail, however.  I guess too many congresspeople have boats! Andy

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-*—- Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so? Russell

Yes, its ture, with the caveat that the boat has to offer similar living accomodations as a house,i. e., it has to have sleeping accomodations, a toilet of some sort, and a cooking area. Pete

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Reasons I want a (bigger) boat to live on:       – can put the *&%^ car out of its misery for good and take the train

But you’ll still have an engine and an electrical system to maintain, both of which may be ridiculously inaccessible.       – no landlady heating home to 90 degrees

Just dripping portlights and mildew from condensation in the winter.  :-)       – perfect excuse for missed lab deadlines  ;-)

It does make for great "sick day" excuses ("My stuffing box is leaking and if I don’t fix it today, the boat could sink"; no questions asked because your boss doesn’t know what the heck a stuffing box is, but it sounds serious!).       – lower rent  

Not when you figure in slip fee, plus liveaboard fee, plus your boat loan payment (assuming you don’t anchor out or sneakaboard).       – being forced to learn more focus, in a way I’d enjoy

If making the boat the center of your life is what you enjoy most, and you don’t mind giving up most everything else.  Let me know if you find a way to include landlubber activities in your life when you’re preparing a boat for cruising in the near future!  :-)       – being forced to cut down on possessions

This was incredibly liberating for us (not that we had much to start out with in the way of a house or furniture).       – closer to nature

This would be closer to the top of my list.       – less cleaning & basic housework

Not even true for a minute!  Granted the space is smaller, but the list of tasks is much longer.  If you keep the hatches open during all but the rainiest and coldest weather (to get "closer to nature"!) you will find surfaces getting dirty as soon as they’ve been dusted/vacuumed.  And besides schlepping your laundry to a laundromat or up to the marina facilities, don’t forget polishing the bronze clock, barometer, lamp(s), portlights (if you’re a real perfectionist!) stainless steel bowsprit, pushpit, stanchions, and bow pulpits, cleaning and waxing the lifelines, washing down the exterior of the boat (which can get as dirty as your car does when it just sits in a parking lot), waxing the fiberglass, oiling or varnishing the teak, and scrubbing the hull/bottom.  Granted this is all under the heading of "boat maintenance" but it’s still cleaning and you’re never finished with most of it (and some of it you don’t even get around to because of all the other things that invariably need fixing or improving). Did I miss anything?

Yes!  The wonderful, amazing comraderie of your marina neighbors.  The nicest community of people I’ve ever been a part of, and I wouldn’t trade it for a minute, even though my whole body aches from doing some of the above this past weekend.  :-) — Linda V. Hill NAKIA, Hans Christian 33, Grand Marina, Alameda, CA

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-*—- Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so?

We have been deducting the interest on our boat loan, since the boat is our residence.  This past summer there was a bill(?) in the California legislature that would prevent us from deducting it on our state income tax. I never heard for certain what the outcome was. Don’t forget, in some places you will have to pay property tax on your unusual home (we do, in Alameda County, California). — Linda V. Hill NAKIA, Hans Christian 33, Grand Marina, Alameda, CA

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Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so? Well, before I bought my boat I checked with the IRS, to see if it would qualify for interest deduction as a _second_ home.  Their words: "The interest is deductible if it is used as a second home" (Whatever that means).  They wouldn’t get more specific.

I don’t know the exact number of weeks, but my understanding is that you must spend a certain portion of the year in your cabin/boat/house to have it qualify as a "second home" (and be able to prove it with documentation, I would imagine). — Linda V. Hill NAKIA, Hans Christian 33, Grand Marina, Alameda, CA

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: -*—- : Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … : The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a : home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can : someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so? You don’t have to live-aboard to deduct the mortgage from a boat. The IRS is quite clear when you talk to them about boats. They are second homes if you have a head, galley and are onboard for a certain amount of time during the year. I do live-aboard and I’m doing this now; but when I owned my condo, we were still allowed the deductions from the boat as a normal itemized deduction. If you itemize there is no big deal here. You can even take major improvements (just like a house) to your boat off your taxes – but you would be wise to get a loan for that also for documentation – but it is possible. In some cases the bank may provide a special IRS form to you or the IRS that deals with this sort of thing. Do what I do if you are unsure about an IRS item – talk to the IRS, they will send you the necessary forms and tell you just how to do it…. —

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-*—- …  This past summer there was a bill(?) in the California legislature that would prevent us from deducting it on our state income tax. …

A *state* income tax!  How barbaric. Russell — Galbraith’s Law of Human Nature: Faced with the choice between changing one’s mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everybody gets busy on the proof.

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… You can even take major improvements (just like a house) to your boat off your taxes – …

??? Please explain this! Do you mean the interest on these improvements?  Do you mean you make less profit (haha) when you sell it.  Or is this in relation to operating the boat as a business? Thanks Andy

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-*—- Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so?

Check with Boat/U.S. for details, but if the boat has all of: a head, sleeping arrangements (bunks), and cooking facilities then the boat is a "secondary residence" and the loan is deductable as a mortgage. Basically the test is that one *could* live on board for some time, i.e. more than a weekend. I deducted the interest on my MacGregor 26 on this basis and had it accepted without question for three tax years. — BOBS BEST BENT WIRE SK

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… I don’t know the exact number of weeks, but my understanding is that

you must spend a certain portion of the year in your cabin/boat/house to have it qualify as a "second home" (and be able to prove it with documentation, I would imagine).

Something along the lines of the number of weeks Congress is in session ought to do it.  Most members have second houses in Washington.  Hence the deduction?  Naaaaah… BILL

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Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so?

I beleive that to be true… your primary residence what ever it may be is usually interest deductible. Well, before I bought my boat I checked with the IRS, to see if it would qualify for interest deduction as a _second_ home.  Their words: "The interest is deductible if it is used as a second home" (Whatever that means).  They wouldn’t get more specific.

The rules may very well be different for second homes vs only home. The way I understand it almost every cuddy cabin power boat sold today qualifies for second home status. The smaller ones usually have a porta-potty, sink with a few gallons of fresh water, and a v-berth for sleeping. Something to this effect was printed in a magazine sometime back. dsc

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Reasons I want a (bigger) boat to live on:       – can put the *&%^ car out of its misery for good and take the train

But you’ll still have an engine and an electrical system to maintain, both Or better yet, get a job at company whose office is in a marina (e.g. ASK/Ingres) and walk up the gangway, and into work! all under the heading of "boat maintenance" but it’s still cleaning and you’re never finished with most of it (and some of it you don’t even get around to because of all the other things that invariably need fixing or improving).

On the other hand, if you have a house and a boat, there are always conflicting needs, and the commute to the boat preventing you from getting things done on the boat except during prime sailing season. Unless your boat is on a dock behind your home (luxury). Did I miss anything? Yes!  The wonderful, amazing comraderie of your marina neighbors.  The nicest community of people I’ve ever been a part of, and I wouldn’t trade it for a minute, even though my whole body aches from doing some of the above this past weekend.  :-)

Agreed. Marina folk are wonderful, especially at some of the SF Bay Area venues (Oyster Cove comes to mind). The down side of that is the sometimes constant spirit of leisure and party that prevails, sort of like a ‘little Carribean.’ To quote Clearwater comrade Rick Nestler:                 Way down in the Carribean                 it’s so hard to get things done                 it’s enough to drive you insane                 between the sun and the rum and the rain! One thing you lose, as a liveaboard, is the boat as a ‘getaway.’ It’s where you live. I have to admit, I always enjoyed the feeling of being ‘away’ when I was aboard. Something changes when the phone rings in the cabin for the first time! Greg

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I don’t know the exact number of weeks, but my understanding is that you must spend a certain portion of the year in your cabin/boat/house to have it qualify as a "second home" (and be able to prove it with documentation, I would imagine).

For me it was easy. If asked, I simply said "I’m there every weekend. Let’s see, that’s fifty-two times two…" Greg

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SA.gov writes: Costs as much as a house, the loan isn’t deductable … The last I read, if one lives aboard, the IRS considers it a home and the mortgage interest is indeed deductible.  Can someone authoritatively say if this is or isn’t so? I beleive that to be true… your primary residence what ever it may be is usually interest deductible. Well, before I bought my boat I checked with the IRS, to see if it would qualify for interest deduction as a _second_ home.  Their words: "The interest is deductible if it is used as a second home" (Whatever that means).  They wouldn’t get more specific. The rules may very well be different for second homes vs only home. The way I understand it almost every cuddy cabin power boat sold today qualifies for second home status. The smaller ones usually have a porta-potty, sink with a few gallons of fresh water, and a v-berth for sleeping. Something to this effect was printed in a magazine sometime back. dsc I have been following this discussion now for several days and I would like

to offer my criteria sine we have been doing this for several years now.      The boat should have a separate galley–a separate bearth–and a separate      and enclosed head. The vessel must be occupied a minimum of 14 days      although they need not be consecutive days. The mortgage must be part of      the ships papers but the boat may or may not be documented(lending      institutions will probably require documentation in order to secure the      mortgage).      The above criteria will probably eliminate any vessel under 21 feet(the      head requirement is the clincher here) however it may or may not exclude      a 40 foot racing power boat(the boat may be all engins and gas tanks with      little or no living space aboard).      Currently in the eyes of the IRS there is no difference between a house      floating on the water in a marina and a chalet sitting on a hillside at a      ski resort. There are a lot of politicians who would like to change this      and they’re the ones with the chalets at the ski resorts. Somehow this      doesn’t seem fair to me—-BUT–Boaters are always coming up on the short      end of the stick.      Join BOAT/US and keep plugging away–we can still continue to win this!!      Brent Rhoads,RPH      Lehigh Univ Health Center      Bethlehem, PA 18015

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …The vessel must be occupied   a minimum of 14 days although they need not be consecutive   days. The mortgage must be part of the ships papers but the   boat may or may not be documented(lending institutions will   probably require documentation in order to secure the   mortgage). My question is: Is this actually the law, or is it somebody’s interpretation, opinion, or what.  Based on my conversations with the IRS, there are no such objective criteria.  What are your sources?

I would like to point out there is often a wide gap between what is law, what is regulation, and what the IntRevService chooses to try and enforce. There are many cases where the US TAX Court and the IntRevService disagree. The IntRevService often chooses to still try and enforce regulations the TAX Courts have rejected.  It’s up to the tax payer to decide if it is worth fighting them in court. This may all be further clouded by the Accountants interpretation of what is being enforced based on summaries written regarding diverse subjects such as passive activity, rental income, vacation and 2nd home mortgages etc. joel

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – [For interest on the loan to qualify for a tax deduction as a home mortgage...] …The vessel must be occupied   a minimum of 14 days although they need not be consecutive   days. The mortgage must be part of the ships papers but the   boat may or may not be documented(lending institutions will   probably require documentation in order to secure the   mortgage). My question is: Is this actually the law, or is it somebody’s interpretation, opinion, or what.  Based on my conversations with the IRS, there are no such objective criteria.  What are your sources?

According to Boat/US there is no such requirement, only the equipment needs to be there.  The loan does have to be secured by the boat though, as a mortgage or chattel. But, to try to be consistent with my question above, I must state that this is only _my_ understanding; I am not a tax lawyer.

Nor am I, I only repeat what I have read in the Boat/US magazines. — BOBS BEST BENT WIRE SK

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[For interest on the loan to qualify for a tax deduction as a home mortgage...]   The boat should have a separate galley–a separate bearth– …and a separate and enclosed head. The vessel must be occupied   a minimum of 14 days although they need not be consecutive   days. The mortgage must be part of the ships papers but the   boat may or may not be documented(lending institutions will   probably require documentation in order to secure the   mortgage).

My question is: Is this actually the law, or is it somebody’s interpretation, opinion, or what.  Based on my conversations with the IRS, there are no such objective criteria.  What are your sources? The 14 days above may be a perversion of the rules regarding personal use of property held for _business_ use.  It is my understanding that if you claim that your boat (or rental house, for that matter) is a *business* (thus allowing you more tax deductions, for such things as maintenance and depreciation), then the rules allow you a _maximum_ of 14 days of personal use. I have heard this 14 day rule misquoted in many forms.  I was told that if I charter my boat, I could only use it myself 14 days per year.  UNTRUE!!  By using it over 14 days per year, I must treat the boat as a "hobby" for tax purposes, and cannot deduct the depreciation, etc. against the charter income. But, to try to be consistent with my question above, I must state that this is only _my_ understanding; I am not a tax lawyer. Andy Germain   CSY-44: Fantasea                (available for charter next season – Annapolis MD)

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Question:

| "I’m getting sick and tired of that question," said Koch.  "We have a | charitable foundation that cannot engage in any business activities or any | partnership with any business activities.  We will not endanger the tax | status of our foundation, which has a charitable purpose.  Nor will we | make any deals that could compromise any promises I’ve made with my crew.   | End of subject.  It will not happen." | So apparently Bill Koch will _NOT_ let Dennis sail A^3 if he wins the | right to defend the Cup. Sh#%^*. What about selling A^3 to DC for a penny. That won’t break any law. philippe

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I’ve also heard that DC is a jerk, but I’ve been very surprised listening to him during this defender series. It’s been my experience that you can really find out a lot about a person by sailing with them, even moreso racing with them, when they’re at the helm. He really comes across as a person of moderate temper, who praises his crew even when they lose, doesn’t blame other people, never yells "What’s taking so long up there?", and is actually almost humble when asked about his chances in interviews. –Cy–

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writes: the greatest sailing acheivement, above all the ocean racing and AC stuff, was winning the Star Worlds with straight bullets; how that had never been done before and probably wouldn’t ever again. What he didn’t mention was the next year Buddy Melges, in (I believe(?)) his first year in Stars, beat Dennis at the Worlds.

Didn’t Jack and Jim Linville win the Tempest worlds once (back when the Tempest was an Olympic class, and DC was sailing ‘em) with a _throwout_ bullet? Has that ever been done before or since in an Olympic class? Sonar 404|Laser ???|Gem 21

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[...]  I think Bill Koch would offer his boat if he got beat, I not sure Dennis would if the roles were reversed.   [...] Like him or not as person, you have to respect his abilities, and hope he beats A3 and gets to use thier boat.

From the 4/29 San Diego Union-Tribune: For only about the 50th time Koch was asked if he would allow Conner to sail America^3 in the Cup. "I’m getting sick and tired of that question," said Koch.  "We have a charitable foundation that cannot engage in any business activities or any partnership with any business activities.  We will not endanger the tax status of our foundation, which has a charitable purpose.  Nor will we make any deals that could compromise any promises I’ve made with my crew.   End of subject.  It will not happen." So apparently Bill Koch will _NOT_ let Dennis sail A^3 if he wins the right to defend the Cup. All opinions expressed are mine, and do not reflect those of my employer. "First thing we do, we kill all the lawyers." – Shakespeare

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Big Dennis [...] Like him or not as person, you have to respect his abilities, and hope he beats A3 and gets to use thier boat.

Why would he want to use a boat that he just beat? Seriously, Stars and Stripes is quite a fast boat … IN THE CONDITIONS that he’s done well in. In a choppy sea or stronger wind he’s had his ass kicked. I think A3 has made a few mistakes, but mostly tactical. They took the lead yesterday (Wed.) by tacking into the safe leeward. I’ve seen them tack away in the exact same circumstances. Also Koch was turning the boat too fast and screwing up the genneker jibes. I really have to wonder who’s fault it is that they don’t seem to learn sometimes. Koch CAN make the boat move when he’s behind the wheel, he’s gained on a few of the upwind legs he’s steered on. He may not be a great sailor, but he’s a good one. During todays race DC stood with one arm on the wheel and one on his hip as A3 was speeding to windward and said over the ESPN mic. "I’ve never seen a boat that fast, thats beautiful" Doesen’t sound like the classless fool some of you make him out to be. Lighten up a bit, he knows a good boat and crew when he see’s it. he didn’t make excuses, he gave credit where credit was due.

Talking about how fast the other boat is and saying anyone could win with it sounds like an excuse to me. I’ve wondered about his sandbagging also, explain why he would do this at this point, what can he gain?

First "prove" how fast the other boat is, then "prove" how much better sailor he is to beat the faster boat? Actually, it seems more likely to me that A3 is sandbagging. I had an AC experience that will never happen again. [...] At the end of the day they gave me a short ride on Courageous.  This would not happen today.  Thanks Dennis!  (with help from Mr. Bond and Mr. Fay)  

Look, it’s the biggest and most visable contest in sailing. Part of the appeal of sailing on Courageous was that it was involved in a prestigeous event, so don’t claim you’re immune from the appeal of big events. As for the controversy and protesting, those who watch football, etc.: how many times have you been ready to kill the referee? I’m enjoying it. I don’t watch most televised sports. I like saying to strangers "watch the race?" to get revenge for the thousands of "watch the game"’s I’ve been subjected to over the years . NYT’s coverage of THE CUP has been, charitably speaking, very spotty.  I’m astonished that they’d devote so much space to silly things like Steinbrenner’s juvenile antics, and so little to covering yachting, generally, and the cup, specifically.

I’ve noticed the same thing in TV news. My theory is that it goes further than wasting 20 seconds on cup coverage. The "sportscasters" are afraid of losing the "good old boy" image they’ve worked hard to cultivate by talking about sailing. Also in other news, they’re too busy talking  about Bush and Clinton every night to talk about alternative politics even 20 seconds a month. bill s

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not true! I think anyone could respect his tenacity, sailing ability and his dedication to the sport.  However, those of us who knew him years ago and those who know him now all agree that he is not a likable person. People who live their lives vicariously and only know DC from his attempts at self-glorification (his books) or through the mouth of some dimwitted ESPN announcer and don’t sail themselves, routinely fall all over themselves fawning over DC.  Basically DC is a dickweed and folks who think he is a great guy are too. DC is pretty universally disliked within SDYC.  In fact there are two reasons that SDYC is not the organizing committee for the ‘92 AC.  One is financial.  The other (main) reason is that the board of SDYC did not want to support or give the appearance of supporting TDC. Dave Rogers                                                         M & R Software, Inc. On contract to: NEC America, Radio Software Dept Don’t take life too seriously; you’re not going to get out of it alive anyway.

Thank God someone else has pointed this out!! I’m expecting the ESPN guys to erect a monument to DC, or commit suicide if A^3 wins. Most nights I feel like I’m going to gag just listening to them "That man, that team, that boat" "the Houdini"…on and on and on…ad nauseum.` If A^3 makes an error they go one about what morons they are for 5 minutes. If DC makes an error, it an oh well it happens. I could go on, but why bother? I realize that at least 2 of the ESPN guys are sailors themselves, and friends of DC, but they could at least try to be objective. Yes, I too respect DC for his ability, and tenacity, I’m especially impressed with the way he handles his crew on the water. But, I’m really getting tired of this worship of a man who is basically a dickhead.

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I’m expecting the ESPN guys to erect a monument to DC, or commit suicide if A^3 wins. Most nights I feel like I’m going to gag just listening to them "That man, that team, that boat" "the Houdini"…on and on and on…ad nauseum.` If A^3 makes an error they go one about what morons they are for 5 minutes. If DC makes an error, it an oh well it happens. I could go on, but why bother?

   I’m watching the same stuff on TV, but don’t get the same impression. Maybe it’s because the A^3 team team makes a few more mistakes? I think most of what you object to has been uttered by that idiot Jim Kelly. I can’t remember too much adulation coming from either Jobson or Isler. I realize that at least 2 of the ESPN guys are sailors themselves, and friends of DC, but they could at least try to be objective.

   I’ve got to object to this. Gary Jobson can in no way be considered a friend of Dennis Connor. A friendly aquaintance, maybe; but more often a rival. Jobson sailed with Tom Blackaller in ‘83 for the Defender Syndicate, and I think began again with Blackaller for the ‘87 challenge before getting a more lucrative deal from ESPN. And as I’m sure you’ll all remember, he was a big man in the A^3 syndicate before he decided there were too many chiefs there for his taste (I suppose).    Peter Isler has sailed with DC for many years, but decided he would try to mount his own challenge this year. He never got enough funding to get it off the ground. Yes, I too respect DC for his ability, and tenacity, I’m especially impressed with the way he handles his crew on the water. But, I’m really getting tired of this worship of a man who is basically a dickhead.

   An awful lot of the people on Stars and Stripes have sailed with DC for a great many years. I find it hard to believe they would stay with him (especially Tom Whidden, who could certainly get any ride he wants) if DC was as big a jerk as everyone seems to think he is.    I was at a talk by Britton Chance last year at mystic. Chance is one of S&S’s designers, and has worked with DC for a number of years. Someone in the audience asked why he (Chance) would work with such a jerk (Conner). Chance said that Connor has a way of giving people a bad impression of himself, but that those who really know him like him a lot. I’ve never met the man, so I’ll reserve judgement on him till I do. At least he doesn’t send me a begging letter every month (as A^3 does) asking for money.    I will say this, if Stars and Stripes was as good a boat as America^3, there’s no doubt in my mind who would be winning the Defender’s finals. Wayne Simpson (no fancy .sig this time)

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If A^3 makes an error they go one about what morons they are for 5 minutes. If DC makes an error, it an oh well it happens. I could go on, but why bother?

I wouldn’t know about this, at the bar where I’ve been watching the races, you can’t hear the sound. Maybe you should try turning down the audio. I haven’t been watching since Dennis started winning, I’ve been doing so much %$$%#)(#& sailing! People keep asking me, and I’m having trouble turning them down. Not being able to hear the sound has some other big advantages, what with ‘uh-huh’ month and all. — Homewood Computing Facilities, Johns Hopkins University, Balto. Md. 21218 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – * OLX 2.1 * ease!Trim!eeeaaaassse!trimtrimTRIMeeeeeeeaaaaaasse!trimea

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I think DC is the most skilled sailor in the AC  with the best chance of defending … NOT!  As a matter of fact, I rate Dennis dead last when compared to Melges, Cayard and Davis.  Buddy is by far the best I ever sailed against.  He is a genius and a gentleman.  I have the utmost respect for him and his team.   stuff deleted average boat very well, but this is his local water knowing where the shifts will be before you get there is a big advantage.  I also think he is sandbagging just like in ‘83.  His boat is not as slow as he’d like everyone to think it is.  Drop him in a scow in the great lakes .vs. Buddy and I say Buddy laps him on a 20 mile course.

I will defer to your judgement in this; by best chance of defending I meant in the local conditions where his experience seems invaluable. I’ve wondered about his sandbagging also, explain why he would do this at this point, what can he gain? What is you opinion of pulling Davis off the NZ boat?  Was this a panic move (equivilent to pulling Randal Cunningham out of the Eagles playoff game) or was it the correct move? Ed Doc

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -(Cliff Coombs) writes: I’m not sure why I want to jump in here but… I think DC is the most skilled sailor in the AC  with the best chance of defending and I hope Koch gives him a boat to aid the defense, (if he manages to hang on and win). NOT!  As a matter of fact, I rate Dennis dead last when compared to Melges, Cayard and Davis.  Buddy is by far the best I ever sailed against.  He is a genius and a gentleman.  I have the utmost respect for him and his team.  I just wish Bill Koch would take a step back, but I guess if I just spent 60 mil, I’d micro-manage too.  I think Bill Koch would offer his boat if he got beat, I not sure Dennis would if the roles were reversed.  To Dennis’s credit he has sailed an average boat very well, but this is his local water knowing where the shifts will be before you get there is a big advantage.  I also think he is sandbagging just like in ‘83.  His boat is not as slow as he’d like everyone to think it is.  Drop him in a scow in the great lakes ..vs. Buddy and I say Buddy laps him on a 20 mile course.

Apropos this discussion: in a recent issue of Sailing World they had some kind of 30-year retrospective interview with Dennis. Dennis made some comment to the effect that the greatest sailing acheivement, above all the ocean racing and AC stuff, was winning the Star Worlds with straight bullets; how that had never been done before and probably wouldn’t ever again. What he didn’t mention was the next year Buddy Melges, in (I believe(?)) his first year in Stars, beat Dennis at the Worlds. However I would not rate Dennis dead last among any of these sailors. Whatever anybody may think of him personally he’s as good a sailor as anyone on the water. His performance in these defender series has only increased my respect for Dennis as a racer.

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Not true! I think anyone could respect his tenacity, sailing ability and his dedication to the sport.  However, those of us who knew him years ago and those who know him now all agree that he is not a likable person. People who live their lives vicariously and only know DC from his attempts at self-glorification (his books) or through the mouth of some dimwitted ESPN announcer and don’t sail themselves, routinely fall all over themselves fawning over DC.  Basically DC is a dickweed and folks who think he is a great guy are too. DC is pretty universally disliked within SDYC.  In fact there are two reasons that SDYC is not the organizing committee for the ‘92 AC.  One is financial.  The other (main) reason is that the board of SDYC did not want to support or give the appearance of supporting TDC. Dave Rogers                                                     M & R Software, Inc. On contract to: NEC America, Radio Software Dept Don’t take life too seriously; you’re not going to get out of it alive anyway.

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Not true! I think anyone could respect his tenacity, sailing ability and his dedication to the sport.  However, those of us who knew him years ago and those who know him now all agree that he is not a likable person. People who live their lives vicariously and only know DC from his attempts at self-glorification (his books) or through the mouth of some dimwitted ESPN announcer and don’t sail themselves, routinely fall all over themselves fawning over DC.  Basically DC is a dickweed and folks who think he is a great guy are too.

The ESPN announcers were telling a story this weekend about how Dennis’s dog had been attacked by another dog.  Dennis intervened and bit the attacking dog’s ear off.   I don’t know if it is true, but it sounded like something he would do. Will — *                    REAL BOATS DON’T HAVE CABINS                         *

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not true! I think anyone could respect his tenacity, sailing ability and his dedication to the sport.  However, those of us who knew him years ago and those who know him now all agree that he is not a likable person. People who live their lives vicariously and only know DC from his attempts at self-glorification (his books) or through the mouth of some dimwitted ESPN announcer and don’t sail themselves, routinely fall all over themselves fawning over DC.  Basically DC is a dickweed and folks who think he is a great guy are too. DC is pretty universally disliked within SDYC.  In fact there are two reasons that SDYC is not the organizing committee for the ‘92 AC.  One is financial.  The other (main) reason is that the board of SDYC did not want to support or give the appearance of supporting TDC.

It’s interesting (to me) to get the opinion of someone with some personal experience.  I get to sail occasionally and I admire DC for his (to me) obvious skill at his sport,  the same way I admire John Kruk (baseball).  I’m not terribly interested in his personality, (I strongly suspect Kruk is a much nicer person), I’ll never meet either so it doesn’t matter. I also suspect Bill Koch (or any of the others) will never buy me a beer either, my personal experience is most rich folks are dickweeds. I think DC is the most skilled sailor in the AC  with the best chance of defending and I hope Koch gives him a boat to aid the defense, (if he manages to hang on and win). Go Dennis! Ed Doc

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| | On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land | is out of the picture… | Yeah. Now if (Sir, ha!) Michael "I’m gonna sue" Fay would either … Well, I was going to reply to this but then thought that it was not really worth it. But an interesting point is that if it wasn’t for Fay, there would be a lot of bored people sitting off San Deigo in pigs of boats which they call 12 metres!

Well, if it weren’t for Fay’s attempt to steal the cup the last AC would have been a real race rather then the dumb-ass court battle that it turned into.  Frankly I don’t see that IACC boats are that much more excting to watch on TV then 12s;  accept for the fact that they get around the course a little faster the races are the same.  But, hey, that’s all over now, and as you say hardly worht losing any more time over.  I’m just happy that the raceing is more interesting this time around… ciao, -tom. —

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I’m not sure why I want to jump in here but… Not true! I think anyone could respect his tenacity, sailing ability and his dedication to the sport.  However, those of us who knew him years ago and those who know him now all agree that he is not a likable person. People who live their lives vicariously and only know DC from his attempts at self-glorification (his books) or through the mouth of some dimwitted ESPN announcer and don’t sail themselves, routinely fall all over themselves fawning over DC.  Basically DC is a dickweed and folks who think he is a great guy are too.

I have to agree with Dave on this.  The folks I know, that know Dennis, think he’s a jerk.  Personally I’ll never forgive him for losing The Cup in the first place.  Dust off and replay the tape of the final leg of the seventh race in ‘83.  An expert sailor should have had no problem holding off the Aussies.  Dennis is also largely responsible for turning The Cup into a half billion dollar hoopla.   Ed Doc writes… It’s interesting (to me) to get the opinion of someone with some personal experience.  I get to sail occasionally and I admire DC for his (to me) obvious skill at his sport,  the same way I admire John Kruk (baseball).  I’m not terribly interested in his personality, (I strongly suspect Kruk is a much nicer person), I’ll never meet either so it doesn’t matter. I also suspect Bill Koch (or any of the others) will never buy me a beer either, my personal experience is most rich folks are dickweeds.

Neither of these guys will probably buy me a beer either.  But before this cup stuff got too carried away, I had an AC experience that will never happen again.  Summer of ‘83 I was bicycling from NJ to Boston. When I passed through Newport, RI, I stayed for a few days.  I went down to the docks and watched as they pulled Courageous out of the water.  I spotted Bill Campbell (now with A^3) and re-introduced myself. I met Bill the year before while instructing junior sailors at Toms River Yacht Club, his home club. I asked him if he knew anyone that was going out the next day to watch them pactice.  He invited me to go out on the tender the next day.  At the end of the day they gave me a short ride on Courageous.  This would not happen today.  Thanks Dennis!  (with help from Mr. Bond and Mr. Fay)   I think DC is the most skilled sailor in the AC  with the best chance of defending and I hope Koch gives him a boat to aid the defense, (if he manages to hang on and win).

NOT!  As a matter of fact, I rate Dennis dead last when compared to Melges, Cayard and Davis.  Buddy is by far the best I ever sailed against.  He is a genius and a gentleman.  I have the utmost respect for him and his team.  I just wish Bill Koch would take a step back, but I guess if I just spent 60 mil, I’d micro-manage too.  I think Bill Koch would offer his boat if he got beat, I not sure Dennis would if the roles were reversed.  To Dennis’s credit he has sailed an average boat very well, but this is his local water knowing where the shifts will be before you get there is a big advantage.  I also think he is sandbagging just like in ‘83.  His boat is not as slow as he’d like everyone to think it is.  Drop him in a scow in the great lakes .vs. Buddy and I say Buddy laps him on a 20 mile course. Go Dennis!

Go away Dennis…   Jibe ho, Cliff —  Cliff Coombs                        Voice (908) 527-2729  Fax (908) 355-5143

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NOT!  As a matter of fact, I rate Dennis dead last when compared to Melges, Cayard and Davis.  Buddy is by far the best I ever sailed against.  He is a genius and a gentleman.  I have the utmost respect for him and his team.  I just wish Bill Koch would take a step back, but I guess if I just spent 60 mil, I’d micro-manage too.  I think Bill Koch would offer his boat if he got beat, I not sure Dennis would if the roles were reversed.  To Dennis’s credit he has sailed an average boat very well, but this is his local water knowing where the shifts will be before you get there is a big advantage.  I also think he is sandbagging just like in ‘83.  His boat is not as slow as he’d like everyone to think it is.  Drop him in a scow in the great lakes .vs. Buddy and I say Buddy laps him on a 20 mile course.

Well, all I can say about this is that Big Dennis jumped into an Etchells in San Fran and won a world title the first time in the boat. While not as competitive as the Star (or Snipe) fleet, that is not a push over class, and is not limited to a few midwest lakes.  By the way, Sailing World had an interview with Big D a couple of months ago, and he has great respect for Buddy.  The only time they sailed together was on E-scows, and Big D had great time. As far as 83 goes, Cayard and Davis (and almost anyone else) would never have made it to 7 races against a faster boat NOT in their home waters. Like him or not as person, you have to respect his abilities, and hope he beats A3 and gets to use thier boat.                                         Brad Cote’

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Dennis is showing a lot more sailing skill than A^3; Koch has more money than skill and should just let Buddy drive. I hope the Comeback Kid does it again. On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land is out of the picture…

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On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land is out of the picture…

How do you mean sleazy? Like Dennis for example?                 Andrew N.

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On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land is out of the picture…

You’re damn right he’s out of the picture – he’s filed for both bankruptcy and divorce in the last couple of weeks.  I don’t think we’ll be seeing any AC challenges from him for a while….. Nick.

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On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land is out of the picture… How do you mean sleazy? Like Dennis for example?            Andrew N.

Now now Andrew, Bondy only broke the bank… not the rules! Besides, it wasn’t him that defaulted on the loan… it was his accountants! But it was interesting watching them try to give him the writs (?)! In all fairness, though… Dennis has done well considering his budget limitations and although I think that A3 will probably scrape in, it proves that the pioneer of multiple boat challenges can be wrong! Scamp Boy have I been busy today! — NZ TSSC Ltd, Wellington,  |  64 4 472-6947 (voice) 64 4 4736-840 (fax) –                            64 6 350-7004 (voice until April 23) "New Zealand, a country where we don’t complain about bow sprits!".

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| | On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land | is out of the picture… | Yeah. Now if (Sir, ha!) Michael "I’m gonna sue" Fay would either         a. fall overboard and drown         b. do the Alan Bond (ie. go broke and away)         c. piss off and just go away I’d be really happy. On a related note, my wife and I have taken to hissing furiously at the TV whenever ESPN grants credence to this slug by interviewing him or whenever NZ crosses the finish line (as opposed to having capsized.) The dog is rather taken by these actions. kevin "shut up michael, or we’ll bring out the catamaran" harris

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No, you don’t. You really don’t. Greg

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – | | On another note, I’m glad that sleazy Alan Bond from Kangaroo Land | is out of the picture… | Yeah. Now if (Sir, ha!) Michael "I’m gonna sue" Fay would either    a. fall overboard and drown    b. do the Alan Bond (ie. go broke and away)    c. piss off and just go away I’d be really happy. On a related note, my wife and I have taken to hissing furiously at the TV whenever ESPN grants credence to this slug by interviewing him or whenever NZ crosses the finish line (as opposed to having capsized.) The dog is rather taken by these actions. kevin "shut up michael, or we’ll bring out the catamaran" harris

Well, I was going to reply to this but then thought that it was not really worth it. But an interesting point is that if it wasn’t for Fay, there would be a lot of bored people sitting off San Deigo in pigs of boats which they call 12 metres! Scamp — NZ TSSC Ltd, Wellington,  |  64 4 472-6947 (voice) 64 4 4736-840 (fax) –                            64 6 350-7004 (voice until April 23) "New Zealand, a country where we don’t complain about bowsprits!".

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